Eye AF Q2 in FW5.0.... is it limited or am I just Too New?

[BobsFirstLeica]

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Howdy,

First post.  Happy to be here.  Got my Q2, mostly for pleasure photos, about 3 weeks ago, first Leica.  Updated to FW 4.0 2 weeks ago and today to 5.0.  Short history.  I am an "older" pro who shoots with Sony, Nikon, and Fuji.  I use the most current models.  The EyeAF on the Z9 and A1's have really spoiled me.  Enough of that.  Tested the 5.0 EyeAF on previously taken images on my monitor at f/1.7 and it seemed to work as advertised.  My wife got home this evening and, being an obedient model (yeah right) the Q2 would not detect her eyes at f/1.7.  We went for our evening walk, came back and it did work.  What I discovered is the Q2's EyeAF, again at f/1.7, will function only when the distance to the person is within about 5 to 6 feet.  I tested it by walking back and forth..  I further tested it on my monitor just now.

The question I have..... is this normal behavior?  The reality is EyeAF in a 28mm lens any further away is not what I may normally do.  I would just use spot AF and catch the eye or manual focus.  So, being a relatively new Leica owner, and my first post on this forum, please tell me how I am being stupid or what I am overlooking.

Thanks,

Bob

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[Casey Jefferson]

Before the eye AF was a thing (not even changing focus point), everyone just focus and recompose. M users are still doing this till this day, with manual focus.

Fortunately, focus and recompose worked on this lens (which 99% of those mirrorless lens don't) very well. Leica know what they are doing and making the lens behaved similarly to M lenses. I believe Leica is doing it simply because of what the public are demanding. You see, major brand mirrorless users weren't perfectly happy with it as it's not 100% foolproof either...

[Simone_DF]

1 hour ago, Casey Jefferson said:

Before the eye AF was a thing (not even changing focus point), everyone just focus and recompose. M users are still doing this till this day, with manual focus.

Fortunately, focus and recompose worked on this lens (which 99% of those mirrorless lens don't) very well. Leica know what they are doing and making the lens behaved similarly to M lenses. I believe Leica is doing it simply because of what the public are demanding. You see, major brand mirrorless users weren't perfectly happy with it as it's not 100% foolproof either...

Yeah, and before the washing machines everybody washed their clothes manually at a fountain. 

But we are in 2023 now, expectations are different.

@BobsFirstLeica no, that's sadly the normal behaviour. Don't listen to the absurd FUD above, the Q2 is a fine camera, but AF is not one of its strong points. The Q3 will most likely put it on par with the SL2, which has a vastly improved AF engine and eye-af is way more reliable.

[BobsFirstLeica]

Hello, Casey,

As an "older" photog "focus and recompose" is something I have in muscle memory.  However, newer cams' abilities to face and eye AF have made shooting a little more precise at times and more convenient.  Face AF with the Q2 using FW 4.0 for a couple of weeks was pretty accurate and seemed to function quite well.  Since the Q2 will function as a pleasure cam and not to earn $$$, I am not as concerned.  However, I need to better learn it (like all new cams) so I can better integrate myself with its elegantly efficient menus and functions.  It is a very nice cam.....don't get me wrong.  Actually one of the nice functions (previously unknown to me)  is its faux 35, 50, and 75mm boxes.  Less resolution but perfectly acceptable images.  Lastly, I really didn't know how good the lens was until I put it through my own personal tests.  When I ramp down my business and sell off some gear I may become more of a Leica person.  As you can see from my adopted screen name and a new user, I called myself BobsFirstLeica.  There is probably a second and third on the horizon.  Thanks for responding.

Bob 

[BobsFirstLeica]

17 minutes ago, Simone_DF said:

Yeah, and before the washing machines everybody washed their clothes manually at a fountain. 

But we are in 2023 now, expectations are different.

@BobsFirstLeica no, that's sadly the normal behaviour. Don't listen to the absurd FUD above, the Q2 is a fine camera, but AF is not one of its strong points. The Q3 will most likely put it on par with the SL2, which has a vastly improved AF engine and eye-af is way more reliable.

So far, the AF has been fairly accurate on subjects non-human.  Haven't tested MF as much.  Why?  Up to a few months ago I had fairly ripe cataracts and had to rely solely on AF and, especially, eyeAF for precise focus.  Luckily my cams provide that.  After surgery, which opened a new world of vision, I could return to MF in certain situations.  Having used eyeAF for about 5 years on Sony kinda spoiled me.  So when Leica announced eyeAF in FW5.0 I was intrigued.  Actually in close range it functions quite nicely.  With multiple people it is very good at quickly allowing you to select which eye to focus.  Again, one needs to almost be on top of the subject for that to occur.  Maybe an exaggeration but the point holds.

It won't however be a deal breaker by any stretch.  The Q2 is a keeper unless the Q3 blows it out of the water. 😁

Bob

[LocalHero1953]

Yes, your experience is normal. I am a great fan of the Q2, but I am looking forward to the Q3 with a more powerful processor and the ability to find a face half turned away from me at a greater distance than a couple of metres. I wish Leica had sorted body and face recognition before they started on eye focus.

Edited April 20, 2023 by LocalHero1953

[Farrell Gallery]

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These features almost defeat the purpose of a Leica. It’s a deliberate shooter’s camera. 

[LocalHero1953]

17 minutes ago, Farrell Gallery said:

These features almost defeat the purpose of a Leica. It’s a deliberate shooter’s camera. 

No it isn't 🙂. It's a modern point-and-shoot camera.

Discuss!

Edited April 20, 2023 by LocalHero1953

[BobsFirstLeica]

1 hour ago, LocalHero1953 said:

Yes, your experience is normal. I am a great fan of the Q2, but I am looking forward to the Q3 with a more powerful processor and the ability to find a face half turned away from me at a greater distance than a couple of metres. I wish Leica had sorted body and face recognition before they started on eye focus.

Thanks for the confirmation.  Each cam has its idiosyncrasies and it is good to know I may not be the only one with certain expectations when and if a new feature is added, especially with 4 or 5 year-old tech.  However, that tech is just fine for me.  Comparing it to my first Nikon film cam in the late 1960's, I think it will do!

Bob

[BobsFirstLeica]

25 minutes ago, LocalHero1953 said:

No it isn't 🙂. It's a modern point-and-shoot camera.

Discuss!

"A modern point-and-shoot camera."  On steroids!  I own a recent Jeep Cherokee Trailhawk.  I can go off road with very few problems and traverse almost any terrain.  Some would argue it is really not a "Jeep."
It is not a traditional Wrangler but has some amenities that make it quieter on the highway and more carlike in the interior.  I consider my Cherokee Trailhawk a more modern Wrangler.  

Bob

[Simone_DF]

1 hour ago, Farrell Gallery said:

These features almost defeat the purpose of a Leica. It’s a deliberate shooter’s camera. 

Then why implement it and go all the way to advertise it on their website?

"The Leica Object Detection AF ensures fast and reliable AF performance. In addition to a number of modes and functions, including eye and face detection," 

[mjw3]

The Q2 is still a contrast-detect AF system. It will never equal a phase detect system, nor will it ever be a run/gun platform. No amount of firmware changes can fix that.

My other thoughts on the mater is the eye-AF is an enhancement, and a nice to have. It’s an old model (in tech years) and I applaud Leica for even giving it this much attention for free.

[bobtodrick]

3 hours ago, Farrell Gallery said:

These features almost defeat the purpose of a Leica. It’s a deliberate shooter’s camera. 

Yes, the reason I love the Q is it makes you think…a lost art these days I fear.

There are a ton of cameras out there that do absolutely everything…so lots of choices.

But I guess I too am a fud…a actually like to shift the gears in my car myself as well.

Horrors 😂

Edited April 20, 2023 by bobtodrick

[Farrell Gallery]

2 hours ago, LocalHero1953 said:

No it isn't 🙂. It's a modern point-and-shoot camera.

Discuss!

It is….but it’s not a Sony. Technology vs. character 

[LocalHero1953]

2 minutes ago, Farrell Gallery said:

It is….but it’s not a Sony. Technology vs. character 

Oh I agree, but the brilliance of the design, to me, is that it can be both for deliberate shooting and sharp shooting, without delving into a menu.

[bobtodrick]

7 hours ago, Simone_DF said:

Yeah, and before the washing machines everybody washed their clothes manually at a fountain. 

But we are in 2023 now, expectations are different.

@BobsFirstLeica no, that's sadly the normal behaviour. Don't listen to the absurd FUD above

Some are fuds…some are techie dorks…it’s a big world 😂😂😂

If one need to resort to name calling…there’s one for everyone!

Edited April 20, 2023 by bobtodrick

[BobsFirstLeica]

3 hours ago, bobtodrick said:

Yes, the reason I love the Q is it makes you think…a lost art these days I fear.

There are a ton of cameras out there that do absolutely everything…so lots of choices.

But I guess I too am a fud…a actually like to shift the gears in my car myself as well.

Horrors 😂

I would hope when shooting, one would take notice of everything involved in the shot.  And then, one makes necessary adjustments based upon subject, background, etc. That's probably why people own these types of cameras, even the ones "that do absolutely everything."  If one is not concerned with the "delicacies" of what is going to be in the frame, just take out your smartphone, aim, frame, and tap the circle.

Bob

[Farrell Gallery]

2 hours ago, bobtodrick said:

Some are fuds…some are techie dorks…it’s a big world 😂😂😂

If one need to resort to name calling…there’s one for everyone!

You don't want to know what a fud is in Scotland  

I hear you....I think the technology is just a bonus, as Leica doesn't make the AF or other face detection features. 

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Hallo,

Look here: Leica Q

[Casey Jefferson]

13 hours ago, Simone_DF said:

Yeah, and before the washing machines everybody washed their clothes manually at a fountain. 

But we are in 2023 now, expectations are different.

@BobsFirstLeica no, that's sadly the normal behaviour. Don't listen to the absurd FUD above, the Q2 is a fine camera, but AF is not one of its strong points. The Q3 will most likely put it on par with the SL2, which has a vastly improved AF engine and eye-af is way more reliable.

Absurd FUD? I'm proud to be one. 😏

@BobsFirstLeica I enjoyed the Q2 for what it is, and it does things I really love, while also irked me for certain things too, lacking eye af isn't one of it. It's not a perfect camera, but none of the camera is.

Leica didn't not falsely advertise it. Does it detect eyes? Yes it does. Does it perform reliably and highly dependable? That's not what Leica claimed. It's been around for 4 years now and finally everyone is trying to attack it when Leica spent the effort to squeeze out the last drop of juice from the camera.

Now let me go double check the meaning of "absurd"...

[BobsFirstLeica]

31 minutes ago, Casey Jefferson said:

Absurd FUD? I'm proud to be one. 😏

@BobsFirstLeica I enjoyed the Q2 for what it is, and it does things I really love, while also irked me for certain things too, lacking eye af isn't one of it. It's not a perfect camera, but none of the camera is.

Leica didn't not falsely advertise it. Does it detect eyes? Yes it does. Does it perform reliably and highly dependable? That's not what Leica claimed. It's been around for 4 years now and finally everyone is trying to attack it when Leica spent the effort to squeeze out the last drop of juice from the camera.

Now let me go double check the meaning of "absurd"...

I didn't realize my question would get an emotional response by a few members.  I knew what the Q2 could do and not do before my recent purchase.  What I didn't know is Leica was about to release FW 5.0.  My initial question was one of curiosity.  As I stated initially, focus and recompose is fine with me.....especially with that beautiful 28mm/1.7 lens in front of the sensor.

Bob