The M review nobody asked for :)

[kiwidad]

Advertisement (gone after registration)

On 2/22/2025 at 12:36 PM, anonymoose said:

I've had an M11 since Thanksgiving 2024 and wanted to share my review/experience--not for the long-time users of the M system, but for people considering the M system. Camera history:

• Canon 40D w/ 50mm f1.8 back in ~2008
• Long break from photography, then got back into it in the mid-2010's with Sony mirrorless cameras (A7S) that I mostly used to video vacations.
• 2020 I got back into photography (upgraded to A7S III), bought a Leica TL2 w/ 23mm f2, which turned into a Leica CL (2021) which turned into a Q2 (2022) which turned into a Q3 (2023), which turned back into a Q2 in 2024.
• 2024 bought an A1 for video + photo (A7S III is a webcam now)
• Thanksgiving 2024 I purchased an M11, returned it December 2024
• M10-R for about 3 days (returned)
• M11 again as of ~January 2025

What I am liking about it so far:

1. I am forced to choose focus whether I like it or not--this sets consistent foundation/repetitions for my photography. Choose aperture, set shutter speed, raise camera to eye, focus, frame scene, wait for right moment, capture.
   1. Oftentimes with my A1 I'll let it grab focus and I'd say 90% of the time it gets the thing I want (e.g. a person, something in the foreground, etc.) and this reinforces laziness--I'm no longer making a picture I'm simply capturing one. I've grown to really like the M11 forcing purposeful photography.
2. The shutter sound is very satisfying. The entire tactile experience is satisfying--it's engaging, mechanical, fun, and rewarding.
3. With my Sony + 35mm f1.4 GM, taking a good picture is simply too easy and has started to feel almost boring and cheap. In terms of the philosophy of capturing moments for later enjoyment, this is a good thing, but I also like the process of photography and I get bored easily. The M11 makes me earn good pictures and there's this weird psychology taking place where I'm excited to see if any of the last 20 pictures I took are keepers (like developing film) on my computer screen.
   1. On the M11, I'd say out of 20 pictures: 12 are properly focused, 6 are focused and framed nicely, and 0-3 are what I'd consider good/great shots.
   2. With my Sony, out of 20 pictures: 18-20 are properly focused, 16 of those are framed nicely, and I find myself having to choose between 5-10 to find my favorite, which is not an enjoyable process to me (flipping back and forth between them, asking my wife, printing them, etc.).
   3. With the M11 I don't have much to choose from and it forces me to move on and not get stuck overanalyzing photos to death--this has immense value to someone with mild OCD and constant need for perfection.
4. The rangefinder, in proper lighting conditions, is becoming really enjoyable to use except for when I'm holding it vertically (still figuring out ergonomics here). I'm not sure if this is normal practice, but I actually keep both eyes open and my brain has now figured out how to merge what I'm seeing with both eyes in a way that helps me focus the shot better. I'm also able to see even more of the scene with my left eye, then fine tune framing with my right eye. In low light I'm finding it a bit of a struggle.
5. I've struggled with ADHD my whole life, so the M11 absolutely punishing me with bad pictures (when I don't slow down) is something I need. I'm stubborn, so I'm still taking a lot of bad pictures.
6. 35 Lux @ f1.4 renders magical images especially with a nice light source adding glow.

What I'm not liking about it:

1. I am forced to choose focus! This makes capturing sudden moments with proper focus challenging. I've definitely missed a lot of shots of my daughter in the time it takes to dial in my settings, focus, and frame the shot. I'm trying to adapt to this by always having the camera on, set to an aperture that would be appropriate for a situation, have the focus ring in roughly the right position, and practicing frequently to develop muscle memory. This continues to get easier with time.
2. The price tag of course. I feel like my M11 does less and is capable of less while carrying a steeper price tag and that creates some sort of inherent discomfort as someone that grew up poor.
3. Having to use the rear display to dial focus on shots closer than 0.7m really ruins the experience for me. It makes me feel like I'm taking pictures with my Sony again. It has caused me to not really take any close up shots and I'm finding with the Summilux 35mm I'm sometimes too far away and have to rely heavily on cropping--hooray for 60MP!
4. Even at f2.8-f4 and 1/320 or faster shooting a stationary target, the Summilux 35 is nowhere near as sharp as the pictures I took with my Q3. I suspect I'd need to buy the APO 35 to get back to that level of sharpness (which I really like), but $9,000 camera and a $8,500 lens means the price of a used car to get pictures that my $6500 Q3 spit out with ease. I'm fortunate to be able to easily afford that, but as someone that grew up quite poor I don't know that I'll ever be comfortable with it.
5. I'm either unlucky or Leica gear is not quality controlled properly:
   1. First M11 (very lightly used): out of vertical alignment and freezing daily.
   2. M10-R (lightly used): out of horizontal and vertical alignment.
   3. Second M11 (very lightly used): properly aligned and not a single instance of freezing.
   4. First 35 Lux (lightly used): loose focus mechanism and back-focusing.
   5. Second 35 Lux (brand new): loose aperture ring and front-focusing.
   6. Third 35 Lux (current, lightly used): great other than a slightly loose aperture ring.
   7. First 75 APO (lightly used): something very wrong with it (back-focusing and generally weird images), returned.
   8. Second 75 APO (current, lightly used): something maybe off with it, not sure what yet as it's inconsistent. Problem still could be me.
6. I'm using my highly capable, expensive Sony A1 and even my Q2 much, much less now. I always reach for the M11 first unless I absolutely know the shot is going to be difficult to capture (e.g. daughter moving quickly) or I think I'll need to take a video as well. I put a Zeiss 55mm f1.8 on the A1 which compliments the M11 + 35 nicely. It's the closest look to Leica optics, so the images actually look stylistically similar.

What I'd change about the M11/M: nothing other than the 'refresh rate' of the Live View mode especially in lower-light. It feels as though it's choosing a slower shutter speed to expose for live view instead of a higher ISO, but guessing that's a purposeful decision.

What I've learned/what's changed:

1. With the M11 I am actually "making" photographs vs. capturing/taking them. It's enough of a difference that my wife can actually fairly accurately guess which photo was made with the M11 vs. captured with other cameras--not because of bokeh/colors/rendering/etc., but the "mood" or "staging" (her words) of the scene. She said my M11 images "feel more artistic."
2. I'm using my Sony's EVF more now than pre-M11 as a result. First, because it's becoming an ingrained habit and second because I've learned to enjoy it. Doesn't hurt that the Sony's EVF is much higher resolution than the rear display. Still nowhere near as enjoyable as the RF.
3. With the Sony I typically live in f1.4-f2.8 range to maximize bokeh/separation. With the M11 and manual focusing, I find myself using f2.8-f4 a lot more to ensure I'm capturing focus. This has made me more comfortable using higher f-stops on my Sony as well, which I believe has led to some better images.
4. I might want to rent an M6 and give film photography a try at some point to take this to another level--maybe in a few years.
5. I'm still not comfortable taking it out of Auto ISO unless it's a staged shot (e.g. landscape) where I have time to setup the shot.
6. I find myself enjoy photography even more. It's a process/experience that is more rewarding now.

tl;dr: I love the M experience and it's made me a better photographer. My early experiences have me worrying about reliability, but I'm ignoring it and treating the M11 and lenses with care. Attaching one of my favorite, non-personal photos.

Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here…

Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members!

regarding your issues, if you want pi sharp pics wide open you better put a visiflex on to focus the summilux.  
if you drop to about f4 rangefinder focusing is good.

you talk about auto iso but that exposure setup is the same for EVERY CAMERA AND EVERY BRAND.  Learn the camera. I usually set the control dial for exposure compensation with the viso on exposure preview and chimp when critical.

in case you were not aware the summilux is not nor has it ever been the winner in the sharpness contest. That  belongs to the summicron. The lux is about rendering! If you want mega crispy sharp get a cron

you talk about quality issues? I typically buy used and have only ever had two issues, a 90 the focuses afraction past infinity and a 135 that doesn’t quit het infinity focus. I have read lately that some Leica lenses develop the aperture ring looseness if you remove from camera body using the aperture ring as a grip to twist to remove. On used lenses that could be a thing. 

only lens I have had break is my favorite voigtlander 50 f1,5 nnokton. The whole front of the lens is loose… if any one reading know where to get one fixed let me know. This it the original LTM version and is is sharp but renderders like a summit a! 

[Advertisement]

The Leica Q3 is available for pre-order at B&H Photo Video and Adorama

[kiwidad]

On 3/2/2025 at 6:26 AM, jaapv said:

Actually the only camera that is suited for landscape is a 4x5 view camera 

I can afford the camera and I would love use one BUT I can afford someone to carry it for me… old age kicked in.

you can get pretty decent lanscapes on the m11 but your right a 4x5 it isn’t!

[jaapv]

On 3/10/2025 at 3:37 AM, kiwidad said:

regarding your issues, if you want pi sharp pics wide open you better put a visiflex on to focus the summilux.  
if you drop to about f4 rangefinder focusing is good.

you talk about auto iso but that exposure setup is the same for EVERY CAMERA AND EVERY BRAND.  Learn the camera. I usually set the control dial for exposure compensation with the viso on exposure preview and chimp when critical.

in case you were not aware the summilux is not nor has it ever been the winner in the sharpness contest. That  belongs to the summicron. The lux is about rendering! If you want mega crispy sharp get a cron

you talk about quality issues? I typically buy used and have only ever had two issues, a 90 the focuses afraction past infinity and a 135 that doesn’t quit het infinity focus. I have read lately that some Leica lenses develop the aperture ring looseness if you remove from camera body using the aperture ring as a grip to twist to remove. On used lenses that could be a thing. 

only lens I have had break is my favorite voigtlander 50 f1,5 nnokton. The whole front of the lens is loose… if any one reading know where to get one fixed let me know. This it the original LTM version and is is sharp but renderders like a summit a! 

I sent my Nokton to Will van Manen and Kathy Kuypers for a loose front. It was not cheap but the lens came back feeling much tighter overall and perfectly calibrated.