mishima Posted May 27, 2009 Share #1 Posted May 27, 2009 Advertisement (gone after registration) Hi All ! I came across looking some recent compact camera reviews. It seems that the Sigma DP2 is quite a killer to D-Lux4. DP2 has the CMOS and also the SLR sensor that it claims. Any review and comment on this? Specification | SIGMA DP2 : Special Contents Many thanks fellas. Regards. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted May 27, 2009 Posted May 27, 2009 Hi mishima, Take a look here Sigma DP2 Vs D-Lux4 . I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
bill Posted May 27, 2009 Share #2 Posted May 27, 2009 Slower lens, one aspect ratio, one focal length, pricey... No thanks. Regards, Bill Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevelap Posted May 27, 2009 Share #3 Posted May 27, 2009 Hi All ! I came across looking some recent compact camera reviews. It seems that the Sigma DP2 is quite a killer to D-Lux4. DP2 has the CMOS and also the SLR sensor that it claims. Any review and comment on this? Specification | SIGMA DP2 : Special Contents Many thanks fellas. Regards. I don't have experience of either camera, but the unique features of the DP2 (and its predecessor the DP1) when compared to other P&S compacts are its approximately APS-H (cropped dslr) sized sensor and its prime (single focal length) lens. This sensor format is much bigger than the tiny sensors commonly used in this type of camera, larger even than the micro4/3rds format recently announced by Olympus and Panasonic, and prime lenses usually offer an advantage in image quality when compared to zooms. Although size isn't everything, its larger sensor coupled with a prime lens should mean that the DP2 is capable of producing much better overall image quality than the D-Lux 4, or any other small-sensor compact camera, and I'd be surprised if it didn't even with a slightly slower f/2.8 lens. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobtodrick Posted May 27, 2009 Share #4 Posted May 27, 2009 I feel the old 'so what' applies here. In the old (film) days it would be the same argument. Why use 35mm when there is 6x6 and 4x5. The quality of the bigger formats blow the 35mm out of the water. If the Sigma had a zoom, if it had a faster lens, if it had a better feel it would be a contender. It doesn't...so it don't. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
yanidel Posted May 27, 2009 Share #5 Posted May 27, 2009 I have owned a DP2 since three weeks. It is definitely not a M8 killer in terms of camera, but it will blow away any of the smaller sensor compacts (such as the D-Lux4). We are talking a sensor 7-10 bigger than other APN's. I did some comparative shots between M8 and DP2 and sharpness wise, they are on par, yet I feel the Leica lenses have more character, color rendition and better bokeh. The image size is also bigger on the M8. Noise at 800 is similar to M8 at 640 though a bit less saturated and finer. Above 640, the DP2 is noise is better IMO but it loses saturation very quickly. I do like the DP2 rendering of ISO1600 in black and white though, but for color work, I am not so sure. I think it is really a great complement to the M8 for these times you have to travel extra light. It is by no means a replacement as the M8 ergonomics, steadiness, responsiveness, easy of use, build quality are superior to the DP2 (for street photography at least). Nevertheless, with the external viewfinder, manual focus and aperture dedicated button, this as close as you can get to a full manual M camera in a compact size but large sensor. Not there yet, but getting closer. Which is good news. I posted large size samples on my blog at the time if you are interest. Street Photography in Paris Blog Archive Sigma DP2 samples Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest malland Posted May 27, 2009 Share #6 Posted May 27, 2009 yanidel, a lot of people complained about the DP1 in terms of its slowness in the handling, particularly for street photography. Has this been improved in the DP2? —Mitch/Bangkok Bangkok Street - a set on Flickr Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
yanidel Posted May 27, 2009 Share #7 Posted May 27, 2009 Advertisement (gone after registration) yanidel, a lot of people complained about the DP1 in terms of its slowness in the handling, particularly for street photography. Has this been improved in the DP2? —Mitch/Bangkok Bangkok Street - a set on Flickr If you use manual focus and at least ISO800 to ensure speeds of 1/500th in day conditions at least, you can work it out. That still means you need to use the focus dial to estimate distance. The way they have built the new aperture buttons is good as you can quickly adjust without looking at screen with some practice, same for distance dial. The shutter lag is almost non-existent but as it is a very light body, the lack of weight inertia (like with the M8) creates some blur if speeds are not high enough, this is my main struggle for the moment. So I tend to shoot at F2.8-5.6, ISO800, dial set at two meters (because I want out of focus backgrounds) and position me to accomodate. This way I usually get speeds high enough not to have motion blur. Autofocus is way too slow, especially for your type of work IMO but I think you would probably like the ISO800 and 1600 grain for your B&W conversions if I refer to the pictures you have on your Flickr. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest malland Posted May 27, 2009 Share #8 Posted May 27, 2009 Interesting, yanidel. On the GRD2 I didn't use AF either but pre-focused manually, often at 1.0, 1,2 or 1,5m. Even with the huge DOF of the GRD2 mis-focusing at these close distances is possible. The DP2 focusing wheel sounds very good. I also think the DP1 had some issues with a slow refresh rate on the LCD. Has that been fixed on the DP2? —Mitch/Bangkok Bangkok Street Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
chkphoto Posted May 27, 2009 Share #9 Posted May 27, 2009 mishima - are your sample images from JPEGs or processed from RAW? thanks in advance Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
yanidel Posted May 27, 2009 Share #10 Posted May 27, 2009 Interesting, yanidel. On the GRD2 I didn't use AF either but pre-focused manually, often at 1.0, 1,2 or 1,5m. Even with the huge DOF of the GRD2 mis-focusing at these close distances is possible. The DP2 focusing wheel sounds very good. I also think the DP1 had some issues with a slow refresh rate on the LCD. Has that been fixed on the DP2? I use the optical external viewfinder so don't pay to much attention to the LCD refresh rate. I guess it is the same on as DP1 as it is a bit crappy, more like one from 2-3 years ago. You can turn off screen which I find liberating It powers up if you change focus or aperture but as soon as you hit the shutter slightly it go off again. Here are a few "whatever" shots at ISO1600 taken a few minutes ago walking around my house to show you quality is still good and grain very fine. It also show the great capability to throw background off when wide open or close. Don't look too much at post-processing I did it in 5 minutes (b&w is not my thing ... ) The whole set can be seen larger here in slideshow Mod: Please read the forum rules with regards to posting non-Leica shots in the forum. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ceflynn Posted May 27, 2009 Share #11 Posted May 27, 2009 There is new firmware for the DP2: Firmware Download | SIGMA DP2 : Special Contents Ver. 1.01 * Decrease the phenomenon of intermittent camera freeze under certain conditions. * The accuracy of the Auto Focus has been improved. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
yanidel Posted May 27, 2009 Share #12 Posted May 27, 2009 There is new firmware for the DP2: Firmware Download | SIGMA DP2 : Special Contents Ver. 1.01 * Decrease the phenomenon of intermittent camera freeze under certain conditions. * The accuracy of the Auto Focus has been improved. thanks for the heads up, the camera freeze issue was indeed a recurring problem on my camera. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
mishima Posted May 28, 2009 Author Share #13 Posted May 28, 2009 mishima - are your sample images from JPEGs or processed from RAW? thanks in advance Hello ! Sorry mate. I didnt took any pictures. Those amazing outputs are produced by "Yanidel". Yanidel: Nice pictures you've got there! I just realize that the dP2 has no zoom features. Looking at Bill's remarks by the way, i juz realize that the DP2 indeed has no zoom feature. However the quality of the processing output, I'm awed with the power of this camera. The SLR chipset really makes the different? Btw Fellas, thanks for some of your feedbacks. I'm just a newbie in camera and im learning the art of taking good pictures. Not too much knowledge on camera technical features but im keen to understand them =) Regards, Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff S Posted May 28, 2009 Share #14 Posted May 28, 2009 The following doesn't support view of OP... The Online Photographer: Sigma DP2 Review Jeff Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
yanidel Posted May 28, 2009 Share #15 Posted May 28, 2009 The following doesn't support view of OP... The Online Photographer: Sigma DP2 Review Jeff I think it is a pretty accurate review as the reviewer considers the DP2 to be a P&S similar to D-Lux4 or G10. Nevertheless, his review emphasizes aspects that will obviously be of less appeal to rangefinder users such as : - LCD screen - menu interface - options - lack of zoom. Personally, I waited a year to buy a compact camera because I wanted to find in it a "compact rangefinder experience" with image quality close to M8 standards in order to have some consistency in my pictures. The DP2 is the first compact camera that comes close enough to it for the following reasons : - it has no zoom like any M series camera.... the 24mm lens corresponds roughly to a 35mm on the M8 or 41mm on FF equivalent. I use this focal 90% of time so to me I have my compact standard package alternative to the M8 when I cannot bring the latter one with me. - the external optical viewfinder has framelines so you can also have the advantage to compose and anticipate as any M series. It is pretty bright though sometimes the framelines are tough to see. I almost never use the LCD to frame. - the 2.8 lens on this 1.7x crop sensor means capability to play with thin DOF. This is was a must for me and impossible to get with the other P&S currently available. - focus and aperture can be modified manually without going through the screen like a M series. So you can walk in the street and change your settings without looking at camera after some practice. It does not have a focus patch though, so you will obviously rely on zone focusing a lot more, which I do anyways. - image quality is still very good at ISO800, fine at 1600 and usable at 3200 while most P&S start to have noise at 200. When doing street photography, this allows you to get higher speeds without degrading too much image quality. On the bad points I fully agree with the review on the below par build quality, lens motor noise and quirckiness. For the price level, it should have been better. As for the design, I personally like it a lot, it is sober but of course, this is up to personal taste. So to conclude, as a P&S camera, D-Lux4 and G10 are probably a better choice. As a small compact rangefinder alternative, the DP2 is IMO the only light compact camera on market today that offers similar characteristics to the M8 for street photography. Even if the M8 remains a much more adapted camera for this task. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ken_tanaka Posted May 28, 2009 Share #16 Posted May 28, 2009 Hello Folks, I wrote the current review of the Sigma DP2 for TOP. I also own multiple Leica cameras including the D-Lux 4. My opinion is that from a total product assessment the D-Lux 4 firmly kicks the DP2's butt. Yes, the DP2 -can- produce a nice image, but it's consistency is weak and the "best" images I got from from the DP2 often required quite some color nudging. As I've written here previously I have actually been very surprised by just how good D-Lux 4 images are. The JPGs look terrific, too. The camera's internal processing consistency is superb, the lens is sharp (with just a bit of barrel distortion at wide and close). Yes, it's 4mp lighter than the DP2 (or the Canon G10). But you're unlikely to ever lament its 10mp image files. Among the DP2, D-Lux 4, and G10 I would have to rate the image quality potential to be 1, 2, 3, respectively. But in terms of image quality consistency the D-Lux 4 would come in 1st place, with the DP2 in 3rd. The bottom line is that I returned the DP2 but never contemplated returning my D-Lux 4. It's a terrific, albeit pricey, compact camera. Just my opinions. Addendum: I saw a reference today that Sean Reid is preparing an extensive review of the D-Lux 4. I'm not a subscriber to his site but if I was shopping for a $700 camera I would most certainly invest in such a subscription. His reputation for quality reviews is impeccable. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bussta Posted May 28, 2009 Share #17 Posted May 28, 2009 Yanidel, Can you comment if the new firmware has made the autofocus issue better? has it brought it in line with most P&S cameras? is there some improvement? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
yanidel Posted May 28, 2009 Share #18 Posted May 28, 2009 I would say it take about 1 seconds for the autofocus to lock on subject. Maybe a little bit faster than before but anyways too slow to use in street photography unless you have a non moving object. It still struggles a lot in low light. The freeze issues seem to be gone though, which is good news. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
yanidel Posted May 28, 2009 Share #19 Posted May 28, 2009 Does your conclusion apply to street photography too ? Can you post some pictures taken with the D-Lux 4 to back your claim ? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ken_tanaka Posted May 28, 2009 Share #20 Posted May 28, 2009 Does your conclusion apply to street photography too ? Can you post some pictures taken with the D-Lux 4 to back your claim ? No. Tiny online 72 dpi images are largely worthless for any practical comparison. I've no interest in, or need to, "back my claim". You'll either have to accept my opinion or reject it. It matters not a whit to me. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.