My suggestion: Leica M9 with R solution

[cnguyen]

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Say for the new M9 if it were to be full frame and live view . Leica could give us the following that would satisfy R owners like myself (currently using R lenses on 5D surrogate camera):

 

- ability to manually dial in the lens focal length/f stop in menu for vignette/cyan corrections and metering.

 

- adapter to mount R lenses on M/8/M9 and it doesn't have to have electronic contacts since you can set it in the menu.

 

Voila Leica ! We have an R solution for our die-hard R users. And don't worry about corners unsharpness we will crop the pics if we have to....

 

What about the rumors of M9 using the Canon 21mp chip with live view ?

[earleygallery]

Say for the new M9 if it were to be full frame and live view . Leica could give us the following that would satisfy R owners like myself (currently using R lenses on 5D surrogate camera):

 

- ability to manually dial in the lens focal length/f stop in menu for vignette/cyan corrections and metering.

 

- adapter to mount R lenses on M/8/M9 and it doesn't have to have electronic contacts since you can set it in the menu.

 

Voila Leica ! We have an R solution for our die-hard R users. And don't worry about corners unsharpness we will crop the pics if we have to....

 

What about the rumors of M9 using the Canon 21mp chip with live view ?

 

So using an M9 with R lenses (stop down metering and MF) a la digicam on the LCD? No thanks! Try using that with anything longer than a 90mm.

[cnguyen]

You can manual focus with a magnified hi-res lcd and ir's not so bad really. I'm doing it with a G1 90-400mm (35mm equiv.) . Some people will complain about the glare off lcd and we can fix that right up with hoodman.

We all aware that Leica will not give us an R digital camera so I'm suggesting a solution for an existing doable platform which the M9 due to come out sooner or later.

[rick_dykstra]

If the M9 has live view, this solution is a goer.

 

It would be a very handy bonus if the M9 firmware included lookup tables for the vignetting characteristics of the R lens in use. Not hard to do and something of a selling point.

 

As cnguyen (full name please?) points out, a problem could be whether the imaging quality from using R lenses will be impacted by any kind of offset microlenses on the M9 sensor. It may be that the edges of the sensor can't handle photons coming from such different directions, i.e. from sharp angles with the M wides and from much straighter with the R teles.

[mgcd]

Totally useless as far as needs like mine would be concerned, most subjects would have to be rather static and frankly if I wanted a rangefinder I wouldn't be using Rs...

[cnguyen]

With this solution you can also use the 19mm f2.8 R , 15mm , etc all the way to the telyt. I would be willing to crop if corners are not sharp. I think the next chip will have live view. With live view chip Leica can also expand the M focal length range now beyond 135mm. So it's a win-win situation.

The focal length menu entry is a definite plus.

Charles

[Riley]

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I think this isnt so easy for Leica fans, and anyway we would find Canon wouldnt relinquish a FF chip for outside use. Of the available sensor builders there is Kodak and Sony. I think your idea is very close but not the solution, I have thought about this for some time and have the following answer.

 

I believe M9 chassis exist with FF chips, there might be a problem in that they havent completely succeeded for M lenses, but R lenses do not share that difficulty. So lets begin with the guts of M9 and the guts of R9. Parts required are the M9 sensor and board, all the M9 firmware, R9 mirrorbox and OVF. The remainder of the body is a simple injection moulded plastic chassis with top and bottom decks, this is neither difficult or expensive.

 

This time shave the mount, so that the register is short for R lenses by 6mm. This allows for the use of an EPROM programmable adapter for every R lens which communicates to the camera. The camera will know what lens is aboard and be able to cope adjustments for the e/v of each lens and vignetting etc via firmware.

 

EPROM adapter would be available pre programmed or could be field programmable for a given lens via the camera. It has a screw drive to operate the aperture lever of the lens, so it isnt like stop down metering as it meters from wide open and moves the aperture lever to user selected aperture as the mirror comes up.

 

The adapter is a key component not an accessory, lenses are mounted wide open. Lenses will not work without the adapter. This allows for:

 

• manual focus with focus confirmation,
  
• automatic e/v adjustment for R lenses from onboard lens database,
  
• no stop down metering, lenses meter from wide open
  
• speed priority or aperture priority shooting is enabled
  
• It enters into the FL and aperture of the lens into the EXIF.
  
• Selectable trap focus shooting, shutter fires on focus
  
• User selectable Focus point from rear LCD, default centre Focus point
  

 

The body has a speed dial on the top of the deck with an A position and indent, and a thumb wheel for aperture located in front of the release with A position and indent. The ISO wheel is located on the upper right deck and has an A position. The OVF has inserted a readout for aperture, speed and e/v, ISO. The body has a form of liveview with a separate sensing unit inside the OVF system ala E330 and whatever that Sony was [], this allows for CDAF with user selectable focus point.

 

Expected costing

$5,000 for FF sensor and boards

$800 for liveview sensor and CDAF royalties to Pansonic

$1,000 for body components with R9 OVF

$200 per adapter

15% for amortisation of R&D

 

Basic kit without lens but with programmable adapter $8050.

[cnguyen]

Riley - looks like you're taking my suggestion and turn it up to another noth. Cool ! We probably won't see an EVF in M9 but definitely we need a live view (comes with most current chips) . If you get a chance take a look at the current Pan G1 and Oly E-P1 to see what I'm talking about. In the M9 case we don't even ask Leica for AF or wide open metering. The stop down metering is fine as long as the LCD auto-compensate for brightness. So the implementation on the two features I suggested are not that difficult to accomplish.

Better yet say Leica can't give us a FF on M9 give us an M8.3 with new 1.3x chip with live view and lens focal length entry and that's it ! I'll go buy those adapters from HK

on Ebay...

[Riley]

the next technical leap for the industry is the full time electronic shutter, disposing the mechanical. This would free liveview of mirror gymnastics for SLRs and enable the use of the sensor for CDAF and full time EVF use as well full speed flash sync. Not all things all at once, but a wider variety of choices for designers.

[berndr]

Hello,

 

for me a M9 with 1.33 crop (or fullframe) with live view and the possibility to adapt an external EVF (on the flash shoe) just showing the liveview picture might be a solution.

 

I hope that future M lenses will have minimum distance much less then 0.7m one of the disadvantages of M lenses. Especially when there will be a new M1.4/35, a lense I'm very interested in.

 

Then I will be able to find a good mix of M and R lenses and I can stay as a leica customer.

 

But the main thing is that there must be a solution very fast, because I won't spend any more time in waiting on Leicas developments. I'm allready waited very long for nothing (R10)!

 

Regards,

Bernd.