Guest guy_mancuso Posted February 22, 2007 Share #21 Â Posted February 22, 2007 Advertisement (gone after registration) Sound like something new is coming Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted February 22, 2007 Posted February 22, 2007 Hi Guest guy_mancuso, Take a look here Noctilux Price Increase. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
kidigital Posted February 22, 2007 Share #22 Â Posted February 22, 2007 Wow ... as a low-light, fast lens lover, I'm glad I dug deep into my pockets to pick up both of these lenses several months ago. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
rami G Posted February 22, 2007 Share #23 Â Posted February 22, 2007 any chance for some help from the Japanese (VC)? I wonder if 50 f/1 is much more difficult to design than 35 f/1.2, which they already do... I just told my girlfriend yesterday I am planning to get rid of my 135 apo and to save for the noct. Now it seems that I can get rid of my 135 and get an IR filter and a hood for the noct... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
wparsonsgisnet Posted February 22, 2007 Share #24 Â Posted February 22, 2007 Do you know who is making the glass right now, Bill? or are them still using the old new stock from Midland? Â Simon, my understanding is that the glass is being made by the same, multiple parties. The price increase is not due to a new glass maker -- it is due to one piece of glass, a single element in the lens, the is manufactured in a process that requires a specific and now, very expensive gas. Â I don't think Leica has changed anything, either in the lens formula or the chain of suppliers. One lens element has skyrocketed in price. Â Pretty wild -- that one piece of glass costs more (to Leica) than the rest of the entire finished lens. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
marknorton Posted February 22, 2007 Share #25  Posted February 22, 2007 I just told my girlfriend yesterday I am planning to get rid of my 135 apo and to save for the noct  I'm sure she was fascinated... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
rami G Posted February 22, 2007 Share #26 Â Posted February 22, 2007 I'm sure she was fascinated... Â Actually, she is an artist and she uses my Leicas regularly... (I am sure that you are fascinated...) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eikonphoto Posted February 22, 2007 Share #27 Â Posted February 22, 2007 Advertisement (gone after registration) Actually, she is an artist and she uses my Leicas regularly... (I am sure that you are fascinated...) Â LOL ........ sorry but you walked into that one ...... Of course why would women be interested in such things. Luckily we have a sense of humor the few of us women that apparently own Leica's Karen Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
innerimager Posted February 22, 2007 Share #28 Â Posted February 22, 2007 as my friend said above, I'm really glad I went for both the nocti and the 75 lux used. Gem em' while their still available and not inflated guys and gals.....Peter Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
brunom Posted February 22, 2007 Share #29 Â Posted February 22, 2007 Sounds like my Canon 50mmf/1.2 was a REALLY good buy ! Â Bruno Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
LJL Posted February 23, 2007 Share #30  Posted February 23, 2007 Sounds like my Canon 50mmf/1.2 was a REALLY good buy ! Bruno  Yeah, and for the price of the new Nocti, you can get the Canon 50/1.2L and they will throw in a new 1DMkIII to use it on....  LJ Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
robsteve Posted February 23, 2007 Share #31  Posted February 23, 2007 Simon, my understanding is that the glass is being made by the same, multiple parties. The price increase is not due to a new glass maker -- it is due to one piece of glass, a single element in the lens, the is manufactured in a process that requires a specific and now, very expensive gas. I don't think Leica has changed anything, either in the lens formula or the chain of suppliers. One lens element has skyrocketed in price.  Pretty wild -- that one piece of glass costs more (to Leica) than the rest of the entire finished lens.  There was an article on the Noctilux glass a few years ago. From my memory it said something to the effect that the Noctilux Glass has a 1.92 defraction index compared to the average of 1.83 for the Nikon and Canon ED type glass. It was originally just made in the Leica Glass labs but now an equivalent Schott or Hoya glass type is available. This is where is gets interesting. At the time of the article, the Noctilux glass was 45 times more expensive to produce than the glass used in the Nikon ED or Canon L lenses. To smelter the Noctilux glass was a very specialized process requiring a 18month period to slowly cool it so it did not develop flaws. Perhaps it is cooled surrounded by one of the inert gasses like helium.  This artical may have been done by the Poplular Science Magazine in the 1970's or 1980's. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
sdai Posted February 23, 2007 Share #32 Â Posted February 23, 2007 I've just pulled out Erwin Puts' Leica Conpendium ... he only says the Nocti glass was made in Leica's glass lab for sometime (the one in Midland?) and Schott was unable to meet Leica's specification initially, but later the glass was replaced with those available from "regular" sources. Â Has anyone seriously compared the Canadian Noctilux to the ones made in Germany at a later stage? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ho_co Posted February 23, 2007 Share #33 Â Posted February 23, 2007 I just spoke with my dealer who said the cost increase is due to some rare gas that is used in the manufacture of one of the lens elements. The price of this gas has gone thru the roof. Bill-- Your dealer misunderstood: It's the "glass" used in that lens element, as you said above in http://www.leica-camera-user.com/digital-forum/17181-noctilux-price-increase-2.html#post180342. The dealer is the one with 'gas' problems. That one element was always more expensive to produce than the entire rest of the lens. Â Remember, Leica used to make that glass themselves; it is both the reason that the lens is so heavy and also the reason that they could replace an aspherical f/1.2 with a faster but spherical design. Â When they closed their glass lab, they became dependent on other suppliers. Â In my opinion, anyone speculating that Leica would like to discontinue that lens simply has no understanding of how very special it is, for its users and therefore for the company. The price change comes from the glass supplier. Glad that Bill was able to get that information. Â Robert is correct, it was an incredibly difficult glass to make and did have to be cooled over a period of 18 months to avoid striations forming. It has a very high refractive index with an anomalous partial dispersion. I doubt that any special 'gas' was needed, but it's probably the only such glass in civilian products. Â Simon--as you see, you posted just a minute before I did, so I had already written this even though it's a partial repeat of what you said. One thing--the Leica Glass Laboratory was at Wetzar, not Midland. Â There seems to be an assumption here that Leica makes plenty of a given product (lenses particularly) and then sells from stock for a long time. I think that is incorrect. I think Leica builds enough of an item to fill back-orders, then moves on to another item to fill its backorders, then to another, only rarely producing enough to sell from stock for more than a very short period of time. Â --HC Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
fjmcsu Posted February 23, 2007 Share #34 Â Posted February 23, 2007 As an aside, Tony has been a gem . I ordered a 75 Summilux from him that was in mint shape & coded. Then I found a Noctilux(new) on his website & ordered it. Unfortunately it was incorrectly listed on the web-site & he called me several times till he reached me to tell me of the mistrake. He then stated he had one coming in & would reserve it for me if I still wanted it & I just received it last week at the old price(perhaps before the increase went into effect).Finally I get in on a product BEFORE it goes up- a rarity in my camera buying experience ! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ddp Posted February 23, 2007 Share #35  Posted February 23, 2007 . Has anyone seriously compared the Canadian Noctilux to the ones made in Germany at a later stage?  I am almost positive that the Noctilux has remained a Canadian product up to this point. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
waterlenz Posted February 23, 2007 Share #36 Â Posted February 23, 2007 Two elements in a Noctilux 50/1 are made with the famous Noctilux glass (type 900403), which has a refractive index of 1.9005. These are the second element and the fifth, counting from the front. There are two elements of LaF21. Three elements are each made of a distinct type, LaK12, SF56, and SF10. If it is just one element that has gone up in price it must one these three and not the Noct glass, which probably ain't cheap either! Tom Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bono0272 Posted February 23, 2007 Share #37 Â Posted February 23, 2007 Is that the newest version Noct E60 with built-in hood? I bought mine at Sep last year which cost EURO 2000, but I know the price of the Noct is increasing here in Hong Kong, and it is currently out of stock. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
marknorton Posted February 23, 2007 Share #38 Â Posted February 23, 2007 On a slightly different scale, I remember reading that the third element from the front in a 50/1.4 ASPH costs more than all the other lens elements put together. Sounds like the Nocti is an even more extreme case - exotic materials doesn't begin to describe it. Â With that price increase, buying through the 30% discount scheme - if Leica will still honour it - is more like a 50% discount. Â Remember the first version of the lens price list which had the Nocti much higher than expected. Although it turned out to be a clerical error, it might havve slipped through the net by someone checking after talk of "a big Nocti price rise coming...". Â I bought new last year for $3030 and am glad I did. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
waterlenz Posted February 23, 2007 Share #39 Â Posted February 23, 2007 Is that the newest version Noct E60 with built-in hood? I bought mine at Sep last year which cost EURO 2000, but I know the price of the Noct is increasing here in Hong Kong, and it is currently out of stock. Â All the 50/1 Noctiluxes have the same lens formula - they differ by their 'nose'. Each of the four variants had a different lens shade, the last three all had 60mm filters. The most recent being the one you describe. Tom Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
wilfredo Posted February 23, 2007 Share #40 Â Posted February 23, 2007 Very tempting to go ahead and make the purchase. I guess it's either now or never, even a used one will go up through the roof after this increase. Â Wilfredo+ Benitez-Rivera Photography Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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