coding-problem on M9

[biju49]

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I have coded myself 2 older Leica-lenses and Zeiss 2.0/50 with success.

But Zeiss 4.5/21 and 2,8/28 are never detected - with the same black ink. Of course I can switch to manual, but that doesn't make sense in my opinion.

 

Does anyone know the (good) reason why?

[hoppyman]

Well probably your heading might more accurately be coding problem with Zeiss Ikon lenses, as the Leica part of your combination works fine .

 

With the M9 though you can manually set the camera as though you had a Leica lens fitted (and irrespective of which frame lines are brought up by your mounts, there being different versions of each mount as well). However if that doesn't suit you, you may have to investigate whether the markings you are adding conflict with a screw position, or are accurate. In addition if you want auto detection then I expect that you would need frame line selector lever agreement too (as with the M8). Different Zeiss mount versions bring up different frame lines. Only certain frame line sets work with specific 6 BIT codes (on Auto).

Also according to a large US retailer, Zeiss does not recommend the 4.5 21 for the M9 as it produces uncorrectable red shift. You also can not use the third party replacement mount manufactured for their other 21).

I'd keep your 21 to use on another camera and manually select for the 28.

[Nick_Yoon]

I believe if there is a screw head in the area which is supposed to be coded white you need to paint the screw head white. The uneven surface of the metal screw head confuses the code sensor.

[biju49]

Thanks for the hints.

But there is neither a screw in the area nor are the wrong frame-lines shown! Both lenses show 28 lines and the lever is in the right position. Red shift can easily be corrected with cornerfix as you can see in my picture (delivery register).

Basically I would like to keep my Zeiss-lenses, because I like color/sharpness/and.... I can produce in my workflow.

 

Are there any new ideas?

[wlaidlaw]

Thanks for the hints.

But there is neither a screw in the area nor are the wrong frame-lines shown! Both lenses show 28 lines and the lever is in the right position. Red shift can easily be corrected with cornerfix as you can see in my picture (delivery register).

Basically I would like to keep my Zeiss-lenses, because I like color/sharpness/and.... I can produce in my workflow.

 

Are there any new ideas?

 

I suspect you are just not quite getting the lines in the correct place or getting the lines the correct thickness. I have often had to have quite a few attempts, adjusting the line position and thickness, before the code will pick up. It does get very frustrating and then you should put everything away for a few days, trying again later. I have recently purchased a 50/2 Planar and it is proving very resistant to hand coding but I will get it right eventually. It is one that needs a screw countersink filling with Tippex and I think my Tippex is so very far past its use by date (gone lumpy), that it is causing the failure to code.

 

Wilson

[biju49]

I suspect you are just not quite getting the lines in the correct place or getting the lines the correct thickness. I have often had to have quite a few attempts, adjusting the line position and thickness, before the code will pick up. It does get very frustrating and then you should put everything away for a few days, trying again later. I have recently purchased a 50/2 Planar and it is proving very resistant to hand coding but I will get it right eventually. It is one that needs a screw countersink filling with Tippex and I think my Tippex is so very far past its use by date (gone lumpy), that it is causing the failure to code.

 

Wilson

 

Worked perfect with my Zeiss 2/50 on the third attempt. Filled the screw first with white nail-varnish; applied black after about 15 minutes. Nail-varnish has the adnatage of beeing hard and elastic, that means less wear (no signs of wear after more than 40 mounting-cycles).

[jaapv]

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There are a number of coding services like John Milich.

[wlaidlaw]

There are a number of coding services like John Milich.

 

I understand Malcolm Taylor in the UK, is now offering this service as well.

 

Wilson

[lsolum]

I understand the Milich does the metal work, but not the paint. Is there any solution for "one stop shopping" for coding non-Leica lenses?

[AlanJW]

I failed at all attempts to code on a flat (non-milled) mount but did not use one of the commercially available coders. The coding is actually quite easy once you have the mount milled by John Milich. I found the most effective (for a Zeiss 25mm) was matte black and matte white Testors model paint -- easily gotten from a hobby shop. I could not successfully code with a Sharpie for black and white-out (same as Tippex I think) for white but the model paint worked the first time and is quite durable.

[wlaidlaw]

I understand the Milich does the metal work, but not the paint. Is there any solution for "one stop shopping" for coding non-Leica lenses?

 

The codes are Leica's intellectual property and any commercial organisation that offered to code would leave themselves open to action by Leica. Just milling slots in a mount, is not covered by the intellectual property, only the codes. Technically if you sell a lens, which you have hand coded, you could be liable for damages but practically, Leica is not going to come after an individual for private lens sales.

 

Wilson

[lsolum]

A bit of research suggests that Leica applied for one or more patents on six bit coding. If so (and I haven't searched for the patents), then I believe that machining would likely either infringe or be actionable on an enablement theory. Indeed, if it would be patent infringement for a commercial service, then it is infringement even if done by an individual.

[wlaidlaw]

A bit of research suggests that Leica applied for one or more patents on six bit coding. If so (and I haven't searched for the patents), then I believe that machining would likely either infringe or be actionable on an enablement theory. Indeed, if it would be patent infringement for a commercial service, then it is infringement even if done by an individual.

 

Indeed you are correct that even an individual would be infringing Leica's intellectual property rights but practically Leica are not going to chase individuals. They would need to produce evidence of who had done the coding for a start.

 

Wilson

[tdtaylor]

Ignoring for a minute the copyright infringement, does John Milich machine the notches directly on non-leica lenses, like the Zeiss 18/4, or only offer adapter rings? I have searched this site and the web, and have only found adapter rings, filter holders and bayonet changes for cropped sensors.

 

Thanks,

 

Terry

[AlanJW]

Ignoring for a minute the copyright infringement, does John Milich machine the notches directly on non-leica lenses, like the Zeiss 18/4, or only offer adapter rings? I have searched this site and the web, and have only found adapter rings, filter holders and bayonet changes for cropped sensors.

 

Thanks,

 

Terry

He does both, I believe. I know he milled my Zeiss 25.

[wlaidlaw]

Ignoring for a minute the copyright infringement, does John Milich machine the notches directly on non-leica lenses, like the Zeiss 18/4, or only offer adapter rings? I have searched this site and the web, and have only found adapter rings, filter holders and bayonet changes for cropped sensors.

 

Thanks,

 

Terry

 

Contact John direct on jm@milich.com. It sometimes takes him a couple of days to answer.

 

Wilson

[tdtaylor]

Contact John direct on jm@milich.com. It sometimes takes him a couple of days to answer.

 

Wilson

 

Much appreciated. Sometimes the most direct path is the best.

 

Terry

[250swb]

A bit of research suggests that Leica applied for one or more patents on six bit coding. If so (and I haven't searched for the patents), then I believe that machining would likely either infringe or be actionable on an enablement theory. Indeed, if it would be patent infringement for a commercial service, then it is infringement even if done by an individual.

 

What BS. Lets talk about consumer rights when Leica overnight makes all their lenses obsolete,..... unless you pay a fee. Thats not going to wash in any Court in any land, except lu lu la la land. In any case, my hand slipped while cleaning my lens with a grinder, and who's to say its deliberate if the odds are still in favour of chimps being able to type out an exact copy of a Shakespeare play if given long enough?

 

Steve

[wlaidlaw]

What BS. Lets talk about consumer rights when Leica overnight makes all their lenses obsolete,..... unless you pay a fee. Thats not going to wash in any Court in any land, except lu lu la la land. In any case, my hand slipped while cleaning my lens with a grinder, and who's to say its deliberate if the odds are still in favour of chimps being able to type out an exact copy of a Shakespeare play if given long enough?

 

Steve

 

Steve,

 

As someone who used to insure against intellectual property rights lawsuits, I can assure you that many US courts could regard even what John Milich does as infringement. You may well be right that parts of the legal systems in many countries are lu lu la la land but that does not stop them imposing huge amounts of damages. I have seen awards that are so nonsensical that, as long as you were not the defendant, you would fall about laughing. If you are the defendant and you are not insured, usually you go bust, unless you are a giant corporation.

 

The majority of politicians are lawyers and for them to vote to reform the system, would be as likely as turkeys voting in favour of Christmas.

 

Wilson

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Hallo,

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[grduprey]

I have coded myself 2 older Leica-lenses and Zeiss 2.0/50 with success.

But Zeiss 4.5/21 and 2,8/28 are never detected - with the same black ink. Of course I can switch to manual, but that doesn't make sense in my opinion.

 

Does anyone know the (good) reason why?

 

If you are not using the menu for lens recognition, the Leica 6 bit coding system requires the 6 bit code AND the lens mount to activate the correct frame lines for the lens, even if there are no frame lines for the lens being used. For both of the lenses you listed, the 28/90 frame lines must be activated for the lens to be recognized. If these frame lines are not being activated, this is your problem.

 

Gene