Can every M3's RF be adjusted to focus to 0.7m?

[philipus]

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I just wanted to verify something.

 

I read in this thread that it is possible to adjust the RF on an M3 so that it may focus down to 0.7m.

 

But can it be done on every M3?

 

I have a late-numbered M3 SS (11xxxxx) which is currently on its way for service.

 

Since I'd eventually like to buy the 50 Summilux Asph I was wondering if I should ask the shop to adjust the RF.

 

Thanks in advance

Philip

[smdavey]

cant you just ask the shop, where you are sending it?

 

would they not know?

 

maybe i am missing something

[UliWer]

I read the link to the other thread, though I don't really understand what could be the purpose of manipulating the camera as is described there.

 

Of course you can use a lens which focusses down to 70cm on any M3 - though the parallax adjustment will not work below one meter and most important: the rangefinder will not work.

 

If you "adjust" it to 70 cm, will parallax adjustment and the rangefinder control of sharpness both work in your M3 viewfinder?

 

Edit: I just tried a modern 50 Summcicron on my - not "adjusted" - M3: I can focus until 90cm, perhaps one or two centimetres further down. The link says, that manipulaiting it will enable you to focus closer than 1m, but not completely down to 70 cm. Perhaps the manipulation just does what the M3 normally can do.

[jaapv]

The reason Leica chose 1 m in the first place for the M3 was that that is the limit of acceptable accuracy, so even if you are able to give the roller arm some more movement (which is possible on some versions), you will not be able to focus very accurately. The fun way to get closer with a 50 mm lens is to purchase a dual-range Summicron 50, which is, btw, an excellent lens.

[JayC]

Youxin Ye was only able to get my m3 ds down to .8m

[Michael Geschlecht]

Hello philipus,

 

If you are worried about the image size which is 1 : 16 w/ a 50mm lens @ 1 meter you might try a 90mm lens @ 1 meter which gives you an image size of 1 : 6 as does a 135mm lens @ 1.5 meters.

 

Don't forget a 50mm lens @ 0.7meters only creates an image 1 : 11 life size. Ballpark half as large an image as what you get w/ 90 or 135 on the same M3.

 

No adjustment to M3 necessary & no question of accurate focus/framing. An M3 was designed for a 90mm lens & is no slouch w/ a 135 either.

 

Best Regards,

 

Michael

[philipus]

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I sometimes find the 1.0m limit to be restrictive when using the lens indoors, for instance at tables or close gatherings. That's why I would be interested in a shorter focusing distance. At the moment I am using a 'late' pre-asph Summilux in LTM mount which (as opposed to the bayonet mount version) has a 1m closest focusing distance.

 

Of course you can use a lens which focusses down to 70cm on any M3 - though the parallax adjustment will not work below one meter and most important: the rangefinder will not work. If you "adjust" it to 70 cm, will parallax adjustment and the rangefinder control of sharpness both work in your M3 viewfinder?

 

Though there are some differences of opinion in the thread, I had understood that the rangefinder would work and allow focusing to almost 0.7m. See Rolo's post; though conversely see also Lars Bergquist's post - - this is the source of my confusion.

 

Parallax adjustment would, however, not work.

 

I'd be really interested to know from someone who has had their M3 adjusted if the rangefinder allows focusing below 1m.

 

The reason Leica chose 1 m in the first place for the M3 was that that is the limit of acceptable accuracy, so even if you are able to give the roller arm some more movement (which is possible on some versions), you will not be able to focus very accurately. The fun way to get closer with a 50 mm lens is to purchase a dual-range Summicron 50, which is, btw, an excellent lens.

 

Thanks for suggesting the DR Summicron Jaap. I've understood it has excellent image quality. It doesn't have the extra stop though but I'm pretty steady on the hands so it might be an option if I want to keep the 50mm focal length instead of going 35mm with goggles.

 

Hello philipus,

 

If you are worried about the image size which is 1 : 16 w/ a 50mm lens @ 1 meter you might try a 90mm lens @ 1 meter which gives you an image size of 1 : 6 as does a 135mm lens @ 1.5 meters. Don't forget a 50mm lens @ 0.7meters only creates an image 1 : 11 life size. Ballpark half as large an image as what you get w/ 90 or 135 on the same M3. No adjustment to M3 necessary & no question of accurate focus/framing. An M3 was designed for a 90mm lens & is no slouch w/ a 135 either. Best Regards,

Michael

 

Thank you Michael. This is very helpful information. I'm not so much worried about the image size/magnification ratio in an image as about the ability to get closer in 'cramped' environments. Your suggestions are very good though and I like the out of the box thinking I have a 90mm Elmarit-M which I am very happy with.

 

Cheers and thanks to all

Philip

[jhild]

I have a couple of high numbered M3´s and have done that 0,7m adjustment by myself. It is very easy,

 

all that´s needed is a pair of pliers with a bend point. The parallax mechanism will not work at tha distance,

 

1 m is the limit for that.

 

Jo

[menos I M6]

I sometimes find the 1.0m limit to be restrictive when using the lens indoors, for instance at tables or close gatherings. That's why I would be interested in a shorter focusing distance. At the moment I am using a 'late' pre-asph Summilux in LTM mount which (as opposed to the bayonet mount version) has a 1m closest focusing distance.

 

 

 

Though there are some differences of opinion in the thread, I had understood that the rangefinder would work and allow focusing to almost 0.7m. See Rolo's post; though conversely see also Lars Bergquist's post - - this is the source of my confusion.

 

Parallax adjustment would, however, not work.

 

I'd be really interested to know from someone who has had their M3 adjusted if the rangefinder allows focusing below 1m.

 

 

 

Thanks for suggesting the DR Summicron Jaap. I've understood it has excellent image quality. It doesn't have the extra stop though but I'm pretty steady on the hands so it might be an option if I want to keep the 50mm focal length instead of going 35mm with goggles.

 

 

 

Thank you Michael. This is very helpful information. I'm not so much worried about the image size/magnification ratio in an image as about the ability to get closer in 'cramped' environments. Your suggestions are very good though and I like the out of the box thinking I have a 90mm Elmarit-M which I am very happy with.

 

Cheers and thanks to all

Philip

 

If you are interested in a fast 50mm for close up, the Nikkor-S.C 5cm f1.4 is just a much nicer lens than the later Leitz 50 Summicron DR.

These Nikkors are harder to find by the day though :-(

 

Why is it the nicer lens?

It focusses down to 0.45 (coupled with Leica M without modification to ~0.8m, down to ~0.65 with modification, without modification and RF coupling always down to 0.45m).

It has another stop of light (soft and dreamy, but already rather contrasty and nice colors for this vintage, while fine detail is all there!

It has a classic infinity lock, which I rather like, to focus quickly.

The Nikkor infinity lock is curiously the most smooth and well machined, I have found in operation so far - better than Leitz made ones!

It has a small intent at ~0.95m, one can feel, when focussing closer, which is nice to have for pre focussing and NOT wanting, to end up @ 0.45.

Focussing @ 0.45 is easy even without RF coupling, as with the digital M finders (0.68x), the focus sits just right, when the two coinciding images from finder and RF patch are exactly at the edges of the RF patch!

 

Whats different?

The aperture ring works to the opposite side than Leica lenses, which needs some brain gymnastics at first.

It has a 43mm filter thread, which is not easy to find accessories for (I found a nice reverse conical lens hood, which is enough for me).

It is a Sonnar design, meaning, it has to be set up for a certain optimal subject distance and aperture and will shift focus at further away subjects.

I have optimized mine for shooting wide open from close up to 10m spot on and loosing definition towards infinity wide open.

It will work fine at infinity from f2.8 on, getting fantastic @ f5.6 - f8.

I am not a landscaping guy, so that's absolutely fine with me.

One can set this lens without issues, to have perfect definition @ infinity though, loosing close focus performance - ask your lens guru of preference.

The Sonnar design also gives a very different rendering wide open for backgrounds from the Leitz double gauss designs.

I really love the Nikkor for portraits in dimmed light with backlights - you get these beautiful perfectly round discs, while having a slightly soft, dreamy portrait.

 

I loooooove my Nikkor and won't give it away (there is a saying, that one should never sell a Nikkor-S.C 5cm, be it the f1.4 or f2).

[iliahi]

The 90mm mem with closeup accessory will allow equal macro shots as the later Ms.