Shootist Posted October 5, 2009 Share #61 Â Posted October 5, 2009 Advertisement (gone after registration) why do people keep coming on to the x1 forum if they think this camera is not what they want. once they have stated that the camera is not for them, that should be enough. Â Simple. Everytime I logon to this site and then there is a reply to a thread I have replied to I get a email that there has been a reply and what that reply is. If it's quoting something I posted, and I feel like I need to reply, I come back to that thread and make the reply. If it's about something someone else posted and I have an opinion on it I will post a reply. Â It's that simple. Â Yes this camera is not for me. I personally don't see why anyone would want one for the MSR price Leica has placed on it. But then I don't know how other people think and what there specific needs are. That is what makes the internet forums go round. How dull would it be if every forum was "I like X" and all other posts/replies said the same thing. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted October 5, 2009 Posted October 5, 2009 Hi Shootist, Take a look here Why Are There So Many Negative Thoughts About the X1?. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
Guest dalethorn Posted October 5, 2009 Share #62  Posted October 5, 2009 I bought the Panasonic LX3 (their branding of the Leica D-Lux4) in Sept. 2008, with some dread, since I wasn't sure if it would be satisfactory, or whether it would last in the marketplace. That camera did at least one thing that my other small cameras would not do nearly as well - shoot indoors in average light without flash at ISO 800 and still produce a decent 8x10 inch print.  The amazing thing about the LX3/D-Lux4 is that it's been in the top 10 at DpReview ever since, with few exceptions. So, since I've owned Leica M's and the LX3, and the sensor is so much larger with the X1, I'm expecting the X1 to be the best carry-everywhere camera ever. And given the continued interest in the LX3, I also expect the X1 to be a class-leading camera for a long time, not just a few months.  And if Leica does come out with an X2, I hope it's long enough after the X1 for me to skip a lot of meals to pay for it. BTW, one of the greatest things Leica ever did for the D-Lux4 (LX3) was the brown shoulder case. You can take that anywhere and look really natty, not like a geek. Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/98083-why-are-there-so-many-negative-thoughts-about-the-x1/?do=findComment&comment=1063356'>More sharing options...
ottocrat Posted October 6, 2009 Share #63  Posted October 6, 2009 Hold on there. What IQ? Has any one seen images made from the production model/version of this camera ? If not then you really can't state that is has great or even good IQ.Build quality, see above but change IQ to BQ.  These are thing that are not yet know for sure.  So you will be buying one sight unseen, just on the feature set. Well obviously it should be understood that these are assumptions, and I certainly will not be buying sight unseen, that's why I'm waiting eagerly for the reviews. The Leica brand may instill a good deal of confidence but I won't part with €1600 on confidence alone, not even for Leica.  For the purpose of discussion, though, we are assuming that the X1 justifies its price by having superb IQ and BQ. If it doesn't then of course I won't be buying one and Leica will have missed an open goal. I'm fairly sure it will though. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ottocrat Posted October 6, 2009 Share #64  Posted October 6, 2009 This camera would be something I'd be very interest in if it had either a zoom lens or had a interchangeable lens. As it is the 35mm lens is my least used lens on both cropped and FF cameras. So why would I want a camera where that is the only lens. It really has nothing to do as consumer. It does have everything to do with how much would I use this $2000 camera instead of the M8, which I own, or M9, if I ever buy a M9. With either of those I can have the equivalent of a 35mm lens and have the option to use a variety of other FL lenses from 3 different manufacturures. Right now you can buy a M8 for just over what this X1 costs with even a larger sensor, if that is so important. With respect I think you contradict yourself. It has everything to do with consumers - but obviously a specifically targeted group of consumers. The camera is clearly not designed with you in mind. If I already had an M8 or M9 (I should be so lucky) then I would not be in the market for the X1. But I own a bulky consumer DSLR system and my strong preference is for shooting with a 35mm prime (effectively 50mm with the APS-C crop, so the X1 is slightly wider than I'd prefer, but it's not a deal breaker). This camera is aimed at me and the many other consumers like me.  I can understand your disappointment that this camera does not cater to your specific preferences; but then Leica already caters to your preferences, with the M9. This isn't for you, but it clearly strikes a chord with lots of people who aren't you. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shootist Posted October 6, 2009 Share #65  Posted October 6, 2009 With respect I think you contradict yourself. It has everything to do with consumers - but obviously a specifically targeted group of consumers. The camera is clearly not designed with you in mind. If I already had an M8 or M9 (I should be so lucky) then I would not be in the market for the X1. But I own a bulky consumer DSLR system and my strong preference is for shooting with a 35mm prime (effectively 50mm with the APS-C crop, so the X1 is slightly wider than I'd prefer, but it's not a deal breaker). This camera is aimed at me and the many other consumers like me. I can understand your disappointment that this camera does not cater to your specific preferences; but then Leica already caters to your preferences, with the M9. This isn't for you, but it clearly strikes a chord with lots of people who aren't you.  Then why has this thread got four pages of replies and why the topic/thread title? I'm not alone in my thoughts on this camera. And I take it this thread was started because of all the negative reaction to it in other threads.  Yes it will appeal to some but not as many as it would of if it had a zoom fixed lens or a interchangeable lens system. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ottocrat Posted October 6, 2009 Share #66 Â Posted October 6, 2009 Then why has this thread got four pages of replies and why the topic/thread title? Well... because it appeals to some people and not to others! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ceflynn Posted October 6, 2009 Share #67 Â Posted October 6, 2009 Advertisement (gone after registration) The thread has a single, fixed topic, but can no longer be said to be compact. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bill Posted October 6, 2009 Share #68 Â Posted October 6, 2009 Then why has this thread got four pages of replies and why the topic/thread title?I'm not alone in my thoughts on this camera. And I take it this thread was started because of all the negative reaction to it in other threads. Â Yes it will appeal to some but not as many as it would of if it had a zoom fixed lens or a interchangeable lens system. Â I have other cameras that can zoom. Â A zoom adds complexity and cost. Â A zoom is often a compromise. Â I have other cameras that have interchangeable lenses. Â If it could take interchangeable lenses it may leach sales from the M9. Â I'm happy with the concept as it is, just as I was happy with my CM when I had that. Â I am in the target demographic, and Leica must think that demographic large enough to make it worth their while. I am sure a zoom version will follow, as with the Minilux and the CM, in due course but that would be of less interest to me. Â Regards, Â Bill Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
andym911 Posted October 10, 2009 Share #69  Posted October 10, 2009 just what we need, a fixed lens M type compact camera.....  hey lets not forget those Leica hero's shot with either a 35 or a 50 right.....well this has a 35 or thereabouts so could it be better?  I think not...much more exiting than the M9, my order is in for the M6 with fixed 35 Cron in Digital...... Zoom lens, no thanks. Just perfect  andy Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daniel Ortego Posted October 12, 2009 Share #70  Posted October 12, 2009 Dang, this thread certainly is lively! I purchased an M8 with four Leica primes, which put a real dent in my savings account. Had I just stuck with the 28-cron and not jumped in with both feet, I would likely have been satisfied. Still, I wasn't really that good with the manual focus but I do miss it.  Today I have the DL4 and the external flash, along with the nice brown case. It’s great for indoor low light shooting and the external flash is seldom used. Still, I’m not really keen on the controls and it's simply too small to hold comfortably. I guess I was spoiled with my M8 with the grip and the "thumbs Up".  The X1 appears to be more simplistic and has a very similar layout to that of my M8. I’m hoping the X1 with the optional grip will handle well, shoot well, and exceed that of my DL4. If my third roll of the dice is the cats meow than I can live with the 2k+ investment. In fact, mine is already ordered. Regards, Dan Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
robofc Posted October 12, 2009 Share #71 Â Posted October 12, 2009 The X1 needs a much better screen. It should be 900k for the money Leica is charging. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
sungnee Posted October 12, 2009 Share #72 Â Posted October 12, 2009 Ah, maybe for those of us whose first camera was a fixed lens, the X1 is very comfortable. Â My first camera was an Olympus Pen. First came out in 1959 but I didn't buy it until 10 years later. It had no range finder, no meter, and it was half-frame (half the size of 135 film). Â I had to do everything manually, including guessing the distance. Believe me, you learn depth of field real quick. Â I have a Minilux and 2 CM's. And I'm very happy with them. So I'm getting the X1. Actually, a range-finder X1 will fit me even better, but my guess is that it will be even MORE expensive! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jackart Posted October 12, 2009 Share #73  Posted October 12, 2009 Ah, maybe for those of us whose first camera was a fixed lens, the X1 is very comfortable. My first camera was an Olympus Pen. First came out in 1959 but I didn't buy it until 10 years later. It had no range finder, no meter, and it was half-frame (half the size of 135 film).  I had to do everything manually, including guessing the distance. Believe me, you learn depth of field real quick.  I have a Minilux and 2 CM's. And I'm very happy with them. So I'm getting the X1. Actually, a range-finder X1 will fit me even better, but my guess is that it will be even MORE expensive!  I so much agree with You. People tend to forget the essence of protography cause of information overload of different gadgets!  Jaak Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
rayoflight Posted October 12, 2009 Share #74  Posted October 12, 2009 Hold on there. What IQ? Has any one seen images made from the production model/version of this camera ? If not then you really can't state that is has great or even good IQ.  I'll be rude. The IQ of the X1 sucks... For 2000 dollars, one would ask for more. See the original Spanish article here: DSLR Magazine - Leica X1  Pictures: http://www.exakta.net/images/stories/Pruebas/X1-Prueba-up/X1-monumento-3-AAA.jpg http://www.exakta.net/images/stories/Pruebas/X1-Prueba-up/X1-monumento-2-AAA.jpg  The 2 two sample pictures are simply boring, yes. Still, technically the images are not better than a Panasonic Micro 4/3. Full of C.A., and blurry even at f/11! So, is this a real Leica?? Every camera nowadays seems to have automatic corrections for nearly every optical (geometrical, chromatic) defect, but Leica omitted them here, I suppose. The images from the M9 I've seen on this forum and from other photographers, are much better. (Different price range, though.)  The results can be judged as "very good, extraordinary" etc. if the samples are fully wonderful landscapes or macro shots or something else, a nice scene / composition (see Sigma DP-1, DP-2 promo images. But this is... I don't know. Let you tell. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jackart Posted October 12, 2009 Share #75  Posted October 12, 2009 The IQ of the X1 sucks... For 2000 dollars, one would ask for more. See the original Spanish article here:DSLR Magazine - Leica X1  Pictures: http://www.exakta.net/images/stories/Pruebas/X1-Prueba-up/X1-monumento-3-AAA.jpg http://www.exakta.net/images/stories/Pruebas/X1-Prueba-up/X1-monumento-2-AAA.jpg  The 2 two sample pictures are simply boring, yes. And, technically the images are not better than a Panasonic Micro 4/3. Full of C.A., and blurry even at f/11! So, is this a real Leica??  The results can be judged as "very good, extraordinary" etc. if the samples are fully wonderful landscapes or macro shots or something else, a nice scene / composition (see Sigma DP-1, DP-2 promo images. But this is... I dont know. Let you tell.  Just a thought. These are progressive JPG-s. Did You wait until 3.-d progression appeared. On my screen its shap after few minutes of waiting.  I agree, that test shots were extremely boring and its quite hard to make any judgements from these images. Still, I found that whites are very detailed and well exposed on monumento-3-a, look at the text on the monument.  Jaak Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
rayoflight Posted October 12, 2009 Share #76  Posted October 12, 2009 Just a thought. These are progressive JPG-s. Did You wait until 3.-d progression appeared. On my screen its shap after few minutes of waiting. I agree, that test shots were extremely boring and its quite hard to make any judgements from these images. Still, I found that whites are very detailed and well exposed on monumento-3-a, look at the text on the monument.  Jaak  Jaak, I understand the progressive JPGs. Sure I waited to download. Yes, this is (as) sharp (as it can be), but a cheap film P&S makes sharper images, doesn't it? Look at the other one as well. Gabor Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest dalethorn Posted October 13, 2009 Share #77  Posted October 13, 2009 Jaak, I understand the progressive JPGs. Sure I waited to download. Yes, this is (as) sharp (as it can be), but a cheap film P&S makes sharper images, doesn't it? Look at the other one as well.Gabor  After carefully examining these two photos I had these impressions:  1. Good quality - the green foliage is really tough for any camera, and whatever took these did as good a job as a Panasonic G1.  2. These are pre-production by many(!) weeks, and the camera software that produces these is where most changes are going to take place before final shipments begin.  3.If a pre-production Leica X1 actually took these photos, I'm very optimistic about the final product. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
sungnee Posted October 13, 2009 Share #78 Â Posted October 13, 2009 After carefully examining these two photos I had these impressions:Â 1. Good quality - the green foliage is really tough for any camera, and whatever took these did as good a job as a Panasonic G1. Â 2. These are pre-production by many(!) weeks, and the camera software that produces these is where most changes are going to take place before final shipments begin. Â 3.If a pre-production Leica X1 actually took these photos, I'm very optimistic about the final product. Â I would just like to draw everyone's attention to the EXIF. The Jpg has been compressed, level 6 (whatever that means). And the software was Adobe CS3. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
rayoflight Posted October 13, 2009 Share #79 Â Posted October 13, 2009 I would just like to draw everyone's attention to the EXIF. The Jpg has been compressed, level 6 (whatever that means). And the software was Adobe CS3. Â Every JPG is compressed by definition. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bill Posted October 13, 2009 Share #80 Â Posted October 13, 2009 Every JPG is compressed by definition. Â Of course - it is a lossy format. But not all Jpgs are equal - some are more compressed than others, and it is handy to know the degree of compression. Â Regards, Â Bill Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.