runes Posted March 29, 2012 Share #1 Posted March 29, 2012 Advertisement (gone after registration) Hi y'all. I'm sorry if this has been covered before, but I can't find anything. A newcomer to this forum, but not a newcomer to photo. Started shooting with Nikon SLRs almost 30 years ago. Have owned and used F301, FE2, F2, F3, D40 and D7000. The last couple of years I've started buying a lot of old cameras and lenses (the nostalgic in me). Lots of cheap old cameras, but also a Hasselblad 500 c/m which I used quite a lot, and some LTM lenses which I've used on Russian rangefinders and on a Voigtländer Bessa R. The older I get the less interested I am in lugging around lots of heavy equipment, so when my wife are going on a one month holiday across Europe this summer I'm leaving the D7000 and all the other Nikon stuff back home. All I will be bringing are my Fuji X100 and the Bessa with a Summilux 5cm and a Voigtländer 15mm. Anyway, as I get older and older (no more than 40 now, but it's all downhill from here ) I suppose I will be using the bigger SLRs less, so I see an M9/M10/M11 in my distant future. No money now, but hopefully in a couple of years. I have pretty much all the Nikon lenses I will ever need, so the lenses I'm buying now have to be compatible with a future digtital M. So far I only have the the aforementioned lenses, and some russian cheapos. As much as I like the Bessa I'm thinking of buying a Leica camera to go with the lenses I already have, and the lenses I will be buying. The ones I have are all LTM's but with an adapter it's no problem using them on an M-mount camera. However before I buy any more lenses I think I will have to decide whether I should buy an M-mount or LTM-mount camera, and which to buy. I'm hoping for some help from all you people here on this forum - what camera should I buy and why? An M3 or an IIIf? Something different? I've read lots of web sites about this, but I'm still really unsure what to do. I don't want to spend more than max. ca. $1000/€700. What would you buy? And why? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted March 29, 2012 Posted March 29, 2012 Hi runes, Take a look here What's this? IIIc? IIIb? IIIf?. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
earleygallery Posted March 29, 2012 Share #2 Posted March 29, 2012 Hello and welcome! You'll find lots of information/advice on the various M camera options if you use the search option. Ask "which film M should I buy?" and you will get a string of responses which will include every M ever made and the Leica CL to boot! Personally I own an M2, as well as a lllf (screw mount). If you are intending to by a digital M at some point I would say it makes sense to buy an M rather than LTM camera body, although the LTM cameras are things of beauty. You have much more choice of new/er Leica lenses in M mount, as well as being able to use the screw lenses with an adapter. The choice of M comes down to which frame lines you want/need, whether you are bothered about having a built in meter or not, and your budget, which in your case will run to an M2 or M3 or M4 or M4-2 or M4-P. You might be lucky to find an M5 or M6 for that money. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
philipus Posted March 29, 2012 Share #3 Posted March 29, 2012 Welcome to the forum Rune! Nice to see a fellow Scandinavian here You'll find a lot of advice here from very experienced Leica users. It is a very nice forum. I completely agree with you regarding the weight-of-equipment issue; it is one of the reasons I left the SLR for RF. I (and my shoulders) couldn't be happier. Well the Bessa R has a very bright VF and a meter. So on that basis you need not buy an M, I would think. Given that you have a few LTM lenses, a Barnack could be the way to go. I bought a Leica II ('31) which I love because it is so incredibly small. I would have wanted a III to have the lower speeds but I have done surprisingly well with the II actually. The one little thing that affects its user-friendliness (but adds significantly to the charm of using it) is the separate VF and RF and the rather small VF. Still, if you like to take time when you're photographing a Barnack will certainly offer lots of pleasure. Naturally adapters are no problem at all on M cameras and I would expect that to be the case for future Ms too. I recently travelled for three weeks using two old "dogs", a Hektor 13,5cm and a Hektor 2,8cm on my M6TTL. Worked wonderfully well. If you do want to stick within the M system though you'll have to ask yourself if you want a metered or unmetered camera. The framelines question is relevant as well, of course, but for me the meter issue is more important. I began with an M3 and found it a pleasant challenge to gauge/guess exposure. In the end the camera broke and I replaced it with the M6TTL and I haven't regretted that decision one second because I get many more "keeper" pictures due to the meter. You might very well be much better at estimating exposure and in that case do seriously consider the M4 which, imho, is a more versatile camera than the M3 due to the 35-50-90 framelines. It is built as well as the M3 though the RF is apparently of a somewhat cheaper variety (other forum members can expand on that better than I can - I have understood, though, that the M3's system was quite advanced and costly to produce). If you want a metered camera, well in my opinion there's only the M6 or the dito TTL to consider. Any M5 and M7 user will likely say the same about those cameras There is sort of a design-related watershed between the M6 and the M6TTL in that their shutter speed dial turn in the opposite direction. On the M6TTL it turns the same way as the meter arrows in the VF and as the aperture ring on M mount lenses (my experience of LTM lenses is that their aperture rings turn the other way). For me, even though I began with an M3 which turns the like the M6, the M6TTL's approach is much more intuitive when adjusting speed and aperture while looking through the VF. It is a personal preference but it is useful to keep it in mind. A Barnack will fit easily within your budget. Ms will do so too, if you shop around a bit (including foto.no or fotosidan.se). There are many very good dealers in Europe. Personally I have found Italian and UK dealers to offer the best prices. Cheers Philip Ps. Don't forget about the CL which is also an excellent "M". Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
runes Posted March 29, 2012 Author Share #4 Posted March 29, 2012 Hi, and thanks for taking the the time to answer a noob like me. You'll find lots of information/advice on the various M camera options if you use the search option. Ask "which film M should I buy?" and you will get a string of responses which will include every M ever made and the Leica CL to boot! I'll try that. I reckoned there would be a lot of threads on that subject, but I couldn't find any, and didn't think of using the search function. Doh! Typical rookie mistake, I suppose. Well the Bessa R has a very bright VF and a meter. The reason I bought the Bessa R was the meter. I have an old russian Fed without a meter, and the camera is actually quite good, but sometimes it's nice to have a meter. I have to say that I've been getting quite good at guesstimating correct exposure when I'm OUTSIDE, and I'm rarely more than one stop off. As I mostly shoot B&W the one stop really isn't a problem. The problem is when I'm INSIDE where I sometimes totally miss. So even though a meter isn't a requisite, it is really nice to have. If you want a metered camera, well in my opinion there's only the M6 or the dito TTL to consider. Any M5 and M7 user will likely say the same about those cameras Don't forget about the CL which is also an excellent "M". I haven't found any M6's for less than $1000, and certainly not any M7's. M5's - I don't like their looks (I hope I didn't insult anyone). CL's - this is probably stupid, but I wan't a Leica built at the Leica factory in Germany. I guess I've talked myself from LTM to M-mount. But I'd like some more advise if anyone has some. BTW Philipus - I checked out your website, love your pictures. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
richam Posted March 29, 2012 Share #5 Posted March 29, 2012 The best "bargain" I found was the Canadian manufactured M4-2, which I bought for $700. It doesn't have the resale value of the German made cameras, but is really excellent. Mine did not need any service work; something to think about. A service could cost you $300 or more, if needed. I have collected a IIIf, M2, M3, M4-2, M6TTL, M7 and MP. The M4-2 is still the smoothest in operation, even though the first 3 have had professional service. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
luigi bertolotti Posted March 29, 2012 Share #6 Posted March 29, 2012 Welcome to the forum !!! Anyway, as I get older and older (no more than 40 now, but it's all downhill from here ) I am 55 and don't feel old !!! SO... given that you are so INSANE to feel old at 40... what you DESERVE is a Leica IIIc or f with Elmar 5cm.... apart that is a must (to start) for any Leica lover, it makes you understand what REALLY is old... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
runes Posted March 29, 2012 Author Share #7 Posted March 29, 2012 Advertisement (gone after registration) Hehe. When I hang out with some of my mid-twenty colleagues I feel kinda old, but when I hang out with other 40 year olds I realize that at least compared to them, I'm not old at all. Anyway, I've been tipped about a Leica IIIc with an Elmar 5cm for sale on a local auction with a low opening bid. I'm gonna put in a bid, so I might end with just the Leica I deserve. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
philipus Posted March 29, 2012 Share #8 Posted March 29, 2012 Thanks for looking at my site! It seems you're leaning towards an M6 then (though I also wish you luck at the auction). Good choice There's a private sale of an M6 on fotoapparatuur.nl for 700€. If you go meter-less it's easy to find sub-700€ deals. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
madNbad Posted March 31, 2012 Share #9 Posted March 31, 2012 An M6 is a great camera! It's a good transition from the SLR to a rangefinder mostly because it includes a meter. There are a ton of lenses out there and don't overlook the Voigtlanders. Best of luck on your search and welcome to the forum because if you have any questions they are answered here. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
runes Posted April 1, 2012 Author Share #10 Posted April 1, 2012 Well, I actually won the auction - a 1940 IIIc with 3,5cm Elmar, 5cm Elmar, original case, strap etc. All in what the seller described as "like new" condition. Haven't received it yet, but based on the pictures it looked really good. I didn't think I would win, so I'm a bit chocked now. I can't wait till the package arrives and I can start to have fun with the camera. Time will show if I will stick to this camera, or if I will feel the need for an M in addition. Will post some pictures as soon as it arrives. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
steed Posted April 1, 2012 Share #11 Posted April 1, 2012 The IIIf is terrific, and since it is newer than the c and b models, might have a longer service life depending upon how it was treated. I love mine, but should point out that the rangefinder window is a bit small, and the process of loading (which requires a trimming of the leader) is a small minus. On the other hand, the camera is a total delight, and depending upon your lens choice, produces superb results. For price to performance, go for the Summitar. Good luck! John W Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
runes Posted April 1, 2012 Author Share #12 Posted April 1, 2012 Hi John. In addition to the two Elmars I've also got a 1953 5cm Summicron (and not Summilux that I for some unknown reason wrote in the OP). Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
luigi bertolotti Posted April 2, 2012 Share #13 Posted April 2, 2012 Hi John. In addition to the two Elmars I've also got a 1953 5cm Summicron (and not Summilux that I for some unknown reason wrote in the OP). !! Surely a rectratable one... I'd bet it hasn't a perfect front glass... but is a nice to have item... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stefan2010 Posted April 2, 2012 Share #14 Posted April 2, 2012 Hi runes, congratulations to your IIIc with the lovely elmar 5,0 - good choice, now you have to try whether you love or hate it in regular use I also look back on decades of Nikon SLR use but since some years I do hardly everything with the old LTMs Lookiing forward for your first pictures Stefan (btw - latest Barnack Challenge has started yesterday ) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
runes Posted April 2, 2012 Author Share #15 Posted April 2, 2012 !! Surely a rectratable one... I'd bet it hasn't a perfect front glass... but is a nice to have item... Yes, it is a collapsible one. When I checked the serial number once more I realized that it is not a 1953, but a 1955. It has a next to perfect front lens. Will post pictures of the camera and all the lenses after Easter when I get back home. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
runes Posted April 2, 2012 Author Share #16 Posted April 2, 2012 Hi runes, congratulations to your IIIc with the lovely elmar 5,0 - good choice, now you have to try whether you love or hate it in regular use I also look back on decades of Nikon SLR use but since some years I do hardly everything with the old LTMs Lookiing forward for your first pictures Stefan (btw - latest Barnack Challenge has started yesterday ) Thank you. I'll spend Easter thinking of how to attack the theme "Body and soul". Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
luigi bertolotti Posted April 3, 2012 Share #17 Posted April 3, 2012 Yes, it is a collapsible one. When I checked the serial number once more I realized that it is not a 1953, but a 1955. It has a next to perfect front lens. Will post pictures of the camera and all the lenses after Easter when I get back home. Well, You have been lucky !!! The old Summicron has a front lens that is famous for its "softness" and items with front element unscratched and with clean coating are really uncommon and valuable. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jamesk8752 Posted April 3, 2012 Share #18 Posted April 3, 2012 Well, You have been lucky !!! The old Summicron has a front lens that is famous for its "softness" and items with front element unscratched and with clean coating are really uncommon and valuable. Yes indeed, unscratched ones are rare. I have two of these lenses and both had to go to John Van Stelten for recoating of the front element. They are fine now... Regards, Jim Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stefan2010 Posted April 4, 2012 Share #19 Posted April 4, 2012 Thank you. I'll spend Easter thinking of how to attack the theme "Body and soul". so do I ;-) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
octo Posted April 5, 2012 Share #20 Posted April 5, 2012 You might find theses links interesting: Leica M Guide LEICA Reviews I have no connection with them but I used to like browsing through them. Best regards. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.