jimbo035 Posted January 24, 2009 Author Share #41 Posted January 24, 2009 Advertisement (gone after registration) My D-Lux 4 arrived today with "Capture 4.1" on the DVD label .. but as I already installed Silky Pix (that came with the "Panny" FX150 traded in for the DL4) which supports the DL4 & sorts out converging verticals and chromatic aberrations, I may not bother with the Phase One stuff. In any case,it may well be too much of a load for my Mac Mini G4 processor and its "only" 512 MB of SDRAM Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted January 24, 2009 Posted January 24, 2009 Hi jimbo035, Take a look here In a Lumix LX3 vs D-lux 4 quandary . I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
Raf DeBoeck Posted January 24, 2009 Share #42 Posted January 24, 2009 They are both still point and shoot cameras though, quite good at what they intend to set out to do. Practicaly use I find limited as well as the size. Stick it into your pocket and the lens will hook somewhere, buttons and sliders will be altered etc. The image results are OK for general point and shoot activities but not more than that. For general purposes the cameras are great, if however you want good IQ try a DP1 which are now in the same price league and produce fabulous images, although only at 28mm. If it's black and whit you want the GRD is a better option, best of all worlds is obviously to own all three. I find myself using the DP1 80% of the time and the GRD 20% .... the LX3 is in sole use by my wife who loves it.... Ans as for style, the DLux is beautiful, like a work of art almost, well made solid, no chromium plastics etc. Is it worth the extra investement? ... that obviously is fully up to the buyer. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
firoze Posted January 24, 2009 Share #43 Posted January 24, 2009 Since its Panasonic's factories, I still find it hard to believe that a) there would be two production standards and that Panasonic wouldn't do everything they could to use the highest quality they could. Japanese factories, Panasonic included, make a fetish out of Continuous Quality Improvement, Quality-driven manufacturing process re-engineering, benchmarking quality processes, etc. In general, if they are aware of a better process, they incorporate it into the manufacturing techniques. Its why Toyota & Honda & Subaru (Fuji) have higher quality than Mercedes, VW & BMW. Beyond that, setting up one factory with two sets of quality standards (meaning two virtually identical products -- in this case the DL4 and the LX3) with different parts specs (in terms of tolerances), different QC, etc., would be frightfully expensive and implies that Panasonic would be refusing to make the best product they could at the same time as they're also trying to build their brand as a very high quality one. Panasonic/Matsushita just doesn't do things that way. Having two slightly different products is doable on the same production line. Having otherwise undifferentiated parts sorted by variance from standards (which is what you're suggesting) would essentially require two different parts suppliers, etc. I don't know, beyond all this, whether I can express how unlikely & impractical & difficult this would be to do in a high volume, small parts, electronics manufacturing environment. It would make BOTH cameras very much more expensive. Different Lens coatings & different software are one thing, and relatively easy to do. What you're suggesting is not. :confused: There are not two different production processes for Leica and Panasonic at the factories, only one. But in every production run of components, the output is graded... for instance in a production run of LCD's the output is graded into 5 levels of quality from A to E, where grade A components are those that are closest to the ideal specification and grade E is for components that do not meet the minimum requiments and therefore are rejects . I know for a fact that when Apple sources LCD's displays from Samsung or LG, they get the cream i.e. grade A. Samsung/LG actually use grade B for themselves or whatever is left over from grade A after supplying Apple's requirments... this is because Apple demands nothing but the best and is prepared to pay for it. The same applies to Leica/Panasonic. There is nothing difficult or unusual in grading components, this has to be, and is always done by a manufacturer. About 20 years ago, I heard from the horse's mouth, one of the topmost executives of a very prominent Japanese Giant (who shall remain nameless) that the cream of the production run of their consumer electronics went to W. Germany, while the lowest grade (but still within acceptable tolerances) went to Hong Kong and the Gulf countries. This is marketing/manufacturing reality, there is nothing unusual about Leica getting the highest grade output from Panasonic. But this does not mean that Panasonic always uses lower grade components... for instance if in a run of 100, 000 sensors there were, say 15, 000 grade A sensors, and Leica required only 6000, then of course Panasonic would use the remaining 9000 sensors for themselves... Anyway, I'm writing the above only for others who might be interested in such things, am not trying to force my opinion/knowledge on anyone. In the end one has to make one's own choice as to what to believe. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bjmike Posted January 25, 2009 Share #44 Posted January 25, 2009 Firoze, with all personal respect, I just don't believe this is true. It would absolutely sink Panasonic as a brand -- and all because of Leica-preferential practices in Panasonic's own factories. They would have to be terminally stupid to do something that crazy and self-destructive. Believe it if you want. Just for the record, though: I'm not defending Panasonic, have none of their cameras, but do own a Panasonic-made Leica. I have no vested interest in the outcome of this little debate, at least the Panny side of it. I did spend a lot of my career as a quality management systems consultant, so when I say I find it all hard to believe, I'm not talking as a camera consumer, but as a QC/QM guy who has worked with companies on those very systems (but not with Panasonic or Leica). Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
rossawilson Posted April 4, 2009 Share #45 Posted April 4, 2009 I too have heard Leica get the pic of the crop from Panasonic. Brand suicide? No. Who in the world other than a few nerds knows this, and how many of those nerds actually care about the slight differences in tolerance that make the difference. It's actually a clever way for Panasonic to make more money and a good way for Leica to keep to it's company mantra. There are no losers. This also happens in the automotive industry. In fact, any manufacturing industry that has a graded component system, which is most of them, would be fools not to charge a premium for their higher graded stuff considering there are people willing to pay for them. This is how we get premium brands, it's rare there are actually different factories for slightly higher grade components. Now that would be financial suicide. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
kalina Posted April 4, 2009 Share #46 Posted April 4, 2009 What's interesting is while we all debate about which camera is better, we could be using that time to take great pics Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
alexc Posted April 4, 2009 Share #47 Posted April 4, 2009 Advertisement (gone after registration) According to the what I have read so far both cameras are exactly the same. If there are differences they are very mild. in fact people who claimed differences never showed side by side examples. If somebody saw them I would love to see them. I bought Leica because it is just better. Sorry, it is BETTER for ME. Putting aside warranty look and other things my decision was made because of my attachment to this brand from my childhood and I do not mind to pay couple hundred dollars for this. Having said this I totally agree and respect others decision to by Panasonic. What I don't understand when somebody tries to justify or quantify their decision as the right one. It is all about feeling and ones willingness to pay for this. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimbo035 Posted April 4, 2009 Author Share #48 Posted April 4, 2009 What's interesting is while we all debate about which camera is better, we could be using that time to take great pics well said, Kalina. If only this forum was a newspaper... surely by now the editor would have stepped in and declared the subject closed. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ceflynn Posted April 4, 2009 Share #49 Posted April 4, 2009 Side by side comparisons: Life is Good!: Panasonic LX3 vs Leica DLux4, Part 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
rycm Posted April 5, 2009 Share #50 Posted April 5, 2009 Choose either camera that catches your fancy. Both camera are great (or statistically the same). A great camera with results that will keep encouraging you to use it even more. This is the primary strength of this camera, you never actually feel bored with it, and keep wanting to experiment and push it to the next level. Now that Lightroom are able to process it's RAW (LX-3), I personally think it's a better choice. But hey.. I love the lines of the D4, but.. the M8.2 already took up all my $$. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
kalina Posted April 6, 2009 Share #51 Posted April 6, 2009 Oh, and one last thing, I've owned the LX3 prior to my D-Lux 4. I had both for a couple of weeks to examine similarities and differences. My advice to the original poster is to just go out and buy an LX3 and play with it and if you feel you must upgrade, then sell the LX3 on ebay. You probably won't lose more than $30 off what you paid, so consider this like a rental fee. I already confirmed that the coatings are indeed different on both lenses. The images look pretty close to me, but if you're serious about photography and believe in Leica, then why fuss with the cheap stuff when you can go to the source and get a nicer looking camera with better software and a better warranty? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
meatboy Posted April 8, 2009 Share #52 Posted April 8, 2009 I've read the enduring LX3 vs Dlux4 on many forums. I'd like to see a statement from Panasonic And Leica regarding this, but alas that would likely be too much to ask. Something more than the warranty, bundled software and case differences. If they would make a statement, then we'd know as consumers what to expect from either camera when we make our choice? Anybody got a link to anything from either Pana or Leica? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.