SL3 Rumors

[BigBabyEarl]

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Wow. Haha. This thread is literally last call at a crappy strip club vibes. Leica needs to work harder on this format (SL). Mini SL. SL Monochrom. Something. Can’t go this long. They get lapped and people leave. Same happened with SL601. I couldn’t take it anymore when I didn’t get a 35mm lens for 4 years. 

[Olaf_ZG]

33 minutes ago, BigBabyEarl said:

Wow. Haha. This thread is literally last call at a crappy strip club vibes. Leica needs to work harder on this format (SL). Mini SL. SL Monochrom. Something. Can’t go this long. They get lapped and people leave. Same happened with SL601. I couldn’t take it anymore when I didn’t get a 35mm lens for 4 years. 

Sad but maybe true. Though the SL is great, to me some features are missing. Capability of real long exposure and wide angle is one part.

will not sell my 2s, but most probably will not upgrade or invest in SL lenses further.

[trickness]

2 hours ago, BigBabyEarl said:

Wow. Haha. This thread is literally last call at a crappy strip club vibes. Leica needs to work harder on this format (SL). Mini SL. SL Monochrom. Something. Can’t go this long. They get lapped and people leave. Same happened with SL601. I couldn’t take it anymore when I didn’t get a 35mm lens for 4 years. 

There’s absolutely nothing else this camera needs to take great pictures. 

[whowell]

2 hours ago, trickness said:

There’s absolutely nothing else this camera needs to take great pictures. 

True... but... an articulating screen, longer battery life, and a global shutter would make the sl3 one camera to rule them all... (in 35mm land of course)... 

[Stuart Richardson]

17 minutes ago, whowell said:

True... but... an articulating screen, longer battery life, and a global shutter would make the sl3 one camera to rule them all... (in 35mm land of course)... 

Interesting...I have not missed any of those things...not even the battery life (of course, more is always better in this case...).

[trickness]

1 hour ago, whowell said:

True... but... an articulating screen, longer battery life, and a global shutter would make the sl3 one camera to rule them all... (in 35mm land of course)... 

We’ve already got a new battery from the Q3. I’m using it in my SL2 and it does give a bit more battery capacity. I’m certainly not expecting that they’re going to come out with yet another battery for an SL3, I think that’s folly. And using the articulating screen frequently is going to burn down the battery fast no matter what the capacity.

Not having an articulating screen or a global shutter (whatever that is) has not prevented me from taking a single picture that I found to be successful in the past three years of owning this camera.

These are nice things to have, not necessary things, and certainly nothing that relegates the SL2 to “last call at a crappy strip club” status (as someone posted above). I don’t even know what that means.

[LeicaR10]

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Trickness,  I totally agree with your Post 507.  The SL2 is and will remain an excellent camera.  I would venture to write that many photographers hardly ever use most of the many features offered by the SL2, much less understand how to work the camera to create superb photographs.  Many photographers overlook the need for mastering both their camera and lenses, plus the same goes for composition and content and other attributes that help create good photographs.  The SL2 like any camera, is simply a tool.  In the right hands, it can create masterpiece and memorable photographs such as your many works of fine portraits.  There are no "perfect" cameras, each tool has attributes and shortfalls.  The whingers will always whing. Photographers who master their camera and lenses in hand can and will create fine photographs.  The SL2 and its capabilites does this in spades.  r/ Mark  

[robb]

Sl2 and sl2-s are just fantastic cameras for me with the Uber fantastic apo lenses.  I’m going to keep rockin with these.  Would love some of the added features and fixes and faster AF but yeah I could be set for a very long time as is.  

Robb

[hansvons]

8 hours ago, Stuart Richardson said:

8 hours ago, whowell said:

 

Interesting...I have not missed any of those things...not even the battery life (of course, more is always better in this case...).

Neither do I, apart from the articulated screen. 
 

But one can argue that a 2024 mirror-less DSLR should have a brilliant machine-learnt AF-C, a global shutter, high sensitivity, a ludicrous IBIS, and a super-bright articulated screen. Add to that Leica qualities and you will have a winner that I don’t need but which surely will make the rattled and bored, GAS-affected photographers swap their “old” system for the SL system. (System swapping moves this industry, we should be grateful for the ubiquitous GAS.)

I’m sure the SL3 series will be exactly this. 

[Simone_DF]

12 hours ago, trickness said:

There’s absolutely nothing else this camera needs to take great pictures. 

I agree with you, but the SL2 has to compete in a crowded and extremely aggressive market. If Leica won't sell enough SLs, it will go the way of the CL. To sell more SL bodies, it has to be competitive vs Sony/Canon/Nikon and even the internal Panasonic competition. 

[Janos Grapow]

Hopefully the electronic level gauge will be more precise and sensitive!

[trickness]

5 hours ago, Simone_DF said:

I agree with you, but the SL2 has to compete in a crowded and extremely aggressive market. If Leica won't sell enough SLs, it will go the way of the CL. To sell more SL bodies, it has to be competitive vs Sony/Canon/Nikon and even the internal Panasonic competition. 

I think this is the challenge for Leica, and perhaps the misunderstanding that we sometimes have about the brand. They are not Sony/Canon/Nikon, they aren’t going to introduce cameras, every two or even three years. They are a small company. It’s pretty ambitious for them to put out something like the SL, which is going to be compared with all those other cameras, unlike the M system (because it’s unique). 
 

I don’t think they’re ever going to be able to go toe to toe with these other companies, in terms of bringing things out on a timetable that is truly competitive. I for one am realistic in my expectations…very rarely will these cameras ever be contemporary for more than perhaps a year or two. When I buy an SL, I go into it knowing that I’m going to be using it for 3-4 years, and I’m not going to be looking at all the bells and whistles that are being introduced by other brands during that time period. I’m going to extract the maximum that the camera I own is capable of delivering, and what I as a photographer am capable of delivering, and not look what new features other brands have with envy, and some kind of endless cycle of camera system inferiority complex. 
 

Expectations that Leica is going to ever keep pace with these other brands in terms of introducing new features and new cameras is a sure path to disappointment. It is not at all a reasonable expectation if you spend really anytime thinking about it or looking at how they introduce cameras.

Quite honestly, I’m extremely happy that they’re not like Sony, who seem to come out with a new body every single year. If I had to use my SL2 as my only camera for the next 20 years, I can’t really envision a time when I would ever feel like some new camera hugely surpassed what I can accomplish with this body and this system.

All my babbling here can be boiled down to kind of one thought: progress is a wonderful thing, but it is no substitute for knowing how to take a decent photograph in the first place. And there is absolutely nothing missing from the SL platform that will prevent anybody from doing that, despite endless posts on here about how outdated the camera is and how much better all these other brands are.

 

[BernardC]

23 minutes ago, trickness said:

I don’t think they’re ever going to be able to go toe to toe with these other companies, in terms of bringing things out on a timetable that is truly competitive.

I'm not as pessimistic as you are. Leica and Panasonic are just as capable as the other brands. After all, it took Sony 2 years to respond to the original SL, and even then their response was half-baked (and superseded 18 months later). Up until then nobody realized that a professional-grade mirrorless camera, with real video (not just 8-bit), was possible.

If we remember back to 2015, the main response to the SL was "it's so expensive!", and "who needs this." That continued until every other brand released competitors at similar price points. Now the SL looks visionary.

In 2023, the S5ii is the most advanced camera in its class. I have no doubt that the SL3 will be as well. I'm also sure that the SL3 will eventually seem like "yesterday's camera," but that probably won't happen for a very long time, and it won't keep us from using it for serious work.

[trickness]

8 minutes ago, BernardC said:

I'm not as pessimistic as you are. Leica and Panasonic are just as capable as the other brands. After all, it took Sony 2 years to respond to the original SL, and even then their response was half-baked (and superseded 18 months later). Up until then nobody realized that a professional-grade mirrorless camera, with real video (not just 8-bit), was possible.

If we remember back to 2015, the main response to the SL was "it's so expensive!", and "who needs this." That continued until every other brand released competitors at similar price points. Now the SL looks visionary.

In 2023, the S5ii is the most advanced camera in its class. I have no doubt that the SL3 will be as well. I'm also sure that the SL3 will eventually seem like "yesterday's camera," but that probably won't happen for a very long time, and it won't keep us from using it for serious work.

I expect the SL3 to be evolutionary, not revolutionary. Which is really what Leica does. Yeah the EVF was amazing when the SL came out and miles ahead of everyone else. But look at the Q cameras - each iteration is a logical step forward from the previous version (and none of these steps invalidate the previous generation as a serious capable photographic tool). And look at the Q3 and M11 image threads - the pictures look the same as previous gen cameras.

"Most advanced camera" in the real world, in the end result - the pictures - doesn't mean a lot. It's mostly marketing speak meant to separate people from their money. 

 

[jto555]

Here's a thought. What if the SL3 was a combination of the SL AND an S! Shoot Medium Format if the lens has the coverage and FF 35mm if the lens doesn't. Then all Leica would need to produce would be an adaptor for (current) CS lenses on the L mount with new lenses using the L mount. Flash sync without HSS up to 1/2000 sec. MF quality. All in a current production FF body. 

 

I would do a lot of damage to my credit card for that.

 

 

[BernardC]

1 minute ago, jto555 said:

What if the SL3 was a combination of the SL AND an S! Shoot Medium Format if the lens has the coverage and FF 35mm if the lens doesn't.

I think this would be a camera above the SL3. I agree that it would be great, especially if it lets us shoot verticals and squares on the larger sensor with L-mount lenses.

[Stuart Richardson]

59 minutes ago, jto555 said:

Here's a thought. What if the SL3 was a combination of the SL AND an S! Shoot Medium Format if the lens has the coverage and FF 35mm if the lens doesn't. Then all Leica would need to produce would be an adaptor for (current) CS lenses on the L mount with new lenses using the L mount. Flash sync without HSS up to 1/2000 sec. MF quality. All in a current production FF body. 

 

I would do a lot of damage to my credit card for that.

 

 

This is what I have been hoping for for a long time, as a former S user. That said, the GFXII, which was announced today, looks a bit like that, and to my mind is the kind of camera I would like Leica to offer in the S/SL mount. It seems they have even taken styling cues from the SL2, though it still does not have that level of design. In any case, I am still very happy with my SL2 and am not interested in going to Fuji, but hopefully Leica's next mirrorless cameras will be able to offer a good reason to upgrade. The GFX100II seems to have a 9+MP EVF and 8 stop stabilization, along with excellent seeming video specs and much faster AF. The price is just a touch more than the SL2, though all the lenses are a lot cheaper.

In any case, Leica seems to be on a 4 to 5 year schedule for their professional SLR/mirrorless cameras. Hopefully we'll see what they came up with soon enough. For my part, I will likely stick with the SL2 for a few more years regardless, as I love the camera and I don't have 7-10,000 dollars burning a hole in my pocket waiting to be spent on a few quality life improvements and a few extra megapixels, which I suspect may be what we get.

Edited September 12, 2023 by Stuart Richardson

[frankchn]

6 hours ago, jto555 said:

Here's a thought. What if the SL3 was a combination of the SL AND an S! Shoot Medium Format if the lens has the coverage and FF 35mm if the lens doesn't. Then all Leica would need to produce would be an adaptor for (current) CS lenses on the L mount with new lenses using the L mount. Flash sync without HSS up to 1/2000 sec. MF quality. All in a current production FF body. 

I would do a lot of damage to my credit card for that.

The lens mount diameter of the L-mount is not big enough for the the S format. The L-mount diameter is 51.6mm, but the diagonal of the S sensor is 54mm. For medium format, I expect them to introduce a mirrorless S4 likely using the GFX100/X2D sensor at some point, and a S Adapter New-Mirrorless-MF-Mount adapter then.

I think deep down we all know that the SL3 is most likely going to be basically the same design as the SL2, but will utilize the Q3's 60 megapixel sensor with PDAF (AF tech co-developed with Panasonic) and the Maestro IV processor, with (hopefully) a better EVF and maybe some internal storage (like you see on the M11s).

[Paul2660]

I feel it's safe to assume the SL3 when announced with cost around 7.5K US.  Possibly 8K.  

I have the Sigma FP-L and thus have used the 60MP Sony sensor, which does allow for great dynamic range recovery over the SL2, but I am not a big fan of the Sigma FP-L layout.    Leica has IMO a great design in the SL cameras and I have come to really prefer both the layout of the camera controls and menus.  I do find it strange that Leica continues to not understand the need to allow for a self timer not to be a mode but instead a feature all exposure modes  can use.  They have only found it necessary to add the self timer to the multi-shot exposure mode, and for exposure bracketing I would really like to have the timer.  Hopefully Leica will continue to develop Multi-shot with the larger sensor, giving possibly a 4 shot mode similar to what Fuji has done along with the large output mode. 

Fuji was boxed in on the pricing for the GFX100II as they could not sell it for the same price of the GFX100s.   Seems like a nice camera with a similar look to the SL2 and somewhat like the X2D cameras.  Should do well for them. 

 

Paul 

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Hallo,

Look here: Leica L-Mount

[rcusick]

I have a theory that Leica is going to dramatically reduce the size of the sl3 and lenses. My hunch is that they are listening to market feedback about the size and weight of the sl system.  They also have to compete with Fuji and hasselblad that are battling in different segments on size and weight.  I think the reason we haven’t seen an sl21 apo is that they will change the form factor of the entire range. 
 

just and hunch….  Maybe we’ll eventually see an s4 with the original sl form factor?