cfc247 Posted October 21, 2009 Share #1 Posted October 21, 2009 Advertisement (gone after registration) I've read Sean's reviews on these lenses (though they seemed a bit dated since he tested on the RD1) but wanted to get some feedback from users. I find the 25 too close to my 35 lux and am considering widening the gap to the 21 instead. My questions are: 1. How usable is the 21mm focal length on the M8, using the edges of the Viewfinder (I don't wear glasses and prefer not to use an external finder). This will make or break the deal for me. 2. I am looking at the pre ASPH 21mm Elmarit (largest it seems of the group), 21 Zeiss 2.8, and the CV 21mm M-mount. Please let me know what it is like to shoot with these lenses, both the handling and viewfinder coverage. 3. Drawing---what are some user impressions of the drawing of the lenses and their relative IQ. As a reference, I love the look of the 28 cron and the 35 lux asph. Though I do like the lower contrast lenses, I also enjoy more moderate ones like the Nokton 50 1.5. So low to moderate contrast is my preference. Any thoughts would be appreciated. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted October 21, 2009 Posted October 21, 2009 Hi cfc247, Take a look here 21mm Zeiss, CV or Leica pre asph?. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
lars_bergquist Posted October 22, 2009 Share #2 Posted October 22, 2009 Do not listen to what they say about the pre-ASPH 21mm Elmarit. It is a very nice lens, with a drawing that is indeed quite close to that of the 28 Summicron. And it does handle stray light and flare very nicely too. Its only drawback would be the (for Leica M) relatively huge diameter, E60 filters. But in the SLR world, this is of course puny. I would not recommend the C/V. It is wonderfully small and light, and very good axially and paraxially, but the corners of the full format are noticeably soft. Also, f:4 is pretty slow for a lens that has the field of view on the M8 of a full-frame 28, and that you would often want to use indoors. -- The Zeiss has some good curves to show off, but I have not used that lens myself. The old man from the Age of the Zeiss Hologon Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
cfc247 Posted October 22, 2009 Author Share #3 Posted October 22, 2009 Lars, thank you for your reply. Do you know how the pre asph compares to the 21 Elmarit asph? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
photophile Posted October 22, 2009 Share #4 Posted October 22, 2009 Mark - I use the 21 pre with some frequency on my M8. ( see some of my posts - from last year ) , I use the full viewfinder frame and find it a good estimate of what I will get in the final - but some post crop is useful at times depending on subject. Draw and flare control are, despite what some say, excellent in my copy. There is, as expected, some distortion at the margins but acceptable.It is big...but balanced. I would not swap this lens out of my group...and find it a pleasure to use. BTW I print 17X22 inch prints rountinely on an epson 3800. The images from this lens always get great compliments...so in the eye of the beholders...good luck. Coos Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
sean_reid Posted October 22, 2009 Share #5 Posted October 22, 2009 I've read Sean's reviews on these lenses (though they seemed a bit dated since he tested on the RD1) but wanted to get some feedback from users. I find the 25 too close to my 35 lux and am considering widening the gap to the 21 instead. My questions are: 1. How usable is the 21mm focal length on the M8, using the edges of the Viewfinder (I don't wear glasses and prefer not to use an external finder). This will make or break the deal for me. 2. I am looking at the pre ASPH 21mm Elmarit (largest it seems of the group), 21 Zeiss 2.8, and the CV 21mm M-mount. Please let me know what it is like to shoot with these lenses, both the handling and viewfinder coverage. 3. Drawing---what are some user impressions of the drawing of the lenses and their relative IQ. As a reference, I love the look of the 28 cron and the 35 lux asph. Though I do like the lower contrast lenses, I also enjoy more moderate ones like the Nokton 50 1.5. So low to moderate contrast is my preference. Any thoughts would be appreciated. There are various 21 mm lens tests - made with the M8 - on the site. I'd recommend looking at those. Index is here: articleindextable Be sure to log in before clicking a link in the index. I have not yet tested the 21 pre-ASPH but the ASPH version is part of that test. Cheers, Sean Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
sean_reid Posted October 22, 2009 Share #6 Posted October 22, 2009 I would not recommend the C/V. It is wonderfully small and light, and very good axially and paraxially, but the corners of the full format are noticeably soft. The old man from the Age of the Zeiss Hologon Hi Lars, Interesting. I haven't yet tested that lens (for resolution) on the M9. In only tested for vignetting and cyan drift so far. Did you try in on the M9 or film? I'd love to see example crops if you made them. Cheers, Sean Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
lars_bergquist Posted October 22, 2009 Share #7 Posted October 22, 2009 Advertisement (gone after registration) Lars, thank you for your reply. Do you know how the pre asph compares to the 21 Elmarit asph? The Pre is very good, and the ASPH is even better. Period. The old squinty man from the Age of the Zeiss Hologon Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
lars_bergquist Posted October 22, 2009 Share #8 Posted October 22, 2009 Hi Lars, Interesting. I haven't yet tested that lens (for resolution) on the M9. In only tested for vignetting and cyan drift so far. Did you try in on the M9 or film? I'd love to see example crops if you made them. Cheers, Sean Tried it on film only. Exchanged it for a Pre Leica before I got my M8. Today I do not use the focal length, but has a 18 and a 25mm lens instead. The shifty-eyed old man from the Age of the Zeiss Hologon Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
cfc247 Posted October 22, 2009 Author Share #9 Posted October 22, 2009 Thank you all for your contributions. At this point, I am pretty much wavering between the 21mm elmarit asph vs. the pre asph. Could anyone post some photo samples from the two lenses? Is the asph very "modern" like the 28 elmarit? I am no for that high contrast look. If the asph is simply sharper and better corrected with the same drawing, I would prefer the asph. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
cfc247 Posted October 23, 2009 Author Share #10 Posted October 23, 2009 Also, could someone comment on what a fair price for a clean 21mm elmarit pre ASPH is? I see them from 1100--1300. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
batmobile Posted October 23, 2009 Share #11 Posted October 23, 2009 I too would not recommend the 21 CV on FF for the relatively weak corner performance in teh samples I have used. The Zeiss is superb. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maarten Posted October 23, 2009 Share #12 Posted October 23, 2009 This picture I took last winter with my 21mm Elmarit-M pre (#321....) with UV/IR. I had it coded in Solms but nowadays cheaper routes are available. I love the lens especially for the beautiful color rendition. This picture shows how well it handles light. Maarten Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/100977-21mm-zeiss-cv-or-leica-pre-asph/?do=findComment&comment=1086505'>More sharing options...
sean_reid Posted October 23, 2009 Share #13 Posted October 23, 2009 I've read Sean's reviews on these lenses (though they seemed a bit dated since he tested on the RD1) You have now also read the reviews done using the M8 right? Cheers, Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest EarlBurrellPhoto Posted October 23, 2009 Share #14 Posted October 23, 2009 I've not used the CV or pre-ASPH on an M9, however I did use both on full-frame (film) for a long while. If the CV performs sub-par in the corners on the M9 then the fault (if not sample variation in the lens) must be with the M9 sensor and related technology. Sad news then for those hoping the M9 will be the digital equal of their film Ms. In regards to the pre-ASPH, having had both it and the ASPH I happen to prefer the pre. I found that it had less corner falloff than the ASPH, and the draw more pleasing. It's properly a matter of one's taste, putting aside the tendency to feel inadequate not sporting the latest ASPH. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mauribix Posted October 23, 2009 Share #15 Posted October 23, 2009 Mark, I used the Zeiss, but I had the Leica ASPH adn the WATE too. The Zeiss with the M8 was outstanding (very "punching" if you like that), now I tried it on the M9 too, and it's still great on the FF... I'll try and post a sample here. BTW now, since my 28cron has become again a 28mm lens with the M9, and I don't use the 21mm lens that much, my Zeiss is soon ready for sale! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mauribix Posted October 23, 2009 Share #16 Posted October 23, 2009 Sad news then for those hoping the M9 will be the digital equal of their film Ms. ufff... quite conservative statement. Matter of fact Mark was not asking about film. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mauribix Posted October 23, 2009 Share #17 Posted October 23, 2009 ok, so this is the 21Zeiss @ f/2.8 with the M9 (sorry for not posting an M8 picture, but it's nice to see that it performs sharply on the FF too). No art in this picture, it's just good for the case since I could make some 100%crops on very thin subjects as the thin bristles. Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/100977-21mm-zeiss-cv-or-leica-pre-asph/?do=findComment&comment=1086993'>More sharing options...
cfc247 Posted October 23, 2009 Author Share #18 Posted October 23, 2009 You have now also read the reviews done using the M8 right? Cheers, Sean, yes, I went back and found the M8 review with the 21 lenses. All three seem very capable. I really like the size of the zeiss, especially at the same speed as the elmarit. Contrast in b&w is my only concern though. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
cfc247 Posted October 23, 2009 Author Share #19 Posted October 23, 2009 ok, so this is the 21Zeiss @ f/2.8 with the M9 (sorry for not posting an M8 picture, but it's nice to see that it performs sharply on the FF too).No art in this picture, it's just good for the case since I could make some 100%crops on very thin subjects as the thin bristles. Maurizio, Thanks for sharing the photo. The Zeiss is obviously very competent. The photo seems to show good rendering of detail and light. Do you happen to have any b&w work you have done with the lens? My only concern with the Zeiss is the contrast. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
cfc247 Posted October 23, 2009 Author Share #20 Posted October 23, 2009 This picture I took last winter with my 21mm Elmarit-M pre (#321....) with UV/IR. I had it coded in Solms but nowadays cheaper routes are available. I love the lens especially for the beautiful color rendition. This picture shows how well it handles light. Maarten Maarten, Thanks for sharing the image. I really like the Mandler design lenses and the subtle and delicate touch they bring to images. Do you happen to have any b&w samples? Thanks. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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