Only one lens for M9

[AnakChan]

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Can anyone explain why the 50 is so popular?

For an only lens, it doesn't seem wide enough to me if I was walking around on the street. I guess if you were doing a lot of portraits, but for general walk around it seems a bit claustrophobic to me. No?

Personally I'd agree with you. If I had to deal with one lens only, 35mm Lux.

[lars_bergquist]

Zeiss Planar 50/2. Same optical performance of Summicron and even slightly better in some cases (field curvature and flare control) according to Erwin Puts, at 1/2 of Summicron's price. You pay the other half in construction quality - cheaper aluminium however well machined vs. solid brass - and upon reselling. Summicron will retain it's value much better than the Planar.

Remarkable. Do you actually believe that the Summicron is made of solid brass?

 

Even focusing helicals are made of brass (one part) and aluminum (the other part). Leica and Zeiss choose materials depending on the job to be done. In both cases, most of the metal is aluminum.

 

Leica do publish engineering drawings of their lenses. In these, aluminum and brass are designated differently, and you can see that in the Summicron, the bayonet (of course) and the lens base and the aperture ring are brass. The rest is aluminum. Lots of it. There is of course some steel too (diaphragm blades, retaining rings etc). Design quality is not as simple as 'brass versus aluminum'. It is a question of design targets, cost parameters and engineering skill. Both Leica and Zeiss do design their lenses to levels that are much higher than Canonikon work by. They are both old companies whose major asset is their reputation -- and you can bet they know it.

 

The old man from the Age of Zeiss Ikon

[scott kirkpatrick]

I've used a 35 Summicron for the past three years as my effective 50 on the M8, so it is a lovely feeling to see it become a 35 again, a great, small walk-around lens on the M9. That gets my vote. I find I need an external viewfinder on the M9 to go wider than 35, but my CV Nokton 50/1.5 (the cost of which is not even noticeable compared to a Nocti -- more like purchasing a few more 16 Gb memory cards), will now get more use as well.

 

scott

[lars_bergquist]

Can anyone explain why the 50 is so popular?

For an only lens, it doesn't seem wide enough to me if I was walking around on the street. I guess if you were doing a lot of portraits, but for general walk around it seems a bit claustrophobic to me. No?

 

Two reasons. First, they offer lots of lens for your money, because these lenses are fairly straightforward designs, as long as speed is moderate.

 

Second, because of the above, we are used to pictures taken with c. 50mm lenses, so these lenses are seen as 'standard' or 'normal'. We do acquire seeing habits, you know -- individually and collectively. Your temperament and habits, and the taking situation (narrow streets and rooms, wide open spaces) may make you experience a 50mm lens as too narrow, or a 35mm as too wide. That is unavoidable. But remember that a 'standard lens' is really one with a focal length that corresponds to the diagonal of the picture format. In 24x36, this measure is 42mm. So 35 and 50mm are both situated about symmetrically around the diagonal measure, and can be regarded as a 'short standard lens' and a 'long' one, respectively. Which of them you chose will be a personal matter, and none obviously will fit all situations.

 

The old man from the Age of the Standard Lens

[scott kirkpatrick]

I think the most important variable is working distance. If I want to capture one or two people at a distance of 5 meters or more, I can use a 50 or even 75mm lens. If I'm in a restaurant with a dozen or more people, I need a 35 or 28mm.

 

HCB and Helen Levitt captured whole streets with what seemed always to be a 50 mm. Elliot Erwitt backs off a bit more, selects details, and took many of his most famous shots with a 90mm. And Gary Winogrand settled on a 28mm focal length with which he could be in the face of some of his subjects and still organize whole street scenes.

 

I think giving advice on this is rather silly, since it is such a personal decision.

 

scott

[lars_bergquist]

[ ... ] I think giving advice on this is rather silly, since it is such a personal decision.

 

scott

I do completely agree with you there: strawberry or chocolate? I am something of a 35mm man, but I can 'put on 90mm eyes' or '50mm eyes' or even '18mm eyes' depending on what lens I have chosen as the most appropriate. Most experienced RF users learn to do this. Even SLR people learned to do it -- before the zooms came in.

 

The old man from the Age B. Z. (Before Zooms)

[!Nomad64]

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Remarkable. Do you actually believe that the Summicron is made of solid brass?

 

Even focusing helicals are made of brass (one part) and aluminum (the other part). Leica and Zeiss choose materials depending on the job to be done. In both cases, most of the metal is aluminum.

 

Leica do publish engineering drawings of their lenses. In these, aluminum and brass are designated differently, and you can see that in the Summicron, the bayonet (of course) and the lens base and the aperture ring are brass. The rest is aluminum. Lots of it. There is of course some steel too (diaphragm blades, retaining rings etc). Design quality is not as simple as 'brass versus aluminum'. It is a question of design targets, cost parameters and engineering skill. Both Leica and Zeiss do design their lenses to levels that are much higher than Canonikon work by. They are both old companies whose major asset is their reputation -- and you can bet they know it.

 

The old man from the Age of Zeiss Ikon

 

Thanks Lars, there's always something to learn from experienced users. I'm no expert as to barrel construction and took for granted the old cliche cheap=aluminum. I superficially assumed that at the figure they sell the 'cron this was at least solid brass as my dad's rangefinder Canon (Leica copy) lenses. Got a Serenar 85/1.5 weighing a ton and apparently made of chromed brass. But those were the '50s...

Anyway, just for the sake of it, I got myself the Planar over the 'cron and have no regrets. For now.

[Ed_K]

Can anyone explain why the 50 is so popular?

For an only lens, it doesn't seem wide enough to me if I was walking around on the street. I guess if you were doing a lot of portraits, but for general walk around it seems a bit claustrophobic to me. No?

 

Well, it all boils down to your style of photography. I usually approach my subject matter within 3 feet and with a 35mm, the field of view would have included "too much" of its surroundings; besides i feel more comfortable working with a 50mm perspective. My guess the 50 happens to be popular with the members who response to this post, the result could have been different if we do a poll involving all members.

[Ario Arioldi]

Thanks Lars, there's always something to learn from experienced users. I'm no expert as to barrel construction and took for granted the old cliche cheap=aluminum. I superficially assumed that at the figure they sell the 'cron this was at least solid brass as my dad's rangefinder Canon (Leica copy) lenses. Got a Serenar 85/1.5 weighing a ton and apparently made of chromed brass. But those were the '50s...

Anyway, just for the sake of it, I got myself the Planar over the 'cron and have no regrets. For now.

In general, and with very few exceptions (the Summicron 28mm for instance), the lenses with external finish in Silver, Titanium and Black Paint have also the main barrel built in solid brass, while the Black Crome versions have the barrel buiti in Aluminum. In fact there is a substantial difference in weight which is also reported in the data sheets.

The Summicron's 50mm, current model, weight respectively 335 g (silver) vs 240g (black crome).

Cheers,

Ario

[batmobile]

I'd go for a 35mm for a single lens and get something small for portability. The vast majority of images are shot at an F longer than 2.8 so a summarit 2.5 would be worth considering. The 35 is a wonderful all rounder for my money.

[redbaron]

I chose either a 35 or 50 depending who I'm photographing. For westerners I use the 50 and Asians I use the 35. I don't change lenses when working in Melbourne, of course. But I find I take similarly framed shots of both subjects because of their relative comfort zones. So each country has its own 'standard' lens for me.

[!Nomad64]

In general, and with very few exceptions (the Summicron 28mm for instance), the lenses with external finish in Silver, Titanium and Black Paint have also the main barrel built in solid brass, while the Black Crome versions have the barrel buiti in Aluminum. In fact there is a substantial difference in weight which is also reported in the data sheets.

The Summicron's 50mm, current model, weight respectively 335 g (silver) vs 240g (black crome).

Cheers,

Ario

 

Nice point, further adding to my hardware culture. Grazie, Ario.

 

Bruno

[tategoi]

Thanks to all suggestions, and after a few days of arm chair research, based on internet reviews and NOT actual uses of M-lenses, I have arrived at 3 ASPH lenses, not in order of preferences:

 

1. 28mm Elmarit, for its compact and lowest price, this will make the M9 very portable;

2. 35mm Summicron, for being wide and versatile usage, good for traveling and casual shots;

3. 50mm Summilux, the fastest amongst the 3 shortlisted.

 

One day I'd love to get all 3, but given the financial constraints, I can only choose just one. Now I am more in favor of the 35mm Summilux!

[AlanJW]

I agree the Summilux 50 may be a good choice, but I also like the Summicron 50 because of it's very small size and very contrasty results. It works well on my M8 and I think would be ideal as a 1-lens kit on the M9.

 

I have a review on my blog with sample pics

The Leica Summicron 50mm Version III Rigid Review for the M8 — Daniel Valente Photography

 

Just to show how personal a decision this is, another thread asked which three leneses never to get for the M9, and the poster included the 50mm Summicron as "boring". I guess if I had to pick one it would be a 35mm Summicron, but the fact is that I have one and usually go either wider or narrower. For me the 35mm is a compromise, which of course is what a one lens kit would be.

[tategoi]

One day I'd love to get all 3, but given the financial constraints, I can only choose just one. Now I am more in favor of the 35mm Summilux!

 

sorry typo. I meant to say my top choice is 35mm Summicron. Some say fast lenses are not that necessary given the M9 being digital has the ability to shoot high iso.

[mattraineyimages]

Leica lenses are like tattoos, you cannot have just one. Each one builds from the previous to weave a tapestry. I'd start with the 28 cron, move to the 50lux and onward.

[JWW]

Tategoi,

 

Now that you decided on the 35mm Summicron, the tough part is deciding the ASPH or pre ASPH? If you search this forum and others, it's been a huge debate.

[lars_bergquist]

In general, and with very few exceptions (the Summicron 28mm for instance), the lenses with external finish in Silver, Titanium and Black Paint have also the main barrel built in solid brass, while the Black Crome versions have the barrel buiti in Aluminum. In fact there is a substantial difference in weight which is also reported in the data sheets.

The Summicron's 50mm, current model, weight respectively 335 g (silver) vs 240g (black crome).

Cheers,

Ario

Well, the reason for the brass was that aluminum did not work well as a substrate for silver chrome, so all *external* parts were made of brass. There is still lots of aluminum in the dark interior, however! If this had not been the case, you would have seen some weight difference ... Nowadays surfacing technology seems to have advanced, and evden silver lenses can be all aluminum.

 

Actually, people complained about the heft of Canon and Nikon rangefinder lenses even then, in the old muscular he-man 1950's. So both companies started reduction programs.

 

The old man from the B.A. (Brass Age)

[lars_bergquist]

Tategoi,

 

Now that you decided on the 35mm Summicron, the tough part is deciding the ASPH or pre ASPH? If you search this forum and others, it's been a huge debate.

My v.4 (pre-ASPH) 35mm Summmicron is now in Solms for coding. It was resurrected from the semi-dead when I discovered how really good it is on a M9 (I do also own a Summilux ASPH, and love it). You cannot go wrong with this wonderfully compact little lens, but do check that you have the right version. V. 2/3 was never popular due to harsh bokeh, and the v.1 of 1958 was clearly inferior to the Summaron below f:5.6.

 

The old man from the B.A. (Brass Age)

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Hallo,

Look here: Leica M

[doug_m]

One lens on the M9 = 50 lux ASPH.

 

In my opinion, this should be a no brainer unless you truly do not have the money for this lens or absolutely must have a different focal length.