Chipped internal element on APO-SUMMICRON-SL 90 f/2 ASPH.

[Nick4692]

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Hello everyone new to the forum. I bought my APO-SUMMICRON-SL 90 f/2 ASPH "like new" from MPB in the UK its now out of their warranty. Like all my Leical Lenses its Baby'd and cared for but used and enjoyed  Today I discovered one of the internal  elements chipped on two sides as pic attached. It's internal not the outside piece of glass.  

Has anyone ever had this on one of their lenses? Presumably there's now bits of glass rattling around the lens.  I've owned it for 18 months now but image quality remains absolutely gorgeous as ever, but it looks like the chips are behind the metal ring so not in view.  Would you bother sending it in for repair?

Ignore the spots and stuff on the photos, that's just from the iphone i took the pic with. Any idea how that could have happened as I've never dropped it or banged it, how on earth has it chipped internally like that? Most weird. Thermal temperature change perhaps?  

Many thanks
Nick 

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[jaapv]

And on the rear. If you are happy with the images, use it as is or have it replaced by Leica(expensive!) The resale value if offered like this will be minimal. Most likely cause is an inexpert repair in the past. 

[LocalHero1953]

I chipped the front element of an Apo-Summicron-M 90 and sent it for repair about 7-8 years ago. I recall it was £500-1000. My view was that whether or not it made a difference to the images (I couldn't see any), it would be far harder to sell - if I ever wanted to sell it - which I did, eventually.

That damage looks unpleasantly substantial. There could well be bits of glass inside that could interfere with focus and the aperture.

Edit. I can't find the cost of the 90mm repair, but the rebuild of a Apo-Summicron-M 75 in 2015 cost around £550.

Edited May 29 by LocalHero1953

[Stuart Richardson]

Normally with a scratch or minor chip, I would say just live with it. This looks worse, and I would send it in, at least to get an evaluation from Leica. It may not be economical to repair, but at least you will know what is going on. If it is not economical to fix, but it still takes beautiful pictures, then you are just back where you started minus the cost of shipping and the evaluation. In the best case, Leica may deem it a manufacturing fault and offer a free or discounted repair, even though it is out of warranty. They have done that for me in the past, especially when it was something that really should not happen (like this). For example, the strap lug came out of my S006 at one point (luckily I caught the camera by the strap that was still attached to the other lug), and they just fixed it for free despite being out of warranty.

By the way, it is a little hard to judge from that picture, but I am not convinced it isn't the cement between elements failing. The optics of the lenses can cause weird effects. It also could be a problem with the barrel or helicals causing mechanical stress on the internal elements when focusing and thus causing the fracture of the elements. Whatever it is, I would personally recommend getting it checked out, if only to make sure it is not going to get any worse.

[jaapv]

Left hand top there is more trouble brewing. 

[jdlaing]

That lens has been dropped or opened and monkeyed with.

[Nick4692]

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Update. Repair estimate from leica 

Designation Quantity Unit price EUR Total value EUR 980 plus Vat 

Repair SL lens:
Disassembly
Repair manual focus
Exchange lens assembly,
rear
Clean optics
Overall adjustment
Cleaning
Final inspection
Total net: 980.00 plus vat

They’ve had a polite but terse email. Its not about the cost. 

What concerns me is that Leica Germany has provided only a brief and impersonal repair estimate without any explanation as to the cause of the issue. The lens has always been treated with great care, never dropped, knocked, or mishandled, and its external condition is, as I trust you have seen, excellent. I fully accept that internal issues can occur, and I do not deny that something I did may have contributed to the problem. However, I would have expected more clarity and transparency from Leica at this stage, given the repair cost is over 1200 euros

[Nick4692]

On 5/29/2025 at 8:08 PM, LocalHero1953 said:

I chipped the front element of an Apo-Summicron-M 90 and sent it for repair about 7-8 years ago. I recall it was £500-1000. My view was that whether or not it made a difference to the images (I couldn't see any), it would be far harder to sell - if I ever wanted to sell it - which I did, eventually.

That damage looks unpleasantly substantial. There could well be bits of glass inside that could interfere with focus and the aperture.

Edit. I can't find the cost of the 90mm repair, but the rebuild of a Apo-Summicron-M 75 in 2015 cost around £550.

Update. Repair estimate from leica 

os. Designation Quantity Unit price EUR Total value EUR 980 plus Vat 

Repair SL lens:
Disassembly
Repair manual focus
Exchange lens assembly,
rear
Clean optics
Overall adjustment
Cleaning
Final inspection
Total net: 980.00 plus vat

They’ve a polite but terse email. Its not about the cost. 

What concerns me is that Leica Germany has provided only a brief and impersonal repair estimate without any explanation as to the cause of the issue. The lens has always been treated with great care, never dropped, knocked, or mishandled, and its external condition is, as I trust you have seen, excellent. I fully accept that internal issues can occur, and I do not deny that something I did may have contributed to the problem. However, I would have expected more clarity and transparency from Leica at this stage, given the repair cost is over 1200 euros

[wizard]

vor einer Stunde schrieb Nick4692:

... without any explanation as to the cause of the issue.

While I can understand that you are very interested in the potential cause of this issue (I would be, too), I think it is only fair from Leica's end to not provide any guesswork in that regard. Realistically, how should they know what happened to the lens? They could provide some possible scenarios, such as "The lens may have received a harsh impact" or "The lens may have been tampered with", but all of that would be mere speculation and the customer would likely reply "No, the lens was never dropped" etc., so what's the benefit of providing such scenarios? Whatever caused the damage, the damage is there, and Leica indicates how much it will cost to repair the lens.

Edited August 2 by wizard
correction

[jaapv]

But we can deduce. If the focusing must be repaired as well, the lens must have suffered a sharp impact, probably without the owner noticing. From experience:  Leica lenses can suffer internal damage to the focusing mechanism without showing external damage. I once  had an M8 go down a 6 m cliff. The camera had a minor dent in the baseplate, but the shutter was slammed down,  the sensor and  RF needed adjustment but more relevant to the thread: the focusing  mechanism of the (unmarked) chrome Summicron 35 was completely blocked and the rear lens element cracked. I’m not complaining; a Canon would have been a collection of nuts and bolts ready to be swept into the bin. But the assessment of Leica for the lens was the same as yours. 

[LocalHero1953]

TBH that looks a good price for a major repair.
I would expect the difference in sale price before and after repair would be much greater than the repair cost.