Posto 6 Posted June 22, 2011 Share #1 Posted June 22, 2011 Advertisement (gone after registration) Having had the chance to use an M8 and M9 side by side with my DMR, I have finally decided to take advantage of the current market prices to unload my remaining M gear, particularly the lenses (24 Elmarit, 90 Summicron, 35 Summilux, 50 Summilux, as well as assorted bodies). While the M9 is a good camera, it feels too constrained and limited, especially when compared to the R9/DMR combo with it's superb lens collection. I will probably keep my M6J and possibly one of my M3's for sentimental reasons, but cannot realistically see the value of tying up significant equity in what is essentially a highly constrained format which is unable to offer comparable photographic potential to 35mm equivalent rivals. In addition, the breadth and quality of the R-range glass (with a few exceptions in some of the limited focal lengths used by the M) completely overshadows that of the M series- even more so when one also takes account of prices. Although I will no doubt be viewed as a heretic, and as a candidate for burning at the proverbial stake, I find it rather sad and irritating that Leica have pushed all their 35mm clients within the narrow constraints of the M enclosure as a result of their own digital inadequacies and failings. I for one, definitely resent this, and a closer analysis of the long-term viability of Leica's 35mm offerings will show an unhealthy dependence on the Far East fashionista market, as well as a residual backup of retirement-age Baby-boomers in their more mature markets. Irrespective of the (transient and possibly unsustainable) level of current M9/M9P sales, this cannot be viewed as a healthy platform for expansion. I have already sold some of my equipment this month (and more over the past months, including my Noctilux) on the Bay, and will reinvest the proceeds in my R collection. I wish Leica good luck in the future, and hope to be able to buy further interesting products from them that are less theocratically ordained and ossified than the current M offerings. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted June 22, 2011 Posted June 22, 2011 Hi Posto 6, Take a look here GETTING RID OF MY M GEAR, STILL ADDING TO MY R COLLECTION. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
virgilstarkwell Posted June 22, 2011 Share #2 Posted June 22, 2011 "Although I will no doubt be viewed as a heretic, and as a candidate for burning at the proverbial stake...." i think you might be slightly misguided about the extent to which people care about what equipment you use. as for me, i enjoy photography. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
DES Posted June 22, 2011 Share #3 Posted June 22, 2011 Oh Dear!!.. The introduction of the M9P has upset you this much;) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stealth3kpl Posted June 22, 2011 Share #4 Posted June 22, 2011 Horses for courses. When hiking into the wilderness with a full pack I appreciate being able to get a 35mm camera and 3 or 4 world class lenses in the top pocket of my sac. I'm happy to forfeit macro and ultra teles for that. I know where you're coming from though. Pete Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeicaPassion Posted June 22, 2011 Share #5 Posted June 22, 2011 I've been switching from R to M. I no longer want to be a pack horse lugging a heavy backpack with long glass. A M9 and 2 or 3 lenses are a delight. Each to their own. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rupert Greenwell Posted June 22, 2011 Share #6 Posted June 22, 2011 I have just done the complete opposite! I have used extensively R gear in the past two years (R6.2, 7 & 9, plus the classic lenses) but the results from my M6,MP & M7 have pleased me more, I thought at first that the R would be more versatile and I took advantage of the lenses being less dear but after a lot of thought I decided to sell. I nearly kept the R6.2 and 50 lens but as I had a M6 0.85 there was no need. I find the lightness of the M helps in getting the camera to my eye faster, my hands are suffering from wear and tear and I found the R too heavy for me. I might in the future go for a M9 having handled one at a open day recently but I would have to let my M7 go. I wish you all the best with the R . Regards Rupert Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
rsh Posted June 22, 2011 Share #7 Posted June 22, 2011 Advertisement (gone after registration) It would be wise to keep both systems if you can. Each has a purpose and they compliment one another. If you cannot afford both, well then, you must make the decision that is right for you. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
james.liam Posted June 22, 2011 Share #8 Posted June 22, 2011 I have just done the complete opposite! I have used extensively R gear in the past two years (R6.2, 7 & 9, plus the classic lenses) but the results from my M6,MP & M7 have pleased me more, I thought at first that the R would be more versatile and I took advantage of the lenses being less dear but after a lot of thought I decided to sell. I nearly kept the R6.2 and 50 lens but as I had a M6 0.85 there was no need. I find the lightness of the M helps in getting the camera to my eye faster, my hands are suffering from wear and tear and I found the R too heavy for me. I might in the future go for a M9 having handled one at a open day recently but I would have to let my M7 go. I wish you all the best with the R . Regards Rupert It's a shame you didn't meet 'Posto' sooner, you could have swapped systems. Why does everyone get so bent out of shape about others whose preference doesn't sync with theirs? Horses for courses, as someone else said above. For every RF aficionado, there are others who've tried and couldn't quite get the knack of it. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteveYork Posted June 23, 2011 Share #9 Posted June 23, 2011 I've been thinking about unloading some of my M stuff too. I've been using more R stuff this year. I've even used some old Zeiss stuff. But then I tend to go in cycles. I get bored easy. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
leicanet Posted June 23, 2011 Share #10 Posted June 23, 2011 It would be wise to keep both systems if you can. Each has a purpose and they compliment one another. If you cannot afford both, well then, you must make the decision that is right for you. I too have been a pretty long time M user only but I have recently been using some top Leica R glass (80/1.4 'Lux, APO 90/2 ASPH, APO 100/2.8 Macro, APO 180/2.8) on a Canon 5D mk II and I must say I am very impressed. I feel good than I can keep and use both...;-))) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
hoppyman Posted June 24, 2011 Share #11 Posted June 24, 2011 "Heretic, narrow constraints, sad and irritating, inadequacies and failings, unhealthy dependence on the Far East fashionista market, theocratically ordained and ossified" Oh dear M's have been good at the same things and not designed for others for fifty years or so. Lots of Leica users here that enjoy the discontinued R system. Have fun and enjoy what that very rare DMR can provide too. Even better if you can share some results here. . Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
spylaw4 Posted June 24, 2011 Share #12 Posted June 24, 2011 And what happens when you can no longer get your beloved DMR(s) repaired? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pop Posted June 24, 2011 Share #13 Posted June 24, 2011 Having had the chance to use an M8 and M9 side by side with my DMR, I have finally decided to take advantage of the current market prices to unload my remaining M gear, particularly the lenses (24 Elmarit, 90 Summicron, 35 Summilux, 50 Summilux, as well as assorted bodies). While the M9 is a good camera, it feels too constrained and limited, especially when compared to the R9/DMR combo with it's superb lens collection. I will probably keep my M6J and possibly one of my M3's for sentimental reasons, but cannot realistically see the value of tying up significant equity in what is essentially a highly constrained format which is unable to offer comparable photographic potential to 35mm equivalent rivals. In addition, the breadth and quality of the R-range glass (with a few exceptions in some of the limited focal lengths used by the M) completely overshadows that of the M series- even more so when one also takes account of prices. Although I will no doubt be viewed as a heretic, and as a candidate for burning at the proverbial stake, I find it rather sad and irritating that Leica have pushed all their 35mm clients within the narrow constraints of the M enclosure as a result of their own digital inadequacies and failings. I for one, definitely resent this, and a closer analysis of the long-term viability of Leica's 35mm offerings will show an unhealthy dependence on the Far East fashionista market, as well as a residual backup of retirement-age Baby-boomers in their more mature markets. Irrespective of the (transient and possibly unsustainable) level of current M9/M9P sales, this cannot be viewed as a healthy platform for expansion. I have already sold some of my equipment this month (and more over the past months, including my Noctilux) on the Bay, and will reinvest the proceeds in my R collection. I wish Leica good luck in the future, and hope to be able to buy further interesting products from them that are less theocratically ordained and ossified than the current M offerings. Yes. Fine. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
leicanut2 Posted June 24, 2011 Share #14 Posted June 24, 2011 I have just sold my last R lens and all my M lenses down to a M9 with 50 Lux and I find my self thinking of selling those as well. But will wait for Photokina before I decide, rumors of something new from Leica with auto focus, may be just what the doctor ordered, great for these old eyes. Jan Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
mmradman Posted June 24, 2011 Share #15 Posted June 24, 2011 And what happens when you can no longer get your beloved DMR(s) repaired? As long as DMR survives past Photokina 2012 get new =>APS-C mirrorless Leica. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guido Posted June 24, 2011 Share #16 Posted June 24, 2011 And what happens when you can no longer get your beloved DMR(s) repaired? You try to do it yourself. See here, here, and here Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Posto 6 Posted June 24, 2011 Author Share #17 Posted June 24, 2011 I am certain that the DMR PCBs are repairable, and will keep everyone posted on developments. I tried sending the DMR to Leica, but they were rather uncollaborative about providing the necessary information about dismantling the DMR for me to try sending the PCB for repairs in the US specialists in spite of admitting that they were unable to repair it themselves. Their somewhat disoriented letter to me was as follows: Dear Mr Posto 6 We regret to inform you that the electronic of your DMR is defektive and can not be repaired. Please understand that we are not allowed to disconnect the cicuit board and ship it seperately or to release any instructions in regards to the repair or dissassembly of our products. We apologize for any inconvenience. Kind regards Leica Customer Service I will be in touch next week, and hopefully someone a bit more enlightened will be able to help me.I do also trust that I will receive a reply to my e-mail to Mr. Schopf as well at some stage.... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
hoppyman Posted June 25, 2011 Share #18 Posted June 25, 2011 I think that you are being very tough on Customer Service there. Others who have visited Customer Service in Solms will also be able to confirm the large efforts that Solms has made to try to keep the discontinued R cameras and the limited run of a few thousand DMR working for customers, including cannabilisation for some years. The history of the DMR is pretty well covered in this Forum I think. Most importantly Imacon are now a direct competitor and this is old technology in electronic terms now too of course. None of this is new. They just can't get parts nor fix it for you. Have you paid them for any servicing on the item? Most likely their initial assessment would not have involved disassembly, as that would be at some cost for no return when the PCB is faulty and there just are no more of them. I would expect that they would have returned the complete DMR to you at no charge? If they provide you with their commercial property in the form of their technical documentation, are they then liable if you damage it or hurt yourself but insist that you only did what their procedures say?? If you did pay for disassembly and shipping back to you, then had someone else diagnose and repair the PCB, it would be unreasonable to expect Leica Camera to then reassemble it with unknown third party modifications to the PCB and reassemble/test and guarantee any work (which they would need to do if they are charging you). Anyone else holding one would be appreciative, I'm sure, if you can have it successfully repaired elswhere and report in here afterwards. Some users have been trying to buy units as spares or parts for some years too. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pico Posted June 25, 2011 Share #19 Posted June 25, 2011 Having had the chance to use an M8 and M9 side by side with my DMR, I have finally decided to take advantage of the current market prices to unload my remaining M gear [....] Good. Perhaps we can create a new topic called M-Exptriates so it is easier to filter you people out. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
wildlightphoto Posted June 25, 2011 Share #20 Posted June 25, 2011 And what happens when you can no longer get your beloved DMR(s) repaired? We downgrade to CaNikon. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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