jaapv Posted July 18, 2011 Share #341 Posted July 18, 2011 Advertisement (gone after registration) Actually, it was not done by Mercedes engineers originally, the car was found to fail by a Swedish car journal. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted July 18, 2011 Posted July 18, 2011 Hi jaapv, Take a look here My M9 is eating SD cards [MERGED}. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
dwbell Posted July 18, 2011 Share #342 Posted July 18, 2011 Yep, quite true. Back on topic, if you, and many others were to do the video test, and have the same results - then we could assume that actually, thousands of people do in fact have a problem they just haven't found out yet. Then, irrespective of whether we think it's Leica's fault or not, we can advise a certain course of behaviour to all users to avoid getting into that situation. And to get back to your topic, if that were the case then sending it to Leica now wouldn't fix it as it would require a firmware update I would imagine. Plus, assembling that wealth of information on line, with the users, would help identify the problem and directly help Leica in fixing it. So all in all I'm suggesting it is very worth discussing it here. Also that suggesting "mine's fine" neither helps nor hinders the process, it's just a waste of time. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
250swb Posted July 18, 2011 Share #343 Posted July 18, 2011 The few who's don't function as advertised are in here trying to fix it. How is it useful to have users in these threads pipe up with "mine's fine"? That is just ridiculous unless you are ignoring all the times people say 'mines fine, this is how I make sure its fine, this is what works for me'. It would be worthless if people just contradicted you, but to ignore what makes the camera work properly just because you feel the answer to your problem must be found in obscure convoluted solutions is wasting everybody's time. You should be asking everybody who doesn't have a problem what is it that they are doing and you aren't, not trying to ban them from telling you. Steve Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
dwbell Posted July 18, 2011 Share #344 Posted July 18, 2011 Steve, you're not reading my posts properly. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
steelduck Posted July 18, 2011 Share #345 Posted July 18, 2011 If I only have a couple of pictures in the buffer and press play there isn't a problem. Its happened once, I recognised the problem, saw what I'd done, and didn't do it again. There needs to come a point where instead of blaming Leica the users should just stop banging their heads against the wall, if you know how to lock the camera up, why continue to do it? Steve I have had the same freezing of the camera with out pressing the play several time. Just while taking pictures. The camera just dies and the red light blinks... and then the end result is the same as in my video... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaapv Posted July 18, 2011 Share #346 Posted July 18, 2011 So - that is not normal M9 behaviour and should be fixed. Nothing to do with a general bug in the firmware etc. (although, come to think of it, did you try reinstalling the firmware?) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
dwbell Posted July 18, 2011 Share #347 Posted July 18, 2011 Advertisement (gone after registration) I just did re-install the firmware as Leica's CS suggestion. Do you not see any value in say; - taking one shot, then immediately play - taking two shots, then immediately play - taking three shots .... etc. At which point do suspect cameras freeze? Do they all freeze at the same point? What behaviour does a "perfect" M9 exhibit? etc. I'm a bit lost why people can't see the benefit's of this. Jaapv, you've not done the stress test so don't know how your camera will respond. I may have inadvertently done that test during the wedding. If I knew before my trip that all M9's will freeze if you take say 8 consecutive shots and then immediately press play, I can avoid doing that. If I know it's ok to do it after 4 then that's more knowledge I can use during my shooting. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
250swb Posted July 18, 2011 Share #348 Posted July 18, 2011 I have had the same freezing of the camera with out pressing the play several time. Just while taking pictures. The camera just dies and the red light blinks... and then the end result is the same as in my video... But the ability for the camera to lock up, or very occasionally miss a shot, is a known characteristic even with a healthy camera. It is confusing the matter if a faulty camera exhibits similar characteristics. With all the recent posts mentioning card size, FAT 32, etc it is worth thinking that if the simple things work for the vast majority of users, whatever is left is a faulty camera if all simple solutions have been exhausted. Anything beyond that is down to re-writing the Firmware. So its not a problem that can be solved by formatting in a FAT32 environment etc, saying its problem is an 8gb card and not a 4gb card etc. if the vast majority of people have never needed to think about those sorts of things. Steve Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaapv Posted July 18, 2011 Share #349 Posted July 18, 2011 I did replicate this this behaviour, you may recall. If Leica is wise they will make review during buffer writing impossible with the next firmware. I have a camera for taking photographs, not for stress testing as you call it. To use one of the hated car analogies. If I have a car that jumps out of gear during driving it is broken and should be repaired. If I pull it into reverse on the autobahn just because I can do that and strip the gearbox that has nothing to do with a fault of the car. I have very grave doubts about a firmware solution when I read posts by users that have 350.000 actuations without any problem. I would rather suspect an electronic component out of spec on some cameras. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
dwbell Posted July 18, 2011 Share #350 Posted July 18, 2011 But the ability for the camera to lock up, or very occasionally miss a shot, is a known characteristic even with a healthy cameraSteve Jaapv disagrees with this statement and has already said so. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
dwbell Posted July 18, 2011 Share #351 Posted July 18, 2011 I did replicate this this behaviour, you may recall. If Leica is wise they will make review during buffer writing impossible with the next firmware. I have a camera for taking photographs, not for stress testing as you call it. To use one of the hated car analogies. If I have a car that jumps out of gear during driving it is broken and should be repaired. If I pull it into reverse on the autobahn just because I can do that and strip the gearbox that has nothing to do with a fault of the car. Yes, useless analogy I agree. Just to remind you. I've been using my camera "to take pictures" for 10 months. Then, one day it seems I may have entered this stress test area the camera can't handle and it crashed, badly. I would like to understand when and how this happens a) to avoid it in future to pass on to Leica and c) to advise other users of the situation. Slightly patronising "I use the camera to take pictures" is neither here nor there. I would completely support the disabling of the preview button during writing above a certain amount of data. That's a fix. But you're convinced, according to your earlier posts that the people who have problems have faulty cameras right? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaapv Posted July 18, 2011 Share #352 Posted July 18, 2011 If there are many cameras around that do not exhibit this problem -and there are- one can postulate that there is either something wrong with the cameras that do not lose images or that there is something wrong with the cameras that do lose images. What do you think? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
dwbell Posted July 18, 2011 Share #353 Posted July 18, 2011 I don't much care either way. I can test my camera, others can test theirs. If there's an overwhelming majority either way we can label one as "right" and alternate behaviour as "wrong". Even between you and Steve you can't agree whether "an occasional lock-up" is normal, yet attempts at deeper analysis draw derision and patronising comments. I find it strange and a little disappointing. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaapv Posted July 18, 2011 Share #354 Posted July 18, 2011 I see little point in "deeper analysis"as you call it. Insight will come from Leica fixing the broken cameras and holds no interest for the user. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
dwbell Posted July 18, 2011 Share #355 Posted July 18, 2011 But again you have assigned some camera's "broken", and implicitly some not. But you don't have the criteria to determine that, do you? For Steve an occasional freeze or lost shot is not broken. For you that is broken. Let's call answering the above contradiction "shallow analysis" shall we and start there? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaapv Posted July 18, 2011 Share #356 Posted July 18, 2011 Feel free - for me I will send my camera in for repair if it should exhibit this behaviour. I don't need any other criterium than a camera that does not save the shot I have taken. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
dwbell Posted July 18, 2011 Share #357 Posted July 18, 2011 I did replicate this this behaviour, you may recall. I don't recall, what happened? Did you send it to Solms? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaapv Posted July 18, 2011 Share #358 Posted July 18, 2011 No - because I "tortured" it into not writing DNGs, in a way that ran contrary to normal usage. I have never yet lost a shot by not writing by the camera. I once had a card die and start writing 0Kb DNGs. Then I solved it by throwing the card into the dustbin. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
dwbell Posted July 18, 2011 Share #359 Posted July 18, 2011 No - because I "tortured" it into not writing DNGs, in a way that ran contrary to normal usage. I have never yet lost a shot by not writing by the camera. I once had a card die and start writing 0Kb DNGs. Then I solved it by throwing the card into the dustbin. Ok, thanks. How did you "torture" it as such? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaapv Posted July 18, 2011 Share #360 Posted July 18, 2011 Shot the buffer full of DNG + JPG fine, hit "play" and as soon as an image appeared switched off the camera. In that situation it stopped writing the DNGs, it did finish the JPGs, however. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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