kivis Posted January 28, 2011 Share #1 Posted January 28, 2011 Advertisement (gone after registration) I admit I have owned and tried a lot of cameras (no regrets) but never could understand using a meterless camera. It was like why? Then I picked up a Yashica YF (which I will soon be selling). No meter. I ran 4 or 5 rolls through it and could not believe how much I was thinking through exposure; apertures, shutter speed and using ISO speed as a exposure shift regime. What an eye opener. All these years I was trusting the camera meter to make the decisions (yes even an M6 makes decisions for you). I found myself really thinking exposure and it was awesome. So....I got an M3 and of course it is more of the same only better (hence the forthcoming sale of the YF). So here I am, a photog buff of 35 years (started out with a Nikkormat FTN (still have it)) and I am learning the part of photography I pretty much skipped because I grew up on internal camera meters. Life is good and oh so unpredictable. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted January 28, 2011 Posted January 28, 2011 Hi kivis, Take a look here The M3 - now I am really learning photography. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
plasticman Posted January 28, 2011 Share #2 Posted January 28, 2011 Great story. I recently bought a Hasselblad and found that my understanding of light and exposure grew a thousandfold. I can't claim to be able to go meterless, as you've done - but even using an external meter and thinking in terms of EV instead of following the dictates of small red LEDs in the finder has increased my awareness of what I'm doing, and made the whole process more concentrated (and enjoyable). Partly the reason why I'm now contemplating an M2. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xmas Posted January 28, 2011 Share #3 Posted January 28, 2011 I admit I have owned and tried a lot of cameras (no regrets) but never could understand using a meterless camera. It was like why? Then I picked up a Yashica YF (which I will soon be selling). No meter. I ran 4 or 5 rolls through it and could not believe how much I was thinking through exposure; apertures, shutter speed and using ISO speed as a exposure shift regime. What an eye opener. All these years I was trusting the camera meter to make the decisions (yes even an M6 makes decisions for you). I found myself really thinking exposure and it was awesome. So....I got an M3 and of course it is more of the same only better (hence the forthcoming sale of the YF). So here I am, a photog buff of 35 years (started out with a Nikkormat FTN (still have it)) and I am learning the part of photography I pretty much skipped because I grew up on internal camera meters. Life is good and oh so unpredictable. Hi A YF is a nice camera. Noel Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest nafpie Posted January 28, 2011 Share #4 Posted January 28, 2011 Great to read your story. Thanks. yes even an M6 makes decisions for you Really? I think the M6 makes a suggestion rather than a decision. The M6 is the better M3. The M3 is the nicer M6. Stefan Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
a.noctilux Posted January 28, 2011 Share #5 Posted January 28, 2011 Hello, Last year, like you I discovered "freedom of photography". I have bought my first Leica LTM, a "Standard of 1934" with Elmar 5cm of same period. For the first time I went out with an Expomat ( Exposure-Mat - Free Light Meter ), and had learned with Fred Parker his "exposure approch" ( Ultimate Exposure Computer ) along with my "new Standard". With no need of battery, LED, LCD screen, etc. Revelation of freedom from this experience for me and I know that if a photo is "not good enough, I had not use my brain enough". Arnaud Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xmas Posted January 28, 2011 Share #6 Posted January 28, 2011 Great to read your story. Thanks. Really? I think the M6 makes a suggestion rather than a decision. The M6 is the better M3. The M3 is the nicer M6. Stefan Hi Stefan Correct a suggestion, but for many people it is a compellng suggestion and they dont push the button but e.g. reach for the aperture ring It is liie Frodo and the Lord of the rings. Gollum Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest nafpie Posted January 28, 2011 Share #7 Posted January 28, 2011 Advertisement (gone after registration) Gollum, Correct a suggestion, but for many people it is a compelling suggestion and they dont push the button but e.g. reach for the aperture ring With the M3, they have to push the button on the light meter. Big deal. However, even if you remove the batteries of the M6, it is a better M3*. Stefan --- * except if you use 'only' 50mm lenses and longer Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xmas Posted January 28, 2011 Share #8 Posted January 28, 2011 Gollum, With the M3, they have to push the button on the light meter. Big deal. However, even if you remove the batteries of the M6, it is a better M3*. Stefan --- * except if you use 'only' 50mm lenses and longer Hi Stefan You can get a 0.85 M6, but the frame lines are cluttered. The M6 finder rangefinder spot can flare, M3 wont. Adjusting the ranefinder in the field easy with M3 not with M6. The back, and top plates of a M6 are Zinc, they can go flakey... The gears of a M6 steel - it can accept the winders and lever bases though. I dont need to remove the battery cause I carry the camera with the first pressure released it goes flat in a few days. I have checked my Weston III, it does not have a button. Not everyone is compelled by the displays only the weak willed like me... I mss shots... Noel. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrism Posted January 28, 2011 Share #9 Posted January 28, 2011 My first real camera had no meter (if I am allowed to call a Practika "real" on a Leica forum!), and it soon meant that I spent a little more pocket money on a Leningrad 4 selenium meter. You can tell what kind of a budget I was on in the early 70's. I think the cost of each photograph concentrated my mind more than any difficulty metering. I think this is still one of the major differences between film and digital. "Pressing that button has a calculable cost - are you sure you have everything right?" is the question that I still ask myself when shooting film, even though the cost is small and my budget is a bit more generous than it was 40 years ago. Chris Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest nafpie Posted January 28, 2011 Share #10 Posted January 28, 2011 Noel > You can get a 0.85 M6, but the frame lines are cluttered. Never had any problems with that. > The M6 finder rangefinder spot can flare, M3 wont. Never had any problems with that, too. > Adjusting the ranefinder in the field easy with M3 not with M6. Never need that. > The back, and top plates of a M6 are Zinc, they can go flakey... May be, but not with my M6. > I dont need to remove the battery cause I carry the camera with the first pressure > released it goes flat in a few days. My batteries are good for years. > I have checked my Weston III, it does not have a button. With a M6, you don't have to remove the camera from your eye to meter the light. Anyway, the M3 is a great camera. Stefan Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
thomasw_ Posted January 29, 2011 Share #11 Posted January 29, 2011 I had terrible flare with my m6, especially in low light situations. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Austinite Posted January 30, 2011 Share #12 Posted January 30, 2011 Get to understand EV. EV15 is a very bright day. I shoot Tri-x at F11 1/250 in this light. EV 12. Overcast I use F8 125. Get to know the film and what you want to do. Sunny days I'll shoot Tri-x at 200 to keep the shadows open. Clouds I'll increase the ISO to 400. Actually ISO is not as important as knowing what ap/shutterspeed you are going to use in what kind of conditions. Get it down and it's all you really need to know. My Rolleicord VB locks the shutter/aperture together and lets you set the EV and maintain the right combo. Makes it easy to learn. Automated cameras have taken this knowledge away from photographers. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
kivis Posted January 31, 2011 Author Share #13 Posted January 31, 2011 Yes I could have taken out the batteries on my M6. But I believe the M3 is so butter smooth. I guess each to his own. But I am finally starting to anticipate readings before pointing the light meter. They say HCB could successfully "call the shot" correct every time. Was it true? And the real kick is I getting some pretty nice shots. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
giordano Posted January 31, 2011 Share #14 Posted January 31, 2011 They say HCB could successfully "call the shot" correct every time. Was it true? Not every time, no. There are stories of his getting the exposure badly wrong, the shot only being retrieved by painstaking darkroom work by other people. Travelling in Asia in the late 40s he carried two Leicas (with 35, 50 and 135mm lenses) a Makina or Super Ikonta (editors insisted on colour so he reluctantly shot it, but few of them in those days thought 35mm colour was good enough) and two exposure meters (obviously less important for b&w). (Henri Cartier-Bresson: The Modern Century p.15) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
kivis Posted February 18, 2011 Author Share #15 Posted February 18, 2011 I am hitting exposure about 60% of the time. Will I get better in time? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
NZDavid Posted February 18, 2011 Share #16 Posted February 18, 2011 You soon get the hang of the f/16 (or more often f/11) rule: 1/125 and f/11 bright sky, f/8 semi overcast, and so on, but metering is still helpful to fine tune your exposures, with either M6 or M3. A Sekonic 308b is ideal, being compact, easy to use, and accurate. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
too old to care Posted February 18, 2011 Share #17 Posted February 18, 2011 I decided to drag out my old 330F and discovered that my Sekonic Micro-Leader meter was dead. I looked on Ebay for a new meter and picked up a nice Gossen Luna Pro for next to nothing. Rule f16 works great for b&w, but I do not trust my judgement with color, thus the need for another meter. I would consider adding a light meter to anyone's setup, just in case. Wayne Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xmas Posted February 18, 2011 Share #18 Posted February 18, 2011 I am hitting exposure about 60% of the time. Will I get better in time? well dependent on what you mean both HCB and I can do worse... You might like to stick the inside of a film cardboard box to the back door of the M. If this memo does not help reduce the development time, and increase the exposure, this assumes you are not wet printing... Or mix up a low contrast dev like D-23... If you get a meter they are only light meters they are not exposure meters, the device between your ears is the exposure meter. If you are street shooting it is easiest to use XP2 or the Fuji C41 monochrome equivalent, but you will need to scan & post process any mistakes to salvage nice prints. If you are taking senics and wanting for foreground human interest to wander through your shot you need a Weston meter invercone and books on zone system, you dont need to memorise the books, just understand what zone 1 is and what contrast range you film has... Ansell Adams took nice senics. Noel Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
kdemas Posted February 19, 2011 Share #19 Posted February 19, 2011 One important factor when training yourself is to start with a single film speed. It will help you to increase that accuracy fairly quickly. Enjoy! I am hitting exposure about 60% of the time. Will I get better in time? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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