Import costs of pre-owned camera lens from the EU (Netherlands) to the UK

[SJCoates]

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Good Leica people, I am asking this on here as I have done the usual Google searches and to be honest I am completely in the dark!

I am looking to import a pre-owned Leica lens from someone in the Netherlands to my home (England, UK), and was wondering if I have to pay any import duties or VAT? It would be for personal use; not sure if that is significant (so not for business use).

The value of the lens is high (£5K+) so any percentage costs to add on will be significant - VAT @ 20% would essentially make it far too much for me to contemplate.

Just wondering if anyone has done something like this and what, if anything, did you pay extra?

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[LocalHero1953]

No duties, but UK VAT, plus whatever fee the shipper charges for paying the VAT on your behalf.

I have the advantage of a daughter in Brussels - I time my purchases for when either she or I are crossing the channel.

If the VAT is on £5k+, then it might be cheaper to go and pick it up.

Edited January 11 by LocalHero1953

[Dazzajl]

6 minutes ago, LocalHero1953 said:

If the VAT is on £5k+, then it might be cheaper to go and pick it up.

To be 'that guy', picking up the lens does not make it VAT exempt. Just very very unlikely that anyone will know to stop, ask/search and charge you.

[SJCoates]

7 minutes ago, LocalHero1953 said:

No duties, but UK VAT, plus whatever fee the shipper charges for paying the VAT on your behalf.

I have the advantage of a daughter in Brussels - I time my purchases for when either she or I are crossing the channel.

If the VAT is on £5k+, then it might be cheaper to go and pick it up.

My plan was to go a buy it myself and bring it into the country - however I was wondering if I would pay import VAT at customs?

[LocalHero1953]

31 minutes ago, Dazzajl said:

To be 'that guy', picking up the lens does not make it VAT exempt. Just very very unlikely that anyone will know to stop, ask/search and charge you.

Indeed

[LocalHero1953]

31 minutes ago, SJCoates said:

My plan was to go a buy it myself and bring it into the country - however I was wondering if I would pay import VAT at customs?

Of course HMRC have the power to stop, search and charge you. The only time I've been searched travelling by car has been for drugs and explosives. Travelling by train, it's just scanning for firearms and other dangerous hardware. I haven't flown to the rest of Europe for years. I suspect HMRC and Border Force have many more things to worry about than one person with a used camera lens.

It's down to you and your conscience!

[LocalHero1953]

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To add more: by train or by car, I wouldn't have a clue what to do if I wanted to declare an item and pay VAT or duty on it. Neither route has a desk to get past, or a form to complete, relating to such matters. From my last recollection of air travel (and sea, via Harwich, many years ago), it's the same.

[jaapv]

As it is used, if you put it on your camera and put it on the seat beside you or in a camera bag with odds and ends it is more than highly unlikely that you will be challenged for proof of purchase.  However, the ethical question of evading duty and taxes lies with you. 

[pgk]

You might want to search here: https://www.gov.uk/guidance/simplified-rates-for-bringing-personal-goods-into-the-uk but to me it looks like the 'simplified' duty rate  is 2% + vat of 20% on the declared value + duty. Given that if you import via a delivery service or courier then they may well apply 5% duty + vat + a charge to cover their involvement in dealing with it (£12-15 in my experiece) it may well work out cheaper to bring things back yourself.

[Zeitblom]

 

vor 1 Stunde schrieb jaapv:

As it is used, if you put it on your camera and put it on the seat beside you or in a camera bag with odds and ends it is more than highly unlikely that you will be challenged for proof of purchase. ...

I agree, take your matching Leica camera with you on your trip and no one will be able to accuse you of not having the bought pre-owned lens as part of your photo equipment.
Because all Leica lenses are marked as being made in Germany or Canada.
To be on the safe side, you can send your invoice and any original packaging folded up from England to the Netherlands in advance.
That's what I did years ago with an also pre-owned Tele-Elmar M4.0-135mm, bought in San Francisco and brought back as part of my long used photo equipment to Germany..

Edited January 11 by Zeitblom

[jaapv]

7 minutes ago, Zeitblom said:

Because all Leica lenses are marked as being made in Germany or Canada

Or Portugal 😉

[jaapv]

But does that make sense for cameras as I don’t think that digital cameras  attract import duty in the USA? 

[zeitz]

1 hour ago, jaapv said:

But does that make sense for cameras as I don’t think that digital cameras  attract import duty in the USA? 

The import duty in the US for optical equipment, which includes cameras, varies by country of manufacture and the type of equipment (camera, lens or accessory).  Film or digital cameras are not distinguished.  Also special items have their own category, such as instant cameras, to protect the US manufacturers.  The Harmonized Tariff Schedule Chapter 90 gives all the details.  Typically duty is about 4%.  There is no VAT in the US.

I think this rule applies to shipments as well as hand carried items - there is an exemption so that the first $800 of value brought into the US has no duty.  This should be checked with a US customs office. 

[Ted Lemon]

I just ordered some substantial M kit from Leica Classic in Germany and Spain, which should arrive later this week in the UK. I expect to pay the courier 20% VAT duty (they use DHL), and it gets delivered. As these are second-hand goods, they are under the margin tax scheme in the EU. I can't travel now, so the other options are not viable. I will post exactly what costs I incurred when it arrives.

 

PS: My purchased kit excludes VAT in the home country (it's 21% in Spain), so I only pay VAT when imported into the UK. Even if I went to Spain and purchased it from Leica, I would be charged the VAT in Spain on the purchase. Then, they become personal belongings when they go back to the UK. I have been told this: I am interested in seeing what transpires! Of course, buying from an individual means there is no VAT if they are not registered.  

Edited January 13 by Ted Lemon

[Deeetona]

On 1/11/2025 at 9:51 PM, Zeitblom said:

 

I agree, take your matching Leica camera with you on your trip and no one will be able to accuse you of not having the bought pre-owned lens as part of your photo equipment.
Because all Leica lenses are marked as being made in Germany or Canada.
To be on the safe side, you can send your invoice and any original packaging folded up from England to the Netherlands in advance.
That's what I did years ago with an also pre-owned Tele-Elmar M4.0-135mm, bought in San Francisco and brought back as part of my long used photo equipment to Germany..

By your own admission, you have engaged in the smuggling of photographic equipment into a country without fulfilling the required tax obligations or making the necessary declarations. Furthermore, you appear to be using this public forum to promote or encourage others to engage in similar actions. Please be advised that under United States law, such conduct could potentially be interpreted as mail fraud, tax evasion, or smuggling, all of which are serious offenses. These crimes can carry severe consequences, including substantial financial penalties and imprisonment.

Additionally, the operators of this forum should be aware that they could risk being viewed as accomplices if they are found to knowingly facilitate or allow such discussions without intervention. This could expose them to similar penalties, including fines or criminal liability, depending on their level of involvement or neglect.

It is also important to note that actions like these can damage the reputation and brand of Leica, a renowned company with a significant global presence. This harm extends to its legitimate customers and stakeholders, including its U.S.-based investor, Blackstone. The company or its stakeholders may have grounds to pursue civil damages for reputational harm or other financial losses resulting from such illegal activities.

[LocalHero1953]

1 minute ago, Deeetona said:

By your own admission, you have engaged in the smuggling of photographic equipment into a country without fulfilling the required tax obligations or making the necessary declarations. Furthermore, you appear to be using this public forum to promote or encourage others to engage in similar actions. Please be advised that under United States law, such conduct could potentially be interpreted as mail fraud, tax evasion, or smuggling, all of which are serious offenses. These crimes can carry severe consequences, including substantial financial penalties and imprisonment.

Additionally, the operators of this forum should be aware that they could risk being viewed as accomplices if they are found to knowingly facilitate or allow such discussions without intervention. This could expose them to similar penalties, including fines or criminal liability, depending on their level of involvement or neglect.

It is also important to note that actions like these can damage the reputation and brand of Leica, a renowned company with a significant global presence. This harm extends to its legitimate customers and stakeholders, including its U.S.-based investor, Blackstone. The company or its stakeholders may have grounds to pursue civil damages for reputational harm or other financial losses resulting from such illegal activities.

Sounds like you've been appointed a moderator.....

Yawn

[andybarton]

15 minutes ago, Deeetona said:

Additionally, the operators of this forum should be aware that they could risk being viewed as accomplices if they are found to knowingly facilitate or allow such discussions without intervention.

What members do off this forum is nothing to do with the Forum, nor its operators. If you beat your wife or drive at 200 km/hr through your town, that is nothing to do with the Forum.

The Forum operates under Germany Law, by the way. Not that it makes any difference.

[andybarton]

On 1/11/2025 at 6:32 PM, LocalHero1953 said:

I suspect HMRC and Border Force have many more things to worry about than one person with a used camera lens.

Last year I flew into and out of the EU/ETSA area twice. On neither occasion did I even see anyone on the border check points. In fact, I can't remember when I last saw anyone on the red/green gates. 

Pre-2020 we wouldn't even be need to be discussing this, of course.

Years ago, when using the ferries and to avoid the green channel queues, we used to have an onion in the car, go through the red channel and declare it as a root vegetable. Mostly we were told to be on our way, once we were told to "Bugger off and stop wasting my time" and once, we had to empty the contents of the car...

I reckon that, on balance, we were pretty even with regards to time saved.

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[Deeetona]

So can everbody draw the line where they see fit?

[roydonian]

They always have!  I inherited from my father his Leica IIIb, which I understand had been smuggled into the UK (albeit not by him).

Time for a bit of Rudyard Kipling...

Five and twenty ponies,

Trotting through the dark —

Brandy for the Parson,

Baccy for the Clerk;

Laces for a lady, letters for a spy,

And watch the wall, my darling,

While the Gentlemen go by!

In the 21st century, perhaps we could replace "laces for a lady" with "lenses for a Leica"?