advice: scanner and printer recommendations

[thomasw_]

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Is it possible to buy a good scanner/printer combination for film costing less than 1500? If so, which? If not, how much more would a working guy have to fork out? Any recommedations from scanner and printer owners? I have read a few reviews, but I am flummoxed. I want to hear from people who use the scanners and have made BW prints they are proud to show.

 

Thanks,

 

Thomas

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[john_r_smith]

Thomas

 

your budget of $1,500 is quite small for a real quality result from 35mm film. The problem for you lies more with the scanning side of things than with the printer, because to get good scans takes a piece of equipment with fine optics and the ability to hold the film truly flat. We have struggled with this issue here at work for several years now.

 

However, on the printing side you can get great results in B/W from the HP series of printers which use the # 100 or 102 photo-grey cartridges, which have three monochrome inks and which turn your printer into a dedicated B/W machine. The cheapest of these is the A4 HP 8050, which is now discontinued but there are still some around at big discounts. Still current is the A3 HP 8750, which uses the same ink system at around $600. They will both output a stunning B/W print as long as you use suitable paper - after many trials I have found HP Premium Plus in both gloss and satin to be the most reliable. A step up from this but a lot more expensive is the Epson 2400 which uses the K3 ink set, pigment based and used by many pros for fine-art work.

 

If you want to dip a toe in the water, how about getting a printer first and getting some scans done by a pro lab? Then you can see if you like this digital darkroom paradigm before you commit yourself to the scanner.

 

Best regards

 

John

[Guest Peter Pommes]

Is it possible to buy a good scanner/printer combination for film costing less than 1500? If so, which? If not, how much more would a working guy have to fork out? Any recommedations from scanner and printer owners? I have read a few reviews, but I am flummoxed. I want to hear from people who use the scanners and have made BW prints they are proud to show.

 

Thanks,

 

Thomas

 

I got the same problem as You and decided to buy the scanner first and get the printing done by internet services.

Currently there's a new model form HP, the B9180 on sale. It is said to be superior to the Epson R2400 at a lower price. This topic has been discussed here already. If You're interested in the B9180, there seems to be a bundle with calibrating software from Gretag Beth at a price of 700 €. Very interesting.

 

Peter

[john_r_smith]

Yes

 

the new HP 9180 does look interesting, but I would sound a word of caution -

 

if you are serious about B/W (and I really am) you want a printer where you can completely disable colour altogether. The HP printers I use (the 8050 and 8750) allow you to pull the colour cartridges out and just run on the photo grey cart. Certainly, you get some warning messages but you just ignore them. This way, you can be sure that you are getting true monochrome output and the printer is not sneaking in some colour behind your back. As far as I know you cannot do this with the 9180.

 

John

[pascal_meheut]

HP printer or Epson 2400 or any Epson (1290 for instance) with Piezo or UT7 dedicated B&W inks.

A Nikon LSV or a Minolta 5400 II if you can find one.

 

This should cost you slightly less than 1500 and with some experience and work, you'll get B&W prints you are proud to show. Mines are now very, very close to an enlargment made by a very fine and professionnal guy. But I spend a lot of time working my B&W scans and prints, much more than color.

[thomasw_]

Thomas

 

A step up from this but a lot more expensive is the Epson 2400 which uses the K3 ink set, pigment based and used by many pros for fine-art work.

 

Best regards

 

John

 

John et al,

 

Thanks a lot for your detailed replies. Yes, I am very serious about BW; it is a passion that I do not fully understand, but through BW film photography, I find great delight and joy in what I am able to record well! There is something so suggestive, not effable, but yet existing, that can be contemplated in beautiful BW film photography. Is it the tones, the rich subtly of the film? Something else? I don't know exactly. But I don't want to lose it through lame scans or prints. Truly it is my desire to try these 'digital darkroom' processes out if I can do so within my budget.

 

Just curious whether one can pull the colour cartridges in the Epson 2400?

 

Respectfully,

 

Thomas W.

[nrj]

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I have epson 1290 and recently bought the HP8450. The 8450 are recently discontinued and can be found for bargain prices. The print quality is superb (see photo-i for a review). They are A4 printers -great if they fit your needs.

Nik

[pascal_meheut]

Just curious whether one can pull the colour cartridges in the Epson 2400?

Thomas W.

 

Look here :

 

Piezography Home Page

 

and here :

 

MIS Black and White Ink Products

 

and here :

 

QuadToneRIP Overview

 

also :

Lysonic Quad Black Inks & Media

 

and the interesting Paul Roark:

 

PaulRoark.com -- Paul Roark's Photographic Home

 

Also, the Yahoo B&W printing discussion group has a lot of infos.

[Guest Bernd Banken]

Hi Thomas,

 

the discontinued Minolta 5400 has a 'softer' light compared to the Nikons. Together with a cheap device from the Netherlands (see the link) this is for a normal budget the best solution for b/w works.

The Epson 2400 has the biggest support from paper suppliers because it's in the market for a longer period.

 

Get the Minolta from ebay, because so many people scan their slide/negatives and start shooting digital, selling the scanner.

I didn't know the thing about Minolta vs. Nikon and bouhgt the Nikon top of this year. My old pics from 1973 are at flickr, honestly, I'm not the wizard in settings.....

 

here is the link to the Scanhancer Official Scanhancer Site

 

LG

Bernd

[pascal_meheut]

Why using the scanhancer with the 5400? Minolta stoled the idea (according to the scanhancer guys) and built it inside the 5400. It is called "grain dissolver" and it works quite well.

[cbretteville]

There is a difference here between 5400 mk. 1 and 5400 mk. 2. Some people report that mk.1's light source is better suited for B&W scanning than mk. 2. I have the newer model, but haven't had a chance to compare scan made on the two models.

 

- Carl

[pascal_meheut]

There is a difference here between 5400 mk. 1 and 5400 mk. 2. Some people report that mk.1's light source is better suited for B&W scanning than mk. 2. I have the newer model, but haven't had a chance to compare scan made on the two models.

 

- Carl

 

Yes, I read that too. But just like you, I did not compare. The model 1 is quite good for B&W indeed. For slides, I prefer the Nikons even if their light source make the grain more apparent with the Provia 400F.

[Guest Metroman]

I have epson 1290 and recently bought the HP8450. The 8450 are recently discontinued and can be found for bargain prices. The print quality is superb (see photo-i for a review). They are A4 printers -great if they fit your needs.

Nik

 

Nik: thanks for that info. Just found a supplier here in the UK selling them for £72. Happy bunny now.

 

Thomas: I recently bought the Nikon V ED and using Vuescan I am getting some nice results.

[thomasw_]

thanks so much for all the detailed responses and very useful links! respectfully, thomas w.

[tobey bilek]

I am very happy with the Minolta 5400 I purchased new two or three years ago. My first scans came out perfectly. Minolta is out of that business now and I am not sure I would purchase another for that reason.

 

The big secret with scanning true black and white film is to develope to a low enough contrast to print on a condenser enlarger, not diffusion enlarger.

 

If I were to purchase new today, I would get a Nikon Coolscan.

 

For larger negs, Epson has a new flat bed that works well enough for 8x10 prints from 35mm.

 

The Nikon as oposed to the Epson has better software so corrections can be done at the scanning stage rather than Photoshop.

 

Definately buy a printer that has the spray nozzles built into the ink cartridge. These are the first things to breakdown and if ink consuming cleaning cycles do not clear them, profesional repair is almost required. It the nozzles are built into the carts, just get a new cart. This leaves out Epsin and Canon . Try the HP suggested above.

[bayerische]

I'm also on the hunt for a "good" printer, since I never take the time to use "internet based" printing firms, and the few times I have used them, I've never been satisfied with the results.

 

A3 size would be great, but not a must.

 

How about the EPSON 1270?

[cpclee]

Rather than spending too much money buying a brand new scanner, I'd personally buy a used, high-quality scanner and professional scanning software to drive it.

 

I went this path several months ago buying a Minolta 5400 (ver. 1) for very little money and SiliverFast AI. The results are outstanding. SilverFast AI comes with a calibration slide. Once your scanner is calibrated, almost no tuning is required to get great color from the slides(assuming your monitor is also calibrated). I paid less than $550 for the scanner plus software and it's the wiset purchase I've ever made.

[JHAG]

Problem is, as far as I know, the Minolta does not support medium format…

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[nrj]

the minolta multi pro does support medium format and I've found it a very good scanner. 35mm can be scanned upto 4800 and MF upto 3200. You get very big 16 bit? files if yo want them. The scanner seems very sturdy and is quite simple to use with the Minolta software - you can still download the latest version I think.

 

Nik

[Zurenborger]

I can't find the source anymore, but HP is coming up with a totally new designed B&W printer making use of some new technology and at an affordable price apparently. I cannot remember where I read this but you might want to look into that.

And when speaking of affordable, the estimated price was somewhere in the region of 500-600€ so probably the same in $ within the US.

 

As for a pure B&W scanner for film ..... the current slide scanners don't really cut it unless you get the top of the line models, even then it might pay to look into some of the newer flatbeds, I use an Epson 4990 which I use for scanning prints, but it certainly does a good job of scanning 6x7 negatives, and this was a medium priced scanner to begin with, and bought some time ago. Technology must of improved over time ....