terrycioni Posted September 12, 2009 Share #1 Posted September 12, 2009 Advertisement (gone after registration) Greetings, I was being a little smug about how my M8s, after pretty close to three years, have been operating without any serious problems. Unfortunately today ended that! I was on assignment - fortunately I had two M8 bodies as I usually do. It was strange - I fired the first three frames no problem - then it went into continuous motor mode - motor was winding/turning but the shutter wasn't opening and closing. I had to take the battery out to get it to stop. I returned the battery to the camera and I could get one shot off and then it would start doing the same thing. I was using freshly charged batteries.... My other M8 (which has been in for a minor service worked flawlessly). I am not ready to write off the M8 just yet - they have been stellar performers for me with quality output. For tertiary backup I keep an M6 handy, I didn't load it up after all, but it was comforting to know it was there..... I dropped it off at my local dealer and it will makes it way to NJ sometime next week. Best regards to all. Terry. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted September 12, 2009 Posted September 12, 2009 Hi terrycioni, Take a look here Smug..... I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
PeterP Posted September 13, 2009 Share #2 Posted September 13, 2009 Greetings, I was being a little smug about how my M8s, after pretty close to three years, have been operating without any serious problems. Unfortunately today ended that! I was on assignment - fortunately I had two M8 bodies as I usually do. It was strange - I fired the first three frames no problem - then it went into continuous motor mode - motor was winding/turning but the shutter wasn't opening and closing. I had to take the battery out to get it to stop. I returned the battery to the camera and I could get one shot off and then it would start doing the same thing. I was using freshly charged batteries.... My other M8 (which has been in for a minor service worked flawlessly). I am not ready to write off the M8 just yet - they have been stellar performers for me with quality output. For tertiary backup I keep an M6 handy, I didn't load it up after all, but it was comforting to know it was there..... I dropped it off at my local dealer and it will makes it way to NJ sometime next week. Best regards to all. Terry. Sorry to hear that Terry, that was the same problem I experienced, last Nov.Just took NJ to long to repair it (10 weeks). But since then has been fine. Cheers, Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
terrycioni Posted September 13, 2009 Author Share #3 Posted September 13, 2009 Sorry to hear that Terry, that was the same problem I experienced, last Nov.Just took NJ to long to repair it (10 weeks). But since then has been fine. Cheers, Hi Peter, 10 weeks yikes! I hope service has improved since then, fingers crossed. You are a patient man - I would have been very unhappy! Cheers, Terry Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
farnz Posted September 13, 2009 Share #4 Posted September 13, 2009 Terry, Sorry to hear about your recent problem but happy that your M8's have performed so faithfully fro so long. Did you have it set to Discreet Mode at the time because Discreet and Continuous don't play together well and there have been reports of similar occurences? It appears that the M8's processor gets confused about what 'state' the shutter is in because the delayed recock is obviously slower than it would expect during a continuous burst. Apologies if this isn't your problem. Pete. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shootist Posted September 13, 2009 Share #5 Posted September 13, 2009 Greetings, I was being a little smug about how my M8s, after pretty close to three years, have been operating without any serious problems. Unfortunately today ended that! I was on assignment - fortunately I had two M8 bodies as I usually do. It was strange - I fired the first three frames no problem - then it went into continuous motor mode - motor was winding/turning but the shutter wasn't opening and closing. I had to take the battery out to get it to stop. I returned the battery to the camera and I could get one shot off and then it would start doing the same thing. I was using freshly charged batteries.... My other M8 (which has been in for a minor service worked flawlessly). I am not ready to write off the M8 just yet - they have been stellar performers for me with quality output. For tertiary backup I keep an M6 handy, I didn't load it up after all, but it was comforting to know it was there..... I dropped it off at my local dealer and it will makes it way to NJ sometime next week. Best regards to all. Terry. Terry sorry to hear of this. I do hope Leica fixes this free of charge even though the camera is out of warranty. This is a known problem with the M8 and should be covered. Maybe you could get Leica to put in the newer slower shutter at the same time, which has had this problem IIRC. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
terrycioni Posted September 13, 2009 Author Share #6 Posted September 13, 2009 Terry, Sorry to hear about your recent problem but happy that your M8's have performed so faithfully fro so long. Did you have it set to Discreet Mode at the time because Discreet and Continuous don't play together well and there have been reports of similar occurences? It appears that the M8's processor gets confused about what 'state' the shutter is in because the delayed recock is obviously slower than it would expect during a continuous burst. Apologies if this isn't your problem. Pete. Hi Pete, I had read about this very problem with discreet mode so I have been careful. I hope this doesn't turn into a nightmare. I do a fair amount of NGO work and I have several assignments coming up and this work is ideal for the digital Leica. Thank you Pete. Best regards, Terry Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
terrycioni Posted September 13, 2009 Author Share #7 Posted September 13, 2009 Advertisement (gone after registration) Terry sorry to hear of this. I do hope Leica fixes this free of charge even though the camera is out of warranty. This is a known problem with the M8 and should be covered.Maybe you could get Leica to put in the newer slower shutter at the same time, which has had this problem IIRC. Thanks, I hope they do to fix it for free - a good deal of this work because it is NGO is free or close to it. The M8's are perfect and when it comes to work they are certainly my choice. I did mention to the dealer that the newer shutter would be an option. I have since sent an email to the local rep who happens to be a great fellow with a family that has a long history selling Leica. So he gets it. Thanks for your concern and comments. Terry Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
terrycioni Posted September 25, 2009 Author Share #8 Posted September 25, 2009 Terry sorry to hear of this. I do hope Leica fixes this free of charge even though the camera is out of warranty. This is a known problem with the M8 and should be covered.Maybe you could get Leica to put in the newer slower shutter at the same time, which has had this problem IIRC. Just got the word yesterday - shutter is OK but something about the electronics that makes the shutter operate being wonky. They want $350US dollars or about 400CDN to repair it. My guess is this more their problem than mine...but so it goes! Leica New Jersey are pirates - plain and simple, especially given the amount of use this particular M8 body has had. Best regards, Terry Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
scott kirkpatrick Posted September 25, 2009 Share #9 Posted September 25, 2009 Terry, are you using classic or upgraded M8s? I had one M8 go down this path before the firmware made battery-out recovery possible. It went to Leica NJ and was back in a few weeks, spending less than a week actually in the shop. I subsequently upgraded that one, and also have an 8.2. Except for the occasional stall when shooting very fast in discreet or discreet-C, no problems. scott Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
terrycioni Posted September 25, 2009 Author Share #10 Posted September 25, 2009 Terry, are you using classic or upgraded M8s? I had one M8 go down this path before the firmware made battery-out recovery possible. It went to Leica NJ and was back in a few weeks, spending less than a week actually in the shop. I subsequently upgraded that one, and also have an 8.2. Except for the occasional stall when shooting very fast in discreet or discreet-C, no problems. scott Hi Scott, It is a classic, that had been running well - I use my 'other body' far more than this one. It failed for no apparent reason with about 7500 actuations. The camera has not been abused or dropped - so I am feeling somewhat annoyed. That said there is not much I can do but express my unhappiness, I guess:mad: I think the folks in Europe get far better service/treatment than we here in North America. Cheers, Terry. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
scott kirkpatrick Posted September 25, 2009 Share #11 Posted September 25, 2009 Hi Scott, It is a classic, that had been running well - I use my 'other body' far more than this one. It failed for no apparent reason with about 7500 actuations. The camera has not been abused or dropped - so I am feeling somewhat annoyed. That said there is not much I can do but express my unhappiness, I guess:mad: I think the folks in Europe get far better service/treatment than we here in North America. Cheers, Terry. My classic failed at about 5000 actuations. After service and upgrade it has done 10,000 or so more without incident. I think a higher than desirable rate of shutter problems was one of the reasons for the upgraded shutter. Reducing the top speed brought down more than just the sound, they also measured much less shock on the mechanism and the rewind force needed has to be less. scott Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shootist Posted September 25, 2009 Share #12 Posted September 25, 2009 My classic failed at about 5000 actuations. After service and upgrade it has done 10,000 or so more without incident. I think a higher than desirable rate of shutter problems was one of the reasons for the upgraded shutter. Reducing the top speed brought down more than just the sound, they also measured much less shock on the mechanism and the rewind force needed has to be less. scott So what you are really saying is the original shutter will fail much faster then the upgraded one and can happen at any time, number of activations. That is why I said to Terry it is a KNOWN problem. Leica knows about it and in Terry's case want to charge him for a problem they know will surface at any time with any M8 classic. Terry I'd give Roger Horn a call. He is, or was, the president of Leica USA. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
terrycioni Posted September 25, 2009 Author Share #13 Posted September 25, 2009 So what you are really saying is the original shutter will fail much faster then the upgraded one and can happen at any time, number of activations. That is why I said to Terry it is a KNOWN problem. Leica knows about it and in Terry's case want to charge him for a problem they know will surface at any time with any M8 classic. Terry I'd give Roger Horn a call. He is, or was, the president of Leica USA. Thank you, I fully intend to do just that. The other shoe dropped today when I was triumphantly told it could take up to four weeks, but then again it could take two weeks. I was old told there would be shipping and additional HANDLING charges. I am not sure what LEICA USA considers service but we shall see how this plays-out. Monday I will be contacting Roger Horn. Best regards, Terry. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shootist Posted September 25, 2009 Share #14 Posted September 25, 2009 I was old told there would be shipping and additional HANDLING charges. I am not sure what LEICA USA considers service but we shall see how this plays-out. Monday I will be contacting Roger Horn. Best regards, Terry. What, shipping and handling charges. Maybe because you are in Canada? I just got my M7 back today, had the DX reader updated. I paid to send it to Leica NJ. They sent it to Solms. Solms sent it back to NJ and they sent it to me. My cost for shipping, the cost to ship it to NJ from Atlanta. Cost for the DX reader update, a cursory cleaning, Checking the shutter speeds and meter and adjusting if needed and check and adjust the rangefinder, $00.00. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
terrycioni Posted September 25, 2009 Author Share #15 Posted September 25, 2009 What, shipping and handling charges.Maybe because you are in Canada? I just got my M7 back today, had the DX reader updated. I paid to send it to Leica NJ. They sent it to Solms. Solms sent it back to NJ and they sent it to me. My cost for shipping, the cost to ship it to NJ from Atlanta. Cost for the DX reader update, a cursory cleaning, Checking the shutter speeds and meter and adjusting if needed and check and adjust the rangefinder, $00.00. Yes, very strange, I am not sure it has anything to do with Canada, but I am at this point extremely disappointed with the so called 'service' so far. Best regards, Terry Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
terrycioni Posted September 29, 2009 Author Share #16 Posted September 29, 2009 Good news - my M8 will be returned by the end of the week! All things considered very good turn around from NJ. The bad news is $350US for the service . I find this troubling in that the camera has not been abused or dropped and has in my opinion a very low shutter actuation count at 7500. I think I can safely say I am contributing to the cost of the initial poor quality control on the M8. It does come back with a one year warranty included. Once again the local Leica rep was absolutely excellent as was the the Canadian national sales manager, good people all around and they helped me navigate the repair to and from NJ and I'm not even a "Canadian" web blogger of any importance:). My guess is that Leica USA will not be so generous in making things right with the M8 in the future. I like the camera and it's output or I would have long moved on by now. Here is what the service order included; The shutter mechanism will be repaired Shutter speeds will be adjusted to tolerance Upgrade to current standard Check and adjust for good working order Thanks every one for the advice and encouragement.... Best regards, Terry PS You Leica users in Europe/Great Britain should be grateful for the quality service afforded you by your location. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shootist Posted September 29, 2009 Share #17 Posted September 29, 2009 Good news - my M8 will be returned by the end of the week! All things considered very good turn around from NJ. The bad news is $350US for the service . I find this troubling in that the camera has not been abused or dropped and has in my opinion a very low shutter actuation count at 7500. I think I can safely say I am contributing to the cost of the initial poor quality control on the M8. It does come back with a one year warranty included. Once again the local Leica rep was absolutely excellent as was the the Canadian national sales manager, good people all around and they helped me navigate the repair to and from NJ and I'm not even a "Canadian" web blogger of any importance:). My guess is that Leica USA will not be so generous in making things right with the M8 in the future. I like the camera and it's output or I would have long moved on by now. Here is what the service order included; The shutter mechanism will be repaired Shutter speeds will be adjusted to tolerance Upgrade to current standard Check and adjust for good working order Thanks every one for the advice and encouragement.... Best regards, Terry PS You Leica users in Europe/Great Britain should be grateful for the quality service afforded you by your location. Terry that is what the $350 is for, the one year warranty on the whole camera, hopefully. Which IMHO isn't that bad. I'd gladly pay that for a one year warranty. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
andybarton Posted September 29, 2009 Share #18 Posted September 29, 2009 The M8 I borrowed from my dealer for a weekend had exactly this same problem. That one was about 3 weeks old. One of the reasons why I didn't buy one. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
terrycioni Posted September 29, 2009 Author Share #19 Posted September 29, 2009 Terry that is what the $350 is for, the one year warranty on the whole camera, hopefully. Which IMHO isn't that bad. I'd gladly pay that for a one year warranty. Agreed, I have concluded that what I bought was a one year warranty and to the end the 350$ is well spent. Anyway - we march on! Best regards, Terry. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
terrycioni Posted September 29, 2009 Author Share #20 Posted September 29, 2009 The M8 I borrowed from my dealer for a weekend had exactly this same problem. That one was about 3 weeks old. One of the reasons why I didn't buy one. Hi Andy, If I could wind back the clock it might be a different story. In some perverse way your experience makes me feel better - I questioned whether it was something I had done to cause the problem. I can stop that now:). The one year warranty is I suppose worth something and in this case 350$US as for the repair it sounds like a problem the M8 has had rather than something I did! Best regards, Terry Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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