how do you set the exposure on your leica m?

[khemani]

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hi folks,

 

i've shot with nikon and canon dslr's, and the leica m8.2 is my first rangefinder. this is my second day with it, and i was hoping some of you might share how you set the exposure on your camera without moving your eye away from the viewfinder.

 

with both the nikon d700 and the canon 5d before that, i was able to adjust the shutter, aperture, and if needed the iso also without moving my eye from the viewfinder because i knew the controls and because i could see the settings displayed at the bottom of my viewfinder.

 

i am missing the aperture and shutter speed being displayed at the bottom of the viewfinder. i suppose for the aperture that i can start wide open and know where i am by the number of clicks from what is wide open for that lens. but how do i know what my shutter speed is? i've accepted that the iso setting is in a menu accessed via a button on the back of the camera.

 

i'd appreciate any suggestions you might have.

 

thanks,

-y

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[Julian Thompson]

Well I reckon that it's a game of using aperture priority and watching the display. I can then meter the highlights - the lowlights -and then either lock on one or the other or somewhere inbeween or if not I can manually select. Simple and really quick as you get better. But for you on day 2 it's so exciting because you've got so much learning to do to get great at it! You'll love it!

[farnz]

As Julian says, you can set the shutter speed dial to "A" and the shutter speed will appear in the bottom of the viewfinder.

 

Alternatively you can use the camera in Manual mode and use the dot and arrows in the viewfinder to find the appropriate shutter speed. If the right hand pointing arrow shows then turn the front of the shutter speed dial to the right until the dot shows and vice versa. To preserve the highlights I adjust the shutter speed so that the dot and the right hand pointing arrow are visible. Using this method in low light you need to be aware of your shutter speed to prevent camera shake.

 

Pete.

[khemani]

hi folks,

 

i understand that i can use aperture priority mode. but if i want to dial the shutter speed manually, how do i know where i've dialed it without moving my eye away from the viewfinder and looking on top of the camera?

 

thanks!

-y

[farnz]

hi folks,

 

i understand that i can use aperture priority mode. but if i want to dial the shutter speed manually, how do i know where i've dialed it without moving my eye away from the viewfinder and looking on top of the camera?

 

thanks!

-y

As you mentioned in your first post by mentally counting the clicks, which becomes second-nature before long.

 

In good light I normally decide on the aperture first that will give the depth of field I want and let the shutter speed take care of itself. Above about 1/30th and below 1/4000th I'm not really concerned what the shutter speed is unless I'm using a telephoto lens and then I adjust accordingly.

 

Pete.

[ljclark]

i understand that i can use aperture priority mode. but if i want to dial the shutter speed manually, how do i know where i've dialed it without moving my eye away from the viewfinder and looking on top of the camera?

 

I also tend to shoot in aperture priority, since aperture settings render the characteristics that I want to control first. Shutter speed follows aperture, and the way I adjust that is through ISO setting (when using in-camera aperture priority metering).

 

So the simple answer is that you'll be counting clicks, after visually checking the shutter speed as you bring the camera to eye.

 

Luckily, almost any lens you get for M-mount runs the aperture settings the same way -- the smaller apertures are on the right part of the ring as you hold the camera in shooting position. Counting click stops for aperture is easier than shutter speed -- you just have to remember (1) whether the starting (wide) aperture is a whole or partial stop, (2) how many clicks between stops (generally 1/2 stops, but Zeiss uses 1/3 stop click), and whether the last full stop has an intermediate click (some don't between 16 and 22 -- but you usually don't want to be there anyway).

 

The metering pattern in the M8 is, in my opinion, marginal. In average conditions it works OK, but I've also found it to give me readings 2 or 3 stops off from a hand-held incident reading in some situations. Even the M9 is just a center weighted pattern, and these cameras have nothing like you're used to with Nikon or Canon matrix systems. Consider investing in a decent hand-held incident meter.

 

In some respects DRFs put your technique back a couple of decades. You need to approach your shooting locale with an awareness of the light, and form a preliminary idea of the settings you'll need. You'll need to visually check the settings on the camera more frequently (but that also reinforces your memory of which way things turn). More work, especially at first, but it's nice to involve the human brain in the shooting process.

[footnoteblog]

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Aperture priority: ew! Memorization; that's the only thing I can offer.

 

Clockwise, open up.

 

Similar to the focusing thread, you have most of your controls set in a predetermined place (and for fun, move them differently). Having an origination point, some muscle memory, and thought usually gets the job done. Dropping under shade? Open up two stops. Walking and trying exposures in different scenarios; i.e., practice is the only way to get your exposure the way you envision capturing your scenes.

 

This is why the ISO button is so much better on the M9.

[epand56]

I'm sometimes using in aperture priority mode, but mostly I over or under expose as I need by looking at the arrows aside the dot in the viewfinder. I tend to slightly undrexpose in strong light and overexpose in dim light.

[wstotler]

Aperture priority. When I have time, I use an incident meter. Set the aperture, find exposure on the meter, dial the appropriate speed into the M8 and (mostly) forget about it until the light substantially changes.

[Shootist]

I mainly shoot in A mode, just because I find it OK and I know how to adjust for certain settings. I do point the camera at something I want exposed properly by the cameras meter then lock/recompose if I think I need to or I will point then adjust the aperture if I'm not looking for a certain depth of field and I'm looking for a certain shutter speed then lock recompose and shoot.

Then if I'm in low light I will mostly use manual shutter speeds with a set aperture. Dot in the center camera thinks the exposure is correct. Dot and left arrow the camera thinks the exposure is a 1/2+/- stop unexposed. Dot and right arrow 1/2+/- overexposed. Right or Left arrows only it could be 1-many stops over or under exposed.

 

It's just something you have to learn and get use to.

[ChrisC]

.....share how you set the exposure on your camera without moving your eye away from the viewfinder......

 

I have many years of accurate manual metering experience but the M8 has been the only camera I have ever struggled with getting optimum exposures. That is until someone [Jamie Roberts I think] shared their manual exposure technique which I use all the time now with great success - with the caveat that I mostly shoot in daylight.

 

Set exposure compensation to +1 2/3, select your aperture, point the centre of the viewfinder at the brightest area [e.g. sky, or very bright clouds], adjust the exposure dial until the exposure red dot in the viewfinder is showing alone without either arrow, compose and make your photograph then check it's histogram. Practice, practice, practice the technique until you are familiar with when to throw in an 'experience tweak' to the exposure, and you will have a reliable second-nature technique giving optimal exposures without clipping highlights. It works for me, and I hate clipped highlights.

 

I am long sighted and always carry a focusing loupe in my left hand with which I examine the histogram highlight corner; you might find it better to press 'Info' and examine that histogram rather than the on-screen one that competes with it's underlying image.

 

.............. Chris

[farnz]

Chris,

 

How do you handle specular highlights with this method? For example, if you were shooting at dusk and the streetlights were on would you meter off the brightest streetlight or find the brightest non-streetlight/specular highlight, meter off that and let the streetlights/specular highlights blow out?

 

Pete.

[ho_co]

khemani--

At the M8 introduction seminar held in Irving, Texas, our instructor told us that the M8's metering pattern varies with the focal length of the lens in use. With a wide-angle, it becomes more nearly a center-weighted averaging meter; with a telephoto, it behaves more like a spot meter.

 

This differs from the information in the M8 manual, and although I've mentioned it a couple times on the forum, I've never seen the contention either proved or disproved.

 

I think one reason that a lot of us have trouble with the M8's meter--and possibly one reason the M9 uses a different metering pattern--may be that the exact pattern does vary with the lens in use.

 

That would make a specific metering procedure like the one Chris recommends just about the only way to get consistent exposures with the camera.

 

Just one point of view, just for what it's worth, with no promises, you understand.

[Gawain Hewitt]

khemani--

At the M8 introduction seminar held in Irving, Texas, our instructor told us that the M8's metering pattern varies with the focal length of the lens in use. With a wide-angle, it becomes more nearly a center-weighted averaging meter; with a telephoto, it behaves more like a spot meter.

 

This differs from the information in the M8 manual, and although I've mentioned it a couple times on the forum, I've never seen the contention either proved or disproved.

 

I think one reason that a lot of us have trouble with the M8's meter--and possibly one reason the M9 uses a different metering pattern--may be that the exact pattern does vary with the lens in use.

 

That would make a specific metering procedure like the one Chris recommends just about the only way to get consistent exposures with the camera.

 

Just one point of view, just for what it's worth, with no promises, you understand.

 

That only makes sense to me the other way round, i.e. it's a spot meter on a very wider lens and centre weighted on a telephoto.

 

I tried Chris's technique and it's nice, although I guess, as with all techniques, it will work better in some situations that in others

 

Gawain

[Shootist]

That only makes sense to me the other way round, i.e. it's a spot meter on a very wider lens and centre weighted on a telephoto.

 

I tried Chris's technique and it's nice, although I guess, as with all techniques, it will work better in some situations that in others

 

Gawain

 

The meter area, the area the meter meters off of, in the M8 is always the same size.

If you are using a wide angle lens the meter sees a larger area of the scene, just as the lens captures a larger area. If you are using a telephoto lens the meter sees a narrower area of the scene, just as the lens captures a smaller area.

 

So with a telephoto lens the meter becomes more of a spot, NOT a real spot (more center weigthed spot), meter and no spot at all when using a wide angle lens.

[ptarmigan]

I tend to shoot in Aperture priority 80% of the time though depending on conditions/subject I may dial in some over or under exposure. I also use the exposure lock quite a bit. The one area I am still finding 'tricky' is heavily back-lit subjects though I've only been shooting the M8 for a couple of months and so its all a bit new.

 

I do use manual a bit and have just bought a light meter which I suspect will mean I use manual a fair bit more. Despite the metering on my D2x being pretty fool-proof I did use manual a fair bit on it so it's just getting used to the M8 metering really.

[Nicoleica]

The meter area, the area the meter meters off of, in the M8 is always the same size.

If you are using a wide angle lens the meter sees a larger area of the scene, just as the lens captures a larger area. If you are using a telephoto lens the meter sees a narrower area of the scene, just as the lens captures a smaller area.

 

So with a telephoto lens the meter becomes more of a spot, NOT a real spot (more center weigthed spot), meter and no spot at all when using a wide angle lens.

 

Also, as wide angle lenses tend to have the rear element closer to the shutter blind (Don't forget that there is a space between this and the sensor.), and the light rays are at a sharper angle, a larger percentage of the image will reflect off of the white patch onto the metering cell than with a telephoto lens where the distance is greater, and the angles less sharp.

[Gawain Hewitt]

Yep that makes sense now thanks. I had it back to front in my head!

Gawain

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[exile]

For preset street shooting where I'm rapidly moving in and out of shade I use Aperture Priority mode set at - 2/3 compensation, with the lens set to about f/5.6 and zone focused within a few meters of me and ISO usually at about 360. This isn't always great, but it does reduce the chance of blown highlights and gives you a file you can work with.

 

For more considered shots I decide on an aperture setting, then take an exposure reading off the palm of my hand and slow the shutter speed (rather than open up the lens) by half a stop. i.e. rotate the shutter dial clockwise half a click (so that the red arrow on the right pointing towards the central LED is illuminated). Obviously if I adjust the ISO if I think I’m going to have camera shake or subject movement issues.

 

For landscapes I slap on a polarising filter rotated so that the calibration mark faces the sun, and then meter off the blue sky. If it's cloudy I expose to the right to make sure I hold detail in the sky by metering off the clouds and opening up 1.5 stops by counting 3 clockwise clicks on the shutter dial. The same trick works on sand or snow. But most often the simplest thing to do if there isn't a lot of sky in the shot is set exposure based on a middle-gray luminance object like concrete or paving slabs in a city, or green vegetation everywhere else.

 

If it's really dark I tend to shoot at 1/20th second, f/1.2 and ISO 1250 simply because those are the limits of reliable acceptable quality for me when I need to push the envelope.

 

All of these techniques get me close enough as a starting point. I always check the first exposure in new lighting conditions using the histogram, and sometimes zoom in on highlights. But I don't aim for a totally perfect exposure in-camera, as I invariably pull or push the DNG in Lightroom afterwards depending on how I want to interpret the image. I have an old Seconic hand held incident meter that gives me 100% totally accurate readings every time, but I rarely use it for anything other than formal portraits - I'd rather take an extra lens in the bag.

 

On a few occasions (especially if I'm trying to be discrete but can't set A mode because I'm going to shoot a high contrast scene from the hip) I've tried simply guessing exposure values based on experience. That is tough. I usually make some kind of informed guesstimate based on the sunny 16 rule if I'm outside; opening up based on the level of cloud cover or shade, but I can't do it with any consistency yet, and indoors it's even harder I hope I'll get better with practice...

[ChrisC]

... if you were shooting at dusk and the streetlights were on would you meter off the brightest streetlight or find the brightest non-streetlight/specular highlight, meter off that and let the streetlights/specular highlights blow out?.

 

Pete - Apologies for the delayed response.

 

My caveat small-print clause was that I mostly shoot in daylight with the M8. In your example the streetlight would likely be too bright to not send everything else to the shadow wall, and I'd likely be interested in other stuff rather than the streetlight. If it really has to blow, it has to blow. But in your hypothetical situation I'd most likely be metering off the brightest highlight other than the hot streetlight, though the photographer in me would be trying to keep the streetlight out of my picture. If needs be, there are remedies of course - like tripod shooting and sandwiching exposure in post production.

 

Your hypothetical situation will be fairly common to e.g. wedding photographers when they move indoors and will often have very bright light sources behind their subjects; maybe if I were shooting in that way still I'd think about changing exposure compensation and go back to a more mid-grey style of metering. One way or another, if the light range exceeds the sensors ability to record - it's likely that highlights will be blown; it's ugly in prints, but sometimes unavoidable.

 

 

Try the method, it may be OK for you.

 

............... Chris