colorflow Posted January 2, 2007 Share #1 Posted January 2, 2007 Advertisement (gone after registration) Hello everyone. I am new to this forum, so pardon me if I ask dumb questions. I recently took my M6 with 21mm Elmarit and 35mm Lux with me on a tour of Cathedrals in Italy. Used Fuji 400asa print film. The results were so bad as shown in attached sample. They are grainy (I know what 400 asa grains should look like), muddled, and totally unacceptable even for a point and shoot, let alone a Leica. Actual prints are worse. Here are some more background: M6 is 2000 LHSA black paint version, only lightly used. Lenses are pristine. M6 exposure metering appear ok checked against other meters. 10 rolls processed (developed and printed) by Snapfish (perhaps should have gone elsewhere) 1 roll processed by local shop All 11 rolls were not acceptable, some worse than others. So, in my mind, three possible culprits remain. 1) bad processing by both, 2) bad bunch of film, and 3) shutter speed was off and underexposed, resulting in pushing during auto processing? Any thoughts? Alan Sheng Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! Quote Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/12626-poor-photos-with-m6/?do=findComment&comment=132377'>More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted January 2, 2007 Posted January 2, 2007 Hi colorflow, Take a look here Poor photos with M6. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
garygsandhu Posted January 3, 2007 Share #2 Posted January 3, 2007 What do the negative's look like? Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
fonziewonzie Posted January 3, 2007 Share #3 Posted January 3, 2007 did your negs go through xray before being processed? airport security checks etc? Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
colorflow Posted January 3, 2007 Author Share #4 Posted January 3, 2007 did your negs go through xray before being processed? airport security checks etc? Yes, the negs are just as bad. They did go through securities, but in a film bag supposedly shielding them from the x-ray. Thanks, Alan Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peyton Hoge Posted January 3, 2007 Share #5 Posted January 3, 2007 They probably took film out of bag. They have to know what is in bag since it will not show up on xray. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
wilfredo Posted January 3, 2007 Share #6 Posted January 3, 2007 I would shoot another roll and get it processed at a reputable lab and see what happens. Have you tested the shutter? Wilfredo+ Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Antony Posted January 3, 2007 Share #7 Posted January 3, 2007 Advertisement (gone after registration) Strange, if you told me they had been done by one lab, I'd suggest that exhausted developer would give similar problems, but two labs? I'm not so sure. Labs give C-41 film the same dev time 3mins 20 secs they don't 'push' the film like you can with E-6, certainly not as a matter of course. How do the edge markings look? If they are OK then it could be a shutter speed fault (too fast) but if the film looks awful, I'd suggest the fault lies there. It's doubtful that its X-ray damage as that tends to produce bands that run across the film like venetian blinds and you'll see shadows and dark irregular objects, I've never seen X-Rays that evenly reduce sensitivity, and generally they are ineffectual on 400 ISO and below, I've had my films continually scanned by X-rays at airports for years no problems. Can you post a pic of the film strip held up against the light so i can look at it? Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canfred Posted January 3, 2007 Share #8 Posted January 3, 2007 Hi Alan , looking at the photo I would not rule out x-ray damage. Something that came to my mind was , a concerned photographer placed his exposed films in protective envelopes ( leadlined) he observed the baggage checker looking at his case the operator unable to make out the contents of the film envelopes instantly wound up the machine until it became clear to him. OH well its just film , a horror story ? He certainly was horrified. This damage can take many forms specially when exposed a few times.Need more info see the Kodak white paper here http://www.kodak.com/global/en/service/tib/tib520/.shtml Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canfred Posted January 3, 2007 Share #9 Posted January 3, 2007 Sorry Alan , this link has lost something. You get the site thru google with Kodak Baggage x-ray Scanning Manfred Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rolo Posted January 3, 2007 Share #10 Posted January 3, 2007 The negatives will tell all. Can you scan some on a desk top and post them here ? The Fuji film, when exposed and processed correctly, will produce much better images than you show. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest user8952 Posted January 3, 2007 Share #11 Posted January 3, 2007 almost definetly x- ray damage. buy a roll of new film, take some picture and have it developed in an one hour lab. ( if you had been smart, you would have done that before your trip to be shure that your equipment is working....) Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sandokan Posted January 3, 2007 Share #12 Posted January 3, 2007 The M6 with the Black Dot? Lovely. I think you should try a slide film. I tried Elitechrome 100 and the results were vastly superior to Fuji 400. Even Kodak VC400 gave me better results than the Fuji. Like you I was disappointed by many results from the Fuji stock. Now, if I like any slides I get them individually high-res scanned and printed, otherwise I have the normal low res scans done when they are developed. I also believe that the X-ray operator may have turned up the power but would expect that to give uneven effects (rolled tubes, others in path etc. etc) - yours look like wrong exposure or bad development or bad scanning. Check the negatives with a loupe. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Never Satisfied Posted January 3, 2007 Share #13 Posted January 3, 2007 Hi Alan, the image you have shown looks to me like it is radically under exposed and the lab has tried to correct this by over exposing the prints. If your film is affected by x-rays the unexposed portions along the film sprocket holes will display similar damage, if it is nice and clear and not grainy then I think the fault my be your body. I would try another roll of film and shoot a few frames with bracketed exposures, +1, +2 stops. Good luck, cheers Andrew. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
xjr Posted January 3, 2007 Share #14 Posted January 3, 2007 This is not an X-RAY problem even if the films were taken out of the special lead bag...Unless they were put in the check-in luggage but the colour and grain appears to indicate that the films were exposed at an ASA [iSO] setting quite different than 400 but developed for 400.Are you sure the camera setting was for 400ASA ? Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
colorflow Posted January 4, 2007 Author Share #15 Posted January 4, 2007 Thanks very much everyone for your valuable input. Actually I did shoot a roll just a month before the trip using ASA200 and it was fine. So I doubt if it is the camera. It now seems x-ray may be the likely culprit, but I was under the same impression as Mark that ASA400 and below should be fine, especially with the extra precaution of the lead bag. Unfortunately I am away from homebase for a few months so can't get my hands on the negs. Will resume this investigation after I get back. Meanwhile I will be shooting a new roll to test. Ravi, nice series 2 E, I have a series 1.5 roadster myself. Great forum, Alan Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
colorflow Posted January 4, 2007 Author Share #16 Posted January 4, 2007 Wow, I posted without reading the last two posts. There may be something wrong with the ASA setting - not that I did not set it properly but something is wrong with the dial. Question is does auto processing automatically push ? Alan Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
colorflow Posted January 4, 2007 Author Share #17 Posted January 4, 2007 No, can't be the ASA setting, I responded too quickly (guess my fingers are faster than my brain). I checked the exposure settings against several other cameras and one meter. All within half ev of each other at 400. So if its not the x-ray then it's the shutter speed again??? Alan Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
mwilliamsphotography Posted January 4, 2007 Share #18 Posted January 4, 2007 I agree that the negs will tell all. One other possibility is indicated by the image posted. Based on just this one shot, and considering that a wide angle was used, it's possible that a very bright sky could have tricked the meter and indicated a grossly underexposed setting ... which the lab's auto-corrections on proofing would attempt to correct. This specific shot would most likely require a plus compensation to record the building while the sky would most likely go somewhat blank at the proof stage. With neg films latitude, a custom print could then selectively burn in the sky. Just a thought. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest flatfour Posted January 4, 2007 Share #19 Posted January 4, 2007 I would suggest the most likely cause is faulty processing. Try another film with a high class lab doing the processing. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bavaricus Posted January 4, 2007 Share #20 Posted January 4, 2007 Sorry Alan , this link has lost something. You get the site thru googlewith Kodak Baggage x-ray Scanning Manfred Try this: Baggage X-ray Scanning Effects on Film Very interessting page! Good light! Reiner Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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