Double shoe adaptor from Cameraquest

[farnz]

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I've been searching for a (discontinued) Voigtlander double shoe adaptor for a while - nothing on that auction site - and I discovered that Stephen Gandy has some type B and C double shoe adaptors over at Cameraquest. The website states "Discontinued and sold out at the factory" but I emailed Stephen anyway to check and he emailed me right back that he still has some in stock.

 

I ordered one last Tuesday and it arrived by first class post in London this morning (Monday) - exceptionally fast when you consider that there's a weekend, Customs and Excise, and recent UK postal strikes to slow things down.

 

Excellent work, Cameraquest!

 

Pete.

[Speenth]

Ah ha! Could this be the solution for 'Thumbs-Up' users like me?

 

Over the last couple of months I've come to regard my Thumbs-Up as a fundamental component of my M8. The Thumbs-Up gives me a much steadier grip on the camera and I am loathe now to do without it. But ... it is very difficult to remove from the accessory shoe and no other accessories can be fitted when it is in place.

 

If these Voigtlander double shoes can still be obtained some questions arise:

 

1 I note several different post heights were originally available. Anyone any idea which version fits the M8 best?

2 Do people think the Thumbs-Up would be 'secure' on this additional component, or might the mechanical moment be a little too great?

3 Isn't there going to be a problem with parallax error - or is it sufficiently slight that we'll get used to it (like M8 framelines)?

[gwelland]

I think you'd find that the thumbs up will sit too high on the back of the camera if you try to use the double shoe. Also, you will increase the twisting moment on the original hot shoe if you attached the thumbs up.

 

The double shoe is nicely made btw. I use one with a 28mm viewfinder and the funky CV level when I shoot with my Zeiss 21/2.8.

[voightL]

.......

If these Voigtlander double shoes can still be obtained some questions arise:

 

1 I note several different post heights were originally available. Anyone any idea which version fits the M8 best?

...........

 

I think Type A (with lowest profile) is Best!

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[FotoABC]

How coincident! It was also out of stock in Hong Kong, i have waited for about one month, and just bought one Voigtlander doppelschuh adapter a couple of hours ago at 380HK$ (about 48US$).

[farnz]

1 I note several different post heights were originally available. Anyone any idea which version fits the M8 best?

2 Do people think the Thumbs-Up would be 'secure' on this additional component, or might the mechanical moment be a little too great?

3 Isn't there going to be a problem with parallax error - or is it sufficiently slight that we'll get used to it (like M8 framelines)?

Stephen,

 

1. Stephen Gandy advised use of the type B with an M8, which he sent and which fits my M8.

2. I think the moment would cause problems eventually.

3. I guess it depends how close up you're intending to shoot and whether you're going to put a VF into the 2nd shoe. My intention is to leave a 21mm VF for use with the CV15 in the centred shoe and alternate between a rangefinder and polariser as suits so I don't expect parallax to be more of a concern than usual.

 

Pete.

[Speenth]

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Stephen,

 

1. Stephen Gandy advised use of the type B with an M8, which he sent and which fits my M8.

2. I think the moment would cause problems eventually.

3. I guess it depends how close up you're intending to shoot and whether you're going to put a VF into the 2nd shoe. My intention is to leave a 21mm VF for use with the CV15 in the centred shoe and alternate between a rangefinder and polariser as suits so I don't expect parallax to be more of a concern than usual.

 

Pete.

 

Hi Pete,

 

Thanks for the thorough response - I'll try to get hold of one, failing that we'll all have to grovel to Voigtlander to persuade them to manufacture a new batch or upgraded design. Maybe its a new project for Tim of the Thumbs-Up!

[Fotogo]

Ah ha! Could this be the solution for 'Thumbs-Up' users like me?

 

Over the last couple of months I've come to regard my Thumbs-Up as a fundamental component of my M8. The Thumbs-Up gives me a much steadier grip on the camera and I am loathe now to do without it. But ... it is very difficult to remove from the accessory shoe and no other accessories can be fitted when it is in place.

 

If these Voigtlander double shoes can still be obtained some questions arise:

 

1 I note several different post heights were originally available. Anyone any idea which version fits the M8 best?

2 Do people think the Thumbs-Up would be 'secure' on this additional component, or might the mechanical moment be a little too great?

3 Isn't there going to be a problem with parallax error - or is it sufficiently slight that we'll get used to it (like M8 framelines)?

 

Speenth,

Perhaps you would consider this version of my Thumbs Up CS. I would be most interested in your comment.

 

It would also be useful to determine the optimum spacing between the cold shoes.

 

What is your thoughts on this point?

 

Tim

 

[papimuzo]

Hi Tim,

you can count me as a client for the TU CS model 1!! By this way I will test the model 1(owning model 3) and get all I need as I never use a flash but only some viewfinders.

Best luck for production...

 

BTW: your e-mail address sometimes seems to be rejected (right now for example) but not always, even using different providers from my side.

[cme4brain]

Speenth,

Perhaps you would consider this version of my Thumbs Up CS. I would be most interested in your comment.

 

It would also be useful to determine the optimum spacing between the cold shoes.

 

What is your thoughts on this point?

 

Tim

 

 

Tim, that is a remarkable design, please put me down to purchase it. If the shoe closest to the outboard thumb holder is hot (sits on the camera hot shoe), then it can hold/power a flash without putting any bending moment on the camera topplate shoe to hold a heavy flash. I would keep the other cold shoe at a reasonable distance from the hot shoe holding the flash to allow the use of a viewfinder- some flash bases are wide as are some viewfinders. The parallax caused by an outboard (distant) viewfinder is minimal at best, compared to the advantage of using both a flash and a wide angle viewfinder.

[barjohn]

Tim, I too am a purchaser of your model 3 and love it but would like the flash hot shoe as it is a pain to remove when I need to use the hot shoe. If you make one, put me down for one.

[sean_reid]

That looks like a very cool accessory.

 

Cheers,

 

Sean

[geoff]

Speenth,

Perhaps you would consider this version of my Thumbs Up CS. I would be most interested in your comment.

 

It would also be useful to determine the optimum spacing between the cold shoes.

 

What is your thoughts on this point?

 

Tim

 

 

Tim,

 

I’m a little confused. Does the Thumbs Up model 1 CS and model 4 CS, with the two shoes, feature a hot shoe or do they both only have cold shoes. The images suggest hot shoes but you have them both referred to as “Cold Shoe” versions (CS). If they do indeed feature a hot shoe, with live contacts, perhaps they should be be referred to as “HS” (hot shoe) rather than “CS” (cold shoe) or “CSHS” for a combination of both.

 

Honestly, I see minimal need for a dual “cold shoe” Thumps Up. However, there is a strong practical real world need for a dual hot shoe solution or a combo cold shoe/hot shoe version. The need being to provide simultaneous flash and external viewfinder support. Personally, I routinely use an Cosina Voigtlander Super-Wide Heliar 15mm f4.5 Aspherical in tandem with an MicroSync Digital wireless flash transmitter mounted in the M8 hot shoe. As such, the ability to deploy a highly useful external wide-angle viewfinder is lost.

 

Also, with a combo solution, the hot shoe should be the farther offset shoe in order to minimize parallax error with an ideally mounted external viewfinder just above the camera’s own hot shoe mount.

 

To answer your posed question, I think the spacing between shoes should be as wide as possible, up to, but not obscuring the view of the top panel LCD that displays the number of pictures remaining and battery status. None-the-less, this still would not be enough distance to ideally mounted Leica Universal Wide-Angle Viewfinder above the camera’s shoe mount without blocking the second shoe.

 

On a more esoteric note, there are a lot of M8 owners, including myself, that use a Luigi M8 Half Case to protect their cameras. However, this conflicts with the use of any current designed Thumps Up model.

 

I would be extremely interested in a single product solution that simultaneously facilitated the use of an external viewfinder and provided live flash sync (i.e., Thumps Up CSHS). However, ideally for me, I would be even more interested in a slightly modified version that specifically supported the use of a protective case such as the Luigi M8 Half Case (i.e., Thumps Up CSHS-HC).

 

 

Geoff

MySpace.com - *g e o f f* - 100 - Männlich - PHILADELPHIA, PENNSYLVANIA - www.myspace.com/geoffotos

[Jamie Roberts]

Ditto--I'd need one (at least) hot shoe on this accessory.

[geoff]

After closer scrutiny of the Thumps Up images it would appear that the shoe mounts are indeed cold shoes. However, I could be wrong and look forward to a confirmation, one way or the other, from Tim.

 

It should be noted that Michael Bass does offer “Custom Double Hot Shoe from Double Cold Shoe” implementation/modification for those with the Voigtlander Double Shoe Adapter. Perhaps he could also perform the same feat with a Thumps Up CS.

 

Tim meet Michael. Michael, Tim.

 

 

Geoff

MySpace.com -  g e o f f  - 100 - Männlich - PHILADELPHIA, PENNSYLVANIA - www.myspace.com/geoffotos

[Fotogo]

After closer scrutiny of the Thumps Up images it would appear that the shoe mounts are indeed cold shoes. However, I could be wrong and look forward to a confirmation, one way or the other, from Tim.

 

It should be noted that Michael Bass does offer “Custom Double Hot Shoe from Double Cold Shoe” implementation/modification for those with the Voigtlander Double Shoe Adapter. Perhaps he could also perform the same feat with a Thumps Up CS.

 

Tim meet Michael. Michael, Tim.

 

 

Geoff

MySpace.com - g e o f f - 100 - Männlich - PHILADELPHIA, PENNSYLVANIA - www.myspace.com/geoffotos

 

Geoff,

You are correct sir. The Thumbs Up CS designs are all cold shoe only at this point.

 

Michael's Voigtlander modification is so very well done. You have my interest on this subject and many other's have expressed a need for a hotshoe versions. Time for me to get back to the 'drawing board'.

 

There also seems a need for coldshoe versions of Thumbs Up as many of us are available light photographers. Thanks so much for your guidance here.

 

Tim Isaac

[harmsr]

Tim,

 

The only reason that I have not purchased one of your thumbs up units yet is the need for a cold shoe and that it interferes with my Luigi case.

 

If you make one these that doesn't interfere with a standard Luigi case, I'm very interested.

 

Thanks,

 

Ray

[Fotogo]

Tim,

 

The only reason that I have not purchased one of your thumbs up units yet is the need for a cold shoe and that it interferes with my Luigi case.

 

If you make one these that doesn't interfere with a standard Luigi case, I'm very interested.

 

Thanks,

 

Ray

 

Ray,

Luigi has modified his great designs to accommodate a Thumbs Up. Etrigan has a version of this style. You might have a look here.

 

M8's New Clothes - Rangefinderforum.com

[Fotogo]

Tim,

 

I’m a little confused. Does the Thumbs Up model 1 CS and model 4 CS, with the two shoes, feature a hot shoe or do they both only have cold shoes. The images suggest hot shoes but you have them both referred to as “Cold Shoe” versions (CS). If they do indeed feature a hot shoe, with live contacts, perhaps they should be be referred to as “HS” (hot shoe) rather than “CS” (cold shoe) or “CSHS” for a combination of both.

 

Honestly, I see minimal need for a dual “cold shoe” Thumps Up. However, there is a strong practical real world need for a dual hot shoe solution or a combo cold shoe/hot shoe version. The need being to provide simultaneous flash and external viewfinder support. Personally, I routinely use an Cosina Voigtlander Super-Wide Heliar 15mm f4.5 Aspherical in tandem with an MicroSync Digital wireless flash transmitter mounted in the M8 hot shoe. As such, the ability to deploy a highly useful external wide-angle viewfinder is lost.

 

Also, with a combo solution, the hot shoe should be the farther offset shoe in order to minimize parallax error with an ideally mounted external viewfinder just above the camera’s own hot shoe mount.

 

To answer your posed question, I think the spacing between shoes should be as wide as possible, up to, but not obscuring the view of the top panel LCD that displays the number of pictures remaining and battery status. None-the-less, this still would not be enough distance to ideally mounted Leica Universal Wide-Angle Viewfinder above the camera’s shoe mount without blocking the second shoe.

 

On a more esoteric note, there are a lot of M8 owners, including myself, that use a Luigi M8 Half Case to protect their cameras. However, this conflicts with the use of any current designed Thumps Up model.

 

I would be extremely interested in a single product solution that simultaneously facilitated the use of an external viewfinder and provided live flash sync (i.e., Thumps Up CSHS). However, ideally for me, I would be even more interested in a slightly modified version that specifically supported the use of a protective case such as the Luigi M8 Half Case (i.e., Thumps Up CSHS-HC).

 

 

Geoff

MySpace.com - *g e o f f* - 100 - Männlich - PHILADELPHIA, PENNSYLVANIA - www.myspace.com/geoffotos

 

Sunday morning here and some time to mess around with this Thumbs Up-CS Mod 4 idea. I mounted the Mod 4 on my virtual M8 just to start to look at clearance issues and to calculate some torques and alignment and accessibility constraints that should be considered. But first and maybe most important is the interference with the exposure counter / battery meter and the initial footprint of this layout.

 

Please have a look and I would appreciate all comments.

 

 

 

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Hallo,

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[Speenth]

Sunday morning here and some time to mess around with this Thumbs Up-CS Mod 4 idea. I mounted the Mod 4 on my virtual M8 just to start to look at clearance issues and to calculate some torques and alignment and accessibility constraints that should be considered. But first and maybe most important is the interference with the exposure counter / battery meter and the initial footprint of this layout.

 

Please have a look and I would appreciate all comments.

 

 

Hello Tim,

 

My apologies for my long delayed response to you (and all the other M8 forum friends) who replied to my original comments on this double shoe topic. Travelling in central Africa for the last three weeks I've had serious difficulties with Internet access! However, enough of the excuses, to the subject of this discussion:

 

Once again, you're well on the way to delivering an essential component for the M8 with the direct and fullest involvement of M8 users themselves - the very best way to develop any product.

 

I really like the look of the Thumbs Up CS Mod 4 and you can count me in when its ready to ship. A couple of thoughts come to mind as I review your design:

 

• As others have said, at least one of the shoes must be a hot shoe. If only one of the pair is to be hot, it should be the one furthest from the lens axis to improve flash performance. However, this raises the issue of the wiring. Might a tubular connecting arm be the solution?
  

 

• The left shoe currently obscures the counter - an attractive solution might be to have this shoe ahead of the right hand shoe by angling the connecting arm forwards. In this way the left hand shoe could very slightly overhang the front of the camera body and incorporate a lipped forward edge to 'clip' over the front of the body and improve the rigidity of the whole structure. Of course, this assumes there could be enough flexibility in the arm to allow mounting and dismounting.
  

 

• The arm presents the opportunity to be used in some useful manner - how about an SD card holder?
  

 

Just thoughts.

 

I do hope this topic continues with the intensity of your original Thumbs Up project on the Rangefinder forum. That was a truly interesting exercise in customer focussed product development and yielded a great result. Now an even better product is on the stocks and its up to us users to be your design team.

 

Good luck with the CS Mod 4!