marknorton Posted September 13, 2009 Share #21 Posted September 13, 2009 Advertisement (gone after registration) Gosh, I thought that brassy black paint M4 and MP's were considered really sexy, at least my M4 is. If it shows brass though it will be very traditional, but I don't think that color is underneath. Who cares if it wears, it's just a camera. The point is the photograph and here's what a Leica lense can do when it sees infrared, too.. By some, maybe, but not me. By the way, it's "lens", not "lense". Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted September 13, 2009 Posted September 13, 2009 Hi marknorton, Take a look here M9 - Paint Only, No Chrome.... I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
rob_x2004 Posted September 13, 2009 Share #22 Posted September 13, 2009 The idea that an M camera somehow has character when it looks like it has been to Hell and back is just nonsense The idea that a Leica can go to hell and back is a nonsense. Ps ... I like the white. Looks good. At surcharge though, credibility kicks it in the teeth. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
dkCambridgeshire Posted September 13, 2009 Share #23 Posted September 13, 2009 I've already emailed Stefan Daniel about the glass and lack of silver chrome which I have found to be the more hard wearing of the M8 finishes. There's a dealer in London, Richard Caplan, who used to have the pathetic slogan: "Where the Elite Meet and Greet". Yuck! This is what they say now: "The marks of usage only endear. The way you hold your particular Leica, the events which befall it, only serve to distinguish your Leica from any other." They are idiots, truly, and I will not deal with them, period. You can be completely certain that, come resale time, those "marks of usage" will count heavily against you. They come out with some balderdash and piffle phrases and seem to be really scraping the bottom of the barrel if 'The marks of usage ...' is the latest. Somehow reminds me of the equally silly and elitist Patek line about " ... you merely look after it for the next generation" Cheers dunk Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
BKK dan Posted September 13, 2009 Share #24 Posted September 13, 2009 Or you who wear the M8 around the neck and shoulder, no probs with scratched LCD screens? Most robust body, but cheap screen ... the downgrade from the M8.2 just doesn't add up. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Olsen Posted September 13, 2009 Share #25 Posted September 13, 2009 I think it's a fundamental mistake to have removed the indications of remaining battery power and card capacity from an at-a-glance display. My opinion is that was the most important for Leica to keep cost down/profits up to make the M-system survive. To find the battery status in the menu is just a habit. No big deal. The same with number of exposure status. This had it's most importance when we had only 34 - 36 frames to a roll. Now that we have several hundred frames to a card, we don't have to watch it that closely. - If at all. Leica has stuck to what was important and to keep cost down. Excellent! If anything should be more readily available today - preferably in the viewfinder, it is the current ISO setting. This is something we manipulate all the time on a modern digital camera. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shootist Posted September 13, 2009 Share #26 Posted September 13, 2009 If anything should be more readily available today - preferably in the viewfinder, it is the current ISO setting. This is something we manipulate all the time on a modern digital camera. Not for me. I usually set it for whatever light I'm in and forget about it. If I'm going into different light then I will change it but mainly I use 320 ISO as my default and then lower it to 160 if i'm in bright light. Haven't use the Auto ISO feature since about two weeks after it was added. I do go all the way to 1250 but that is rare and have used 2500 when I know I'll be coverting to B&W. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
erg Posted September 13, 2009 Share #27 Posted September 13, 2009 Advertisement (gone after registration) So, what can we do to get a black chrome option and a saphire glass for the M9 ? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Olsen Posted September 13, 2009 Share #28 Posted September 13, 2009 Erg, A chrome version, and I am sure, a 'piano-paint' version will be launched as special editions with price premium later on. I think that we will see more of these 'special editions' with special colours, paint jobs and accessories like sapphire glass etc. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
BKK dan Posted September 13, 2009 Share #29 Posted September 13, 2009 I'd like to send a petition to Leica demanding an M9 with black chrome and saphire glass. Who is joining me ? Sapphire glass petition? Sure thing I'm in. Actually already sent them a letter. Where can I sign? The downgrade makes no sense. If I remember correctly Stefan Daniel said at one point that the upgrade program was not really sensible as more people could have bought an all new M8.2 instead of upgrades ... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
erg Posted September 13, 2009 Share #30 Posted September 13, 2009 Olsen, I don't know if you have read my previous post. It's not about accessoirs. It's about durability. According to informations from Leica, costs were the cause for dropping chrome and saphire. It's a downgrade in quality for economical reasons. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
erg Posted September 13, 2009 Share #31 Posted September 13, 2009 BKK, AFAIK the M8 saphire upgrade is still available. I'm wondering if the CS will do this upgrade on my M9 as well. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
wattsy Posted September 13, 2009 Share #32 Posted September 13, 2009 There's a dealer in London, Richard Caplan, who used to have the pathetic slogan: "Where the Elite Meet and Greet". Yuck! This is what they say now: "The marks of usage only endear. The way you hold your particular Leica, the events which befall it, only serve to distinguish your Leica from any other." The new slogan is even more nauseating than the old one and is just the kind of pretentious snob crap that Leica would do well to distance themselves from (though, in reality, they do their utmost to engender it). To be fair to Richard Caplan, the one time I went into his shop he went out of his way to be very helpful - even offering to deal directly with Contax (remember them?) on my behalf for a warranty issue with a grey market camera I had bought from a Hong Kong dealer. Classic Camera (before they hit skid row) would have 'politely' told me to piss off. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
lct Posted September 13, 2009 Share #33 Posted September 13, 2009 I would not merge the lcd and coating issues personally. Sapphire will cost a lot and is not necessary at all. A good screen protector will do it perfectly IMHO. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
wattsy Posted September 13, 2009 Share #34 Posted September 13, 2009 Does anyone have any reliable information (rather than guesswork) as to how much the sapphire screen is likely to cost Leica? I'd also be interested to know if the removal of the top plate LCD was done for cost reasons because I find it hard to believe that its removal is going to save more than a few pounds (£25?) in manufacturing cost per camera. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
georg Posted September 13, 2009 Share #35 Posted September 13, 2009 The missing LCD wasn't cost reduction, it was a design decision, it costs only a few €. Sapphire glass is something different, it becomes overproportional expensive with size and it has to be machined (borders) tor the M8.2 in a special way, only a few companies in the world can do that. A member of this forum has found this supplier which might give you an idea: TECHSPEC Sapphire Windows - Edmund Optics As said, Leica introduced painted models years ago, switched to chrome and back - even some more expensive special-models had paint-finish. I don't know about exact prices but neither of these finishes is cheap in this quality. I think it was about design, too. In comparison, the HSC-machined top plate alone costs a fortune. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
john_newell Posted September 13, 2009 Author Share #36 Posted September 13, 2009 Actually, I'd be interested in thoughts on why the sapphire glass is important anyway. I have always put some kind of protector on camera screens and lately have been using the GGS screens. They're inexpensive and easily installed (and replaced) but seem to wear like, well, sapphire glass, or nearly. The issue of cost- and corner-cutting on the metal finish bothers me a great deal more. Does anyone have any reliable information (rather than guesswork) as to how much the sapphire screen is likely to cost Leica? I'd also be interested to know if the removal of the top plate LCD was done for cost reasons because I find it hard to believe that its removal is going to save more than a few pounds (£25?) in manufacturing cost per camera. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
marknorton Posted September 13, 2009 Share #37 Posted September 13, 2009 If you want a custom LCD like that made, you pay an up-front tooling charge to a nice company in Taiwan who will then churn them out for buttons. There's a driver chip, a mounting bracket, a couple of screws, a flex print, edge connector and the glued-in lens, probably the biggest cost element. Ian's £25 will easily cover it. It worries me the M9 has been rushed out, sub-contracted out to Jenoptik, a product built for accountants not photographers. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
gwelland Posted September 13, 2009 Share #38 Posted September 13, 2009 I find the cost argument pretty weak. For a $7000 camera this is not a question of cost, it's a question of PROFIT. Nikon manage to put a hardened glass LCD cover on the back of the D3/D3X. I don't have an M9 yet to compare with my original M8 with the soft LCD cover that scratched easily - I hope the new one is more robust because that was one item I felt was worth upgrading with M8u and a factor in buying the M8.2. As regards chrome - I can't believe it's a significant cost difference in quantity. Leica seems to have managed it for the last 50 years from what I can tell. Top LCD: I must be one of the few that seldom used it. With large SD cards mine was maxed out most of the time anyway and the battery check isn't something that I'd find inconvenient as a menu option. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
erg Posted September 13, 2009 Share #39 Posted September 13, 2009 Top LCD: I must be one of the few that seldom used it. With large SD cards mine was maxed out most of the time anyway and the battery check isn't something that I'd find inconvenient as a menu option. I'm not so bent for the top LCD, but it was nice to make a battery check and see if the M8 was switched on or off with one glance. From the design standpoint the left corner appears slightly empty if you are used to the MP body. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
marknorton Posted September 13, 2009 Share #40 Posted September 13, 2009 Does anyone have any reliable information (rather than guesswork) as to how much the sapphire screen is likely to cost Leica? If you analyse the M8 upgrade costs into separate parts (framelines, glass, shutter, labour/logisitcs) it looks like this: Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! That suggests that even with the new inflated, encourage-the-punters-to-go-away pricing, the glass upgrade alone costs €500 but this will include a replacement rear casting and extra labour to swap everything over (buttons, thumbwheel, LCD, DSP board and so on). Suggests to me the sapphire glass itself costs no more than €250. Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! That suggests that even with the new inflated, encourage-the-punters-to-go-away pricing, the glass upgrade alone costs €500 but this will include a replacement rear casting and extra labour to swap everything over (buttons, thumbwheel, LCD, DSP board and so on). Suggests to me the sapphire glass itself costs no more than €250. ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/96367-m9-paint-only-no-chrome/?do=findComment&comment=1033324'>More sharing options...
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