I dropped my M10-R and now it's an M10-R-D?!

[JoshuaR]

Advertisement (gone after registration)

Yesterday, disaster struck, and my beloved M10-R took a huge tumble onto my driveway. It has no external damage that I can see. But:

• The buttons on the back no longer do anything.
• The red LED doesn't work.
• There's no live view.
• The Visoflex won't work.
• The screen won't work (although it isn't cracked).

At the same time:

• The camera still takes perfect photos, as far as I can tell, after testing it with various lenses and pixel-peeping the images.
• Battery life and battery behavior is unchanged.
• Auto ISO still works. Auto Shutter Speed still works. 6-bit coding still works.
• The LEDs in the viewfinder still work.
• The files are saved to the memory card as usual.

I've been very curious about the M11-D. In fact, I'm on the waitlist for one. And, other than the lack of live view / screen / LED, the camera is functioning as normal. So what I seem to have on my hands now is a sort of accidental screenless M10-R. I've shot it quite a lot post-accident and the camera seems perfectly stable.

The settings I have on the camera now (including -0.7 exposure comp) are what I use all the time and never change, so that's lucky. (It would be a big problem if it were set to, say, interval shooting.) But there are some issues I can foresee. Possibly, there is other damage—maybe even catastrophic damage—inside the camera that hasn't yet surfaced, and which might be exacerbated through further use. If I keep using it, I won't be able to adjust the Drive Mode. I won't able to clean the sensor unless I do something risky, like use Bulb. I can't use Leica Fotos, because I can't turn on the Wi-Fi. I can't format the card. But I can put the card in my M10M, and format it that way, and use Leica Fotos from there. Or I can just use a card reader.

I'm definitely not feeling like this development is a good thing—I'm pretty gutted that I damaged my main camera—but I am thinking that maybe I should just keep shooting the camera for a while. Both because I want to have a color M available to me during the holiday season, and because I'm curious about a screenless digital M and this might give me a sense of what that's like. It's not like my M10-R is under warranty; there's no rush to send it in for repair from that perspective.

I used the camera a lot yesterday, and I have to say that I was of two minds. I was quite upset that it's damaged, and also kind of enjoying the novelty of not having a working screen, and seeing this as a useful "trial period" for an M11-D. This is a crazy combination of reactions that I suspect only the people in this forum might possibly understand!

In all seriousness: Is it highly unwise to delay repair and keep using the camera in this state? 

Edited November 4, 2024 by JoshuaRothman

[JoshuaR]

7 minutes ago, Al Brown said:

There can be some major internal problems not immediatelly visible or noticeable. Do not delay repair.

Alas, this is what I'm thinking, too.

[LocalHero1953]

Drop it again and it might revert to a film camera.

[pedaes]

Sorry to hear, Off to Wetzlar for a fix and back to good as new. Hope you have some insurance cover. Keep us posted on progress 

[Mute-on]

At least you can be confident you’ll receive your new M11-D long before you receive your repaired M10-R back from Wetzlar … 

[dugby]

15 hours ago, JoshuaRothman said:

 

Edited November 5, 2024 by dugby

[mujk]

Advertisement (gone after registration)

Sorry to hear about your accident. Interesting that there is no visible external damage. This may depend on in what position it hit the ground. I have managed to drop my M10 twice, with only very minor external damage and luckily no noticeable internal problems.

The fault may be as small as a ribbon cable that has come loose, but, as noted by others in this thread, there could also be major internal damage.

 

[charlesphoto99]

My black paint M10-R would often lose all use of back buttons and screen above a certain ambient temperature (I think it was like around 75-80F). Fixed under warranty. I bring this up because it sounds so similar (minus the drop). Could be a motherboard or cable issue. I wouldn't assume 'major' internal damage as the others have pointed out, or the camera would not function otherwise. But being Leica, it will still probably be $$, and take months to fix. 

[JoshuaR]

On 11/5/2024 at 8:25 AM, charlesphoto99 said:

My black paint M10-R would often lose all use of back buttons and screen above a certain ambient temperature (I think it was like around 75-80F). Fixed under warranty. I bring this up because it sounds so similar (minus the drop). Could be a motherboard or cable issue. I wouldn't assume 'major' internal damage as the others have pointed out, or the camera would not function otherwise. But being Leica, it will still probably be $$, and take months to fix. 

Thanks for this, @charlesphoto99, it's helpful. I shot with the camera all day yesterday, then came home and pulled the pictures off the SD card They look great, as always. So it's a bit of a conundrum for me whether to (a) have the camera repaired right away or (b) keep shooting with it until it actually becomes unusable. At the moment, it's actually eminently usable.

For a long time I shot on an M2 with broken 50mm framelines; I just used 35mm and guesstimated. But it feels different to shoot with a faulty digital camera, since electronic systems are so interconnected. 

I'll probably send it in later this week. Even though I'm actually quite enjoying the experience of having a digital camera without a screen....

[Mahesh]

Don't go for M11... After seeing all pictures people post here and comparing with m10-R, I am not excited anymore

[pedaes]

11 minutes ago, Mahesh said:

Don't go for M11... After seeing all pictures people post here and comparing with m10-R, I am not excited anymore

I would be surprised if you were. Are you expecting big improvements visible on a website? Key fact, no camera becomes a bad camera just because a revised model arrives.But if you want a 18 to 60mp sensor with native 64ISO you want a M11.

[Mahesh]

1 hour ago, pedaes said:

I would be surprised if you were. Are you expecting big improvements visible on a website? Key fact, no camera becomes a bad camera just because a revised model arrives.But if you want a 18 to 60mp sensor with native 64ISO you want a M11.

Who said M10-R has become a bad camera? 

[satijntje]

I dropped my m10-r black paint. 
new top cover + new bottom plate + new screen

Camera is still in Wetzlar since September. 
4 months waiting time is needed.

Costs: 1500€, but my Insurance will cover it. 

[JoshuaR]

5 hours ago, satijntje said:

I dropped my m10-r black paint. 
new top cover + new bottom plate + new screen

Camera is still on Wetzlar since September. 
4 months waiting time is needed.

Costs: 1500€, but my Insurance will cover it. 

It's the waiting time that I'm least excited about. I will definitely get the camera repaired at some point.... So far, though, it's been fine. The accident happened about two weeks ago, and I've used the camera every day since. Honestly it's more fun to use without the screen! The only real downside, so far, is that I can't use uncoded lenses. But I only own two, and am happy to use them on my other cameras.

[pedaes]

11 hours ago, JoshuaRothman said:

is that I can't use uncoded lenses. But I only own two, and am happy to use them on my other cameras.

Why not?  The camera will remember last manual coding so that is 50% of your uncoded lenses. And will use that profile for the other, so dependant on focal length may not mater (very little 'correction' is applied to lenses from 35mm up).  I know EXIF will be incorrect. 

[JoshuaR]

Update: it's been about two months, and the camera is still going strong. I've used it every day since dropping it and the pictures are as beautiful as ever. The metering, shutter speeds, rangefinder calibration, etc. are all totally fine.

I've used a blower to clean the sensor, by holding down the shutter release while the camera was in bulb mode. I'm not sure I feel comfortable trying to do an actual wet sensor cleaning this way—that's a bridge I'll have to cross at some point as long as the camera stays broken.

Another downside: I can't check the battery level. So I've taken to carrying my second battery around with me, just in case.

And no Leica FOTOS. I enjoy that workflow—selecting favorites on the iPad and then downloading only those images—and I haven't loved going back to a card reader. And I did occasionally use the self-timer function for group photos in which I wanted to be included—I can't do that anymore. And there's always the possibility that the camera will simply stop working all of a sudden because of some long-simmering internal problem. 

Otherwise, my experience has been . . . actually improved. I never used Live View, so don't miss it. I can't chimp now and so don't. This is genuinely nice. I've also got used to the fact that the screen and buttons don't work and so I no longer try to use them and end up frustrated. I was always curious about a screenless digital M and after a two-month accidental trial I'm persuaded.

I've thought (obviously) about sending it in for repair, and also about selling some gear to get an M11 and keeping this M10-R, as is, as a backup. But the costs of either plan would be pretty substantial. So I'm kind of drifting into just using it as-is for as long as I can. Sort of like an old guy who keeps using his broken TV because he's too cheap to buy a new one.

My car is really beat up, and I still use it. So why not my M?

This has been a long self-indulgent diaristic post, so if you got here, thanks for reading!

[pgh]

I love it.

I dropped my M10 Mono 18 months ago - I lost a few functions but it still shoots photos in the way that I need. Sort of wish the screen broke, as my dream camera would be a monochrom D. Anyways, goes to show how far attitude and perspective can take you. 

I keep telling myself I'll send in my mono and get it back to full working condition but at the same time...who cares? It IS in working condition...just not in all of the ways it originally was. Still, in what matters, no issues! 

One reason I don't want the 11D is because I feel like 60 mp is just too much resolution for a handheld camera without IBIS, and at that resolution chimping actually is more useful because the surprises in camera shake pop up more often, frankly. Sure, it's a matter of technique but then you have to treat that thing in a way that is sort of antithetical to what makes Leicas special. 40 is sort of the top limit I think, and even then you've got to be more careful.

Anyways, I think you're on the right track. 

[Mahesh]

6 hours ago, JoshuaR said:

Update: it's been about two months, and the camera is still going strong. I've used it every day since dropping it and the pictures are as beautiful as ever. The metering, shutter speeds, rangefinder calibration, etc. are all totally fine.

I've used a blower to clean the sensor, by holding down the shutter release while the camera was in bulb mode. I'm not sure I feel comfortable trying to do an actual wet sensor cleaning this way—that's a bridge I'll have to cross at some point as long as the camera stays broken.

Another downside: I can't check the battery level. So I've taken to carrying my second battery around with me, just in case.

And no Leica FOTOS. I enjoy that workflow—selecting favorites on the iPad and then downloading only those images—and I haven't loved going back to a card reader. And I did occasionally use the self-timer function for group photos in which I wanted to be included—I can't do that anymore. And there's always the possibility that the camera will simply stop working all of a sudden because of some long-simmering internal problem. 

Otherwise, my experience has been . . . actually improved. I never used Live View, so don't miss it. I can't chimp now and so don't. This is genuinely nice. I've also got used to the fact that the screen and buttons don't work and so I no longer try to use them and end up frustrated. I was always curious about a screenless digital M and after a two-month accidental trial I'm persuaded.

I've thought (obviously) about sending it in for repair, and also about selling some gear to get an M11 and keeping this M10-R, as is, as a backup. But the costs of either plan would be pretty substantial. So I'm kind of drifting into just using it as-is for as long as I can. Sort of like an old guy who keeps using his broken TV because he's too cheap to buy a new one.

My car is really beat up, and I still use it. So why not my M?

This has been a long self-indulgent diaristic post, so if you got here, thanks for reading!

talk about "sweating your assets" or milking them 🙂 🙂