Leica 240 vs 246 for B&W Photography / Trade offs between no Bayer filter, high ISO and color channels in LRC?

[paulinmaryland]

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Until Feb. 2023 I had both the M- P 240 and M246.  I used the 240 when shooting during the day, and the 246 at night, because of the higher ISO capability. I converted the files from the 240 into B&W with LRC and SIlver Effects. In Feb. 2023, I sold the MP-240 to help pay for an SL2S as my "color" Leica, with its better low light performance, and excellent EVF, so I would have a higher hit rate on focus with 90mm, 75mm and especially 50mm 1.0 Noctilux. 

But at this point, 18 months later, I miss shooting with the MP 240 in daylight, and converting the files to B&W with control I have with LRC color channel sliders and Silver Effects. The SL2S is excellent in studio, portraiture, etc..., but much heavier, slower to focus and I don't enjoy taking out out on the street to shoot with a rangefinder the way I did with the 240.  Now using the 246 for both day and night B&W street/general photography feels like a step backwards, because I've lost the ability to work with the color channels.  Of course, the M246 is superior to the MP-240 in low light/night photography, due to the absence of the Bayer filter.

But if I'm shooting B&W's in daylight (so I don't need the high ISO), doesn't the advantage of having the color channels to work with give the MP-240 an advantage over shooting B&W with the 246?

Thoughts?

Paul 

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[Luke_Miller]

I think the answer depends on what is important to you in the image.  I shoot with both the M240 and M246.  Initially, I compared their output by taking the same shot with the same lens in good light (so ISO was not a factor).  The subtle tonal rendering and finer detail in the M246 was noticeable and important to me.  So my M246 gets used on subjects where those characteristics are most important to the image. For images where the colors are more important the M240 comes into play.  Occasionally the M246 comes out when color would be preferred, but the light levels won't let me use the M240, but that is not my primary use.   The one area where I would be happy with B&W conversions from my M240 is in people photography (portraits and events).  Unfortunately, I get a lot of push back from those who expect color images, so color it is.

[paulinmaryland]

@Luke_Miller - Thanks for your response.  As you say, I too find the 246 has more detail and tonality than the 240. But it seems to me that the downside of the 246 is not having the color channels to work with in terms of contrast and tweaking the image. As you say, it depends on what's important in the scene or image that I'm shooting. But I'm finding there are times when I miss having the color channels to work with, especially in terms of skin tones and increasing and creating more contrast between different colors in a street scene. 

On a related topic, how are your M240 and M246 holding up in terms of maintenance?  The decision to re-purchase a 240 in 2024 also involves the recognition the Leica has stopped making batteries for it, and will at some point, if not already, stop servicing them.  

[Luke_Miller]

3 hours ago, paulinmaryland said:

@Luke_Miller - Thanks for your response.  As you say, I too find the 246 has more detail and tonality than the 240. But it seems to me that the downside of the 246 is not having the color channels to work with in terms of contrast and tweaking the image. As you say, it depends on what's important in the scene or image that I'm shooting. But I'm finding there are times when I miss having the color channels to work with, especially in terms of skin tones and increasing and creating more contrast between different colors in a street scene. 

On a related topic, how are your M240 and M246 holding up in terms of maintenance?  The decision to re-purchase a 240 in 2024 also involves the recognition the Leica has stopped making batteries for it, and will at some point, if not already, stop servicing them.  

If you don't have it, you might consider Nik SilverEfex Pro.  It has a lot of tools that help compensate for the lack of color channel data.  Leica bundled it with the original Monochrom for this reason.

 

So far so good with the M240 & M246 holding up.  My understanding is batteries are still available new but are now only carried by Leica dealers as parts.  Leica store Miami shows them as out of stock, but available for pre-order.

[paulinmaryland]

@Luke_Miller - I have used SilverEfex Pro for years, but never the Color Filter panel.  I did an AI Query, to think through the difference between the processing of B&W with the 246 (filters) and the 240 (LRC Channels).  I thought the response was very clear and stated what I was thinking, that there are significant advantages to having the color information and being able to adjust in post, rather than applying color filters after the image is taken with the 246. Therefore, an argument for my returning to using the 240 and converting from color to BW using Lightroom classic, rather than Silver Efex.  As you say, it depends on the concept, and image and what you want to do.

I thought I would reproduce the AI query here, in case anyone else is interested!

Query - What is the difference between using color filters on black and white film, and changing the color sliders on a digital color image?

The main difference between using color filters on black and white film and adjusting color sliders on a digital color image comes down to how each method impacts the final grayscale result and the underlying technical processes:

1. Physical vs. Digital Process

• Color Filters on Black and White Film: These are physical filters placed over the lens during shooting. They selectively block certain wavelengths of light and let others through. For instance, a red filter allows red light to pass while blocking blue and green. This changes how colors are rendered in grayscale by altering the way the film reacts to different parts of the light spectrum. The result is an image where certain tones are emphasized or muted based on the filter used.
• Digital Color Sliders: These adjustments are made post-capture, during image editing. When converting a color digital image to black and white, you can use color sliders to control the brightness of specific color channels (e.g., red, green, blue). This allows you to mimic the effect of physical filters after the photo has been taken by adjusting how each color is interpreted in grayscale.

2. Impact on Image Tones

• Film with Color Filters: The effect is baked into the exposure, so using, for example, a yellow filter will brighten skies and lighten skin tones with warmer undertones. Once captured, this look is fixed and cannot be changed.
• Digital Color Sliders: You have more flexibility because you can adjust how each color channel contributes to the final black-and-white image at any time. This allows for fine-tuning and experimenting with different interpretations without re-shooting.

3. Pre- vs. Post-Processing

• Color Filters (Film): This method requires pre-visualization. You need to know in advance what effect you want, and the choice must be made at the time of shooting.
• Color Sliders (Digital): Adjustments are made in post-processing, so you can explore various tonal options after capturing the image. This is ideal for more nuanced control and experimentation.
• Digital Post-Processing: Adjusting color sliders is a part of digital image editing where you can modify the luminance, saturation, or hue of specific color channels after the image has been taken.
• Selective Control: With a color digital image, you have the flexibility to change how each color contributes to the grayscale conversion. This lets you mimic the effects of color filters or create unique interpretations without committing to one look during capture.
• Non-Destructive Editing: Adjustments can be made and refined at any time. You can easily experiment with different looks and revert changes as needed, which isn’t possible with film after development.
• Expanded Options: Digital editing allows for highly targeted adjustments (e.g., using software tools to fine-tune specific hues), giving more precise control over the outcome.

4. Level of Control

• Color Filters (Film): Offers a limited and singular effect based on the color of the filter. You can't fine-tune the result once the photo is taken.
• Color Sliders (Digital): Provide a broader range of control where you can tweak individual color channels to get subtle or dramatic tonal changes without limitation.

Summary: Using color filters on black and white film alters the image at the time of capture, influencing how certain colors are translated into shades of gray in a fixed way. In contrast, changing color sliders on a digital color image allows for flexible and reversible adjustments to how each color channel impacts the final grayscale conversion during post-processing.