M9--Some initial thoughs

[noah_addis]

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I have NOT been using UV/IR filters with the M9.

 

The color cast can be removed easily enough in photoshop, it's just a hassle for a large number of photographs.

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[erl]

So far, my biggest hassle has been user error. I have 3 coded lenses and 5 uncoded lenses. Remembering to switch between Lens Detection "manual' (and selecting the lens) and 'Auto' is driving my mad. Largely because the EXIF data records the wrong lens used, which is worse than no lens recorded.

 

I guess the solution is more rigid discipline in camera handling.

 

(I'm not about to send 5 lenses for an extended holiday.)

[chris_tribble]

So far, my biggest hassle has been user error. I have 3 coded lenses and 5 uncoded lenses. Remembering to switch between Lens Detection "manual' (and selecting the lens) and 'Auto' is driving my mad. Largely because the EXIF data records the wrong lens used, which is worse than no lens recorded.

 

I have a similar problem with my 135 apo telyt - I've not got this so it brings up the right framelines, but it's impossible to get the coding right for exif other than via Manual. The danger then is to forget to change - and I did this going back to 21mm Elmarit. It wasn't pretty .... But hey - Leica did warn us that user error would be a problem with the Menu that so many screamed for....

 

V Best...

[Guest EarlBurrellPhoto]

So far, my biggest hassle has been user error. I have 3 coded lenses and 5 uncoded lenses. Remembering to switch between Lens Detection "manual' (and selecting the lens) and 'Auto' is driving my mad. Largely because the EXIF data records the wrong lens used, which is worse than no lens recorded.

 

I guess the solution is more rigid discipline in camera handling.

 

 

I would think the solution would be a firmware update whereby if the camera detects a coded lens it defaults to auto lens detection, then reverts when the reader fails to see a code.

 

 

 

 

 

Leica did warn us that user error would be a problem with the Menu that so many screamed for....

 

.

 

Aha, now I see why they didn't follow my solution. Had to teach us all a lesson. "Father Leica knows best"

[jonoslack]

I would think the solution would be a firmware update whereby if the camera detects a coded lens it defaults to auto lens detection, then reverts when the reader fails to see a code.

 

. . . and what if you want to experiment with other lens settings for different lenses? For example, most have coded their Zeiss 25 biogon as a 24 elmarit for the M8 . . . this (currently) produces a nasty red cast on the left hand side of the frame on the M9. If you code the lens as a 28mm elmarit Aspherical, then it behaves perfectly. Your simplistic firmware update would make this impossible.

[erl]

Ah! Our wonderful manual camera is turning out to be truly manual, maybe.

[erl]

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Another thing I am becoming aware of is that periodically (it appears) the 'Play' button brings up a 'random' image rather than the last shot pic. Not sure yet, but it may be connected to the fact that I recently had my 'Auto Review' turned off.

[ho_co]

.... But hey - Leica did warn us that user error would be a problem with the Menu that so many screamed for....

Was just about to post the same thing! Be careful what you wish for--because we got it.

 

I've had enough trouble remembering both to tell the M8 how the WATE is now set and to tell myself to reset the finder as well.

 

 

I would think the solution would be a firmware update whereby if the camera detects a coded lens it defaults to auto lens detection, then reverts when the reader fails to see a code.

Earl, that would be worse than the M8.

 

First, as Jono said, the flexibility is helpful. But further, what happens when it "reverts" but I've changed to a third lens? Not a usable solution IMO.

 

 

 

I think you're right, erl. We've got to start thinking of the camera as manual again!

[viramati]

Hi Jono

with the biagon 25 are you saying that I should set the lens detection to manual and the set it to '28 f2.8 ASPH. 11606' in the setup menu

thanks

[Guest EarlBurrellPhoto]

. . . and what if you want to experiment with other lens settings for different lenses? For example, most have coded their Zeiss 25 biogon as a 24 elmarit for the M8 . . . this (currently) produces a nasty red cast on the left hand side of the frame on the M9. If you code the lens as a 28mm elmarit Aspherical, then it behaves perfectly. Your simplistic firmware update would make this impossible.

 

Oh my, yes you're absolutely right. I neglected to consider the people who like to play round-robin with their extensive lens collections. I tend to forget that pros are a tiny minority constituent in Leica's market. I suppose then there would need to be two settings for manual selection: one with override if a coded lenses is fitted, and one without the override that leaves it purely manual. Still not that big a challenge for Leica I think.

[wattsy]

I tend to forget that pros are a tiny minority constituent in Leica's market.

 

Not sure why you are so concerned.

[jonoslack]

Oh my, yes you're absolutely right. I neglected to consider the people who like to play round-robin with their extensive lens collections. I tend to forget that pros are a tiny minority constituent in Leica's market. I suppose then there would need to be two settings for manual selection: one with override if a coded lenses is fitted, and one without the override that leaves it purely manual. Still not that big a challenge for Leica I think.

 

Now you're on the button

 

Off

Auto

Manual

Manual (with over-ride when fitting a coded lens)

 

Bingo!

Here is hoping

 

P.S. . . . . and I'm deeply admiring of your wonderful subtle and amusing sarcasm about 'pros'

[jonoslack]

Hi Jono

with the biagon 25 are you saying that I should set the lens detection to manual and the set it to '28 f2.8 ASPH. 11606' in the setup menu

thanks

 

Well, it has worked really well for me - I'm not sure if there are variations with lenses.

I shot over 100 shots outside with white clouds etc. yesterday and it was nearly perfect. (I say nearly, as it did show a little magenta when I tried to do some fairly heavy duty HDR on an underexposed area).

 

However - it's a bit tricky if the lens is already coded. (and if you're like me, you'll forget to set it or to reset it).

 

I found it better to use up one of my custom presets - which I've called Zeiss 25, with manual lens selection and selected to the 28 Asph f2.8.

The other 3 presets are on auto lens selection.

 

Obviously it means you have the wrong information in exif, which is mildly irritating.

 

If your zeiss is already coded as a 24 elmarit (as mine is) then you'll need to revert to the lens mount bringing up the 28 framelines before you can recode it to a 28 (I spent ages with nail paint trying to get it to bring up the 28 before I realised that it wouldn't work).

 

I hope this helps

[UliWer]

Now you're on the button

 

Off

Auto

Manual

Manual (with over-ride when fitting a coded lens)

 

Bingo!

Here is hoping

 

Add "User Error" to avoid switiching between the two manual modes.

[Guest EarlBurrellPhoto]

Not sure why you are so concerned.

 

Pure selfishness If not for the cadre of grandfatherly-types who pony-up for everything Leica dishes out no matter how long the delays in availability, forgiving or denying its faults and foibles, patiently waiting for long service intervals, and accepting the full brunt of currency fluctuations, there would be no Leica for us few pros who use it in specialised situations. So of course I'm concerned that the mainstay of Leica's market is kept satisfied. Aren't you?

[AlanJW]

Jonathan: Not sure I understand this. I have the Biogon 25 with the mount modified for M8, and coded as a Elmarit 24. Are you saying that this setup results in overcorrection and that it is better to go with manual selection of 28 Asph? I had thought that for the M9 the mount was irrelevant as neither mount would bring up the right framelines and the 24 coding would tell the camera what to correct. Is that all wrong?

 

Thanks

 

 

Alan

 

Well, it has worked really well for me - I'm not sure if there are variations with lenses.

I shot over 100 shots outside with white clouds etc. yesterday and it was nearly perfect. (I say nearly, as it did show a little magenta when I tried to do some fairly heavy duty HDR on an underexposed area).

 

However - it's a bit tricky if the lens is already coded. (and if you're like me, you'll forget to set it or to reset it).

 

I found it better to use up one of my custom presets - which I've called Zeiss 25, with manual lens selection and selected to the 28 Asph f2.8.

The other 3 presets are on auto lens selection.

 

Obviously it means you have the wrong information in exif, which is mildly irritating.

 

If your zeiss is already coded as a 24 elmarit (as mine is) then you'll need to revert to the lens mount bringing up the 28 framelines before you can recode it to a 28 (I spent ages with nail paint trying to get it to bring up the 28 before I realised that it wouldn't work).

 

I hope this helps

[adan]

Alan, focal length alone is not enough to get the right corrections. If the Zeiss 25 and the Leica 24 have significantly different optical designs (and they do), then corrections that are "right" for the 24 will not necessarily be the right ones for your 25 (or for a Cosina 25, or for old screw-mount Canon or Nikon 25s - each one has a different optical design, and thus a different pattern of fall-off).

 

Add to that the fact that Leica's corrections may not even be perfected yet for their own wide-angles (see threads on red-left corner drifts with Leica wides) - and what Jono is saying is that - of the available corrections, the manual 28 Elmarit ones may be the best fit to the Zeiss 25.

 

(I wouldn't know, myself)

[simo]

Great pictures. Looking forward to eventually getting hold of my M9.

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I have seen the red band on one photo using a CV 21mm manually coded lens. The sun was coming from the left, and it was a test photo I made of the blue sky to check for dust, so on auto I got an underexposed image (which didn't matter, it did its job). But other photo's made at the same time with the sun at a similar angle, and correctly exposed, do not show the red band. I just wonder if the exposure is the critical element?

 

As regards changing from manual to auto detection it soon became a pain, so I made my own coding template from BoPhoto's plans

 

BoPhoto.com: M8 coder - simple manual handcoding of M lenses

 

and coded my lenses. The difference between the M9 and M8 is that markers no longer work, they do not have enough density. But black paint does work, and I guess the application has to be more careful as you wouldn't want the paint to flake off and get in the camera. I have used two types to test, one an auto acylic gloss black, the other Humbrol hobby enamel. So far they are holding up very well.

 

Steve

[LeicaS2]

I have solved my coding user problem by simply and quickly buying an M9 for coded lenses and a grey M9 for non-coded lenses that I set manually. I got a M9 which I converted to white leather for non-coded lenses that I did not set manually. My user problem is solved, and I have stopped making mistakes. That will be the plus of the S2 system, all the lenses will be coded.