zapp Posted October 12, 2007 Share #21 Posted October 12, 2007 Advertisement (gone after registration) My Leica distributor in Norway says Noctilux is beeing made in a new versionwithin a year... anyone else heard about this?!? If the old lens is made in a new version, they may replace some glass that became unavailable. In that case you will not need to sell 6000 to break even. The M system without the Noctilux is lacking something - one of these: Hey look what kind a lens I can put in front of my camera, but never will... A completely new Noctilux is appealing, but other lenses need replacement more urgently. The Summilux 50 ASPH is great, the M8 gives you all the ISO you want - no need to blow money on a completely new Noctilux. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted October 12, 2007 Posted October 12, 2007 Hi zapp, Take a look here NEW Nocti within a year?. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
marknorton Posted October 12, 2007 Share #22 Posted October 12, 2007 With the new commercial focus in Solms, it's tough to know whether there's an appetite for such a development. Five out of the last six new lenses have focussed on value, not on pushing the performance envelope and show (probably for the Summarits too), that by limiting the speed, great performance is available for a favourable price. Truth is, look across all camera vendors and f2.8 is the favoured maximum aperture. There are few lenses at f2 and fewer still at f1.4. I certainly hope that we'll have future lens introductions which surprise and delight with their technical and optical prowess, I'm quite sure the Summarits will be fine, but won't it be a bit like drinking Chardonnay all the time? Worthy but just a little bit dull. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
stunsworth Posted October 12, 2007 Share #23 Posted October 12, 2007 Mark, I think the Summarits are intended to fill what was perceived as a gap in the market - low cost (for Leica anyway) lenses, and to try and sell lenses to people who were buying used. I'd be interested to know just how many lenses Voigtlander and Zeiss have sold. In the hothouse of a forum such as this it's tempting to think that they sell by the bucketful, but I wonder what the real figures are? As for the f2.8 issue, I think that's down to manufacturers wanting to keep their prices down - the market for a Canon 35mm f1.4 is much smaller than the equivalent f2.8 lens, this is price driven. If the faster lens was the same price then they'd sell more of those. And let's not forget that Canon's cheapest lens - from memory - is a 50mm f1.8, that may feel as if it will fall apart in the hand but isn't a bad lens - in fact it's almost as good as a 50mm Summicron. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
marknorton Posted October 12, 2007 Share #24 Posted October 12, 2007 Steve, I agree with you, and especially that the Summarits are intended to provide more effective competition to the Zeiss and CV offerings. I'm quite sure that Leica will sell lots of them. I have a requirement for fast wide-angles and sadly, it doesn't look like that is going to be met any time soon. With a D3 planned (and I don't mean Digilux 3), I've gone back to my Nikon 14/2.8 and 28/1.4 lenses and have just ordered an adapter to mount them on the M8 to see how they work. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
rosuna Posted October 12, 2007 Share #25 Posted October 12, 2007 A completely new Noctilux is appealing, but other lenses need replacement more urgently. The Summilux 50 ASPH is great, the M8 gives you all the ISO you want - no need to blow money on a completely new Noctilux. I think all M lenses are up to date now. The only "old" lens is the Summicron 50mm and the Noctilux. I don't know if Leica will update the Summiron or will discontinue it. The Noctilux cannot be discontinued, in my opinion. It is a symbol for the M line, and they cannot sell them at 4,700€ (the price in Spain, taxes included, more than $5,000). The f/1.0 aperture isn't only about gathering light, it is interesting for compositional purposes too. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eoin Posted October 12, 2007 Share #26 Posted October 12, 2007 With the introduction of the M8 we have seen many price increases not only in new equipment but also the value of 2nd hand lenses. Were it not for the 30% offer I would not be paying €3000 - €4000 for 2nd hand and near €5000 for a new one. Yes the Noctilux has a maximum aperture of f:/1 and sometimes a unique look at that aperture but the reality for me is if I was in a position to make a choice between a good 2nd hand 50 Summilux asph for €2000 or a 2nd hand Noctilux in the €3 - €4000 range I'd be choosing the 50 Summilux Asph. That being said I'm starting to finally enjoy using the Nocti and apart from the general contrast see little difference between f:/1.0 and f:/1.4. An Asph or better corrected Noctilux will bring it more into the realm of the 50 Summilux Asph which is almost technically perfect, that coupled with improvements in sensor performance at higher ISO's really negates the need for another Noctilux, so why bother IMO. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest darkstar2004 Posted October 12, 2007 Share #27 Posted October 12, 2007 Advertisement (gone after registration) look at the soaring price of the noct now, for that matter, look at the price of all those "noct" from other brand names now command. let us hope we will see a new asph noct, after all, leica updates its lens line more quickly than its body line. Today, B&H lists the 50/1.4 ASPH at $2995US and the 50/1.0 NOCT at $5495US. If the new & improved Noctilux is an ASPH lens, I would expect a price increase of maybe $1000-2000US over the current Noctilux. That would put the price at $6495-7495US, before factoring in any price increase based on the anemic U.S. dollar's exchange rate. The current price of a new Noctilux is god-awful; at $6500-7500US, I can't imagine that Leica would sell many. I would hope a new Noctilux would be not just tailored for the M8, but would be fully applicable to all M cameras across the board. Although I would like to see a 50 ASPH Noctilux and a 35 ASPH Noctilux offered, I can't see myself paying such ionospheric prices for one. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
sdai Posted October 12, 2007 Share #28 Posted October 12, 2007 The current price of a new Noctilux is god-awful; at $6500-7500US, I can't imagine that Leica would sell many. I guess time will tell. Leica only needs to take care of the forum members here ... everybody must buy one before he/she can submit his/her next post. LOL Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest darkstar2004 Posted October 12, 2007 Share #29 Posted October 12, 2007 Leica only needs to take care of the forum members here ... everybody must buy one before he/she can submit his/her next post. LOL So when can we forum members expect our "50% off the price of a new Noctilux" cupons to arrive from Leica?? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guy_mancuso Posted October 12, 2007 Share #30 Posted October 12, 2007 How long do you want to hold your breath.LOL Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guy_mancuso Posted October 12, 2007 Share #31 Posted October 12, 2007 Leica only needs to take care of the forum members here ... everybody must buy one before he/she can submit his/her next post. LOL I agree we come first. LOL Not sure we will see one but the thought is nice to dream about. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
budrichard Posted October 12, 2007 Share #32 Posted October 12, 2007 The new Summarit line is an example of where Leica is heading, a new expensive Noct does not make sense. The M8 doesn't need this lens. Leica is trying to attract high end users rather than technophiles. With the $5K USD price of the M8, Leica needs less costly lenses for the high end users to make sales. I suspect that almost all M8 sales were to current Leica M owners. When that dies out, they have to sell to someone. -Dick Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
carstenw Posted October 12, 2007 Share #33 Posted October 12, 2007 The 75mm-M Lux is very controlled and predictable. The 80mm-R Lux and 75mm-M Lux are siblings, but they seem to be a bit different in fingerprint. Yes, the Noctilux on the M8 looks more like the 80 Lux on a 5D than the 75 Lux does. This is my great regret with the 75 Lux. It is too sharp. I loved the 80 Lux but I didn't love the 5D. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iron Flatline Posted October 12, 2007 Share #34 Posted October 12, 2007 A new Noctilux would be nice... for the R mount. Now THAT would do wonders for their marketing efforts if/when the new R comes to market. A real differntiator to some of the high-end competitors. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
carstenw Posted October 12, 2007 Share #35 Posted October 12, 2007 If the new & improved Noctilux is an ASPH lens, I would expect a price increase of maybe $1000-2000US over the current Noctilux. That would put the price at $6495-7495US, before factoring in any price increase based on the anemic U.S. dollar's exchange rate. If Leica does re-design the Noctilux, you can bet that cost would be a strong factor, and that they would try to *lower* the price of it, ASPH or not. By removing the special Noctilux glass (an ior of 1.95, IIRC), they could drop a couple of thousand right there. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
rosuna Posted October 12, 2007 Share #36 Posted October 12, 2007 If Leica does re-design the Noctilux, you can bet that cost would be a strong factor, and that they would try to *lower* the price of it, ASPH or not. By removing the special Noctilux glass (an ior of 1.95, IIRC), they could drop a couple of thousand right there. Right. The actual price of the Noctilux isn't a good point of reference because it was incredibly increased a few months ago. Now is 4795€ (taxes included), and 3250€ in 2006. Ok, take this "normal" price as a reference. Leica could keep the price (3200€ or so) and improve the quality using modern glass and technologies. The 21mm Elmarit, 35mm Summilux and WATE currently cost more than 3000 euros, and the Summilux 75mm also was in that level. I think a new Noctilux ASPH at 3200 euros would be very interesting. Of course, the R&D investment would be recovered several years later, and Leica's priorities aren't prestige investments at this moment. The R line and the Summarit M line is the priority now... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pelikan1931 Posted October 13, 2007 Share #37 Posted October 13, 2007 is there a cornerfix equivalent in the noctilux world? adding a bit of blur and vignetting to the corners to your 50 summilux and transform it to a noctilux. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
boilerdoc Posted October 13, 2007 Share #38 Posted October 13, 2007 I am at the LHSA meetings here in Rochester. We enjoyed a special presentation at the Geo Eastman House yesterday by 2 ELCAN big wigs. They spent their time telling us about all the other things they do optically speaking (esp. defense contracts) but not a word about any future Noctilux changes. i doubt they would have come all this way if they were planning to trash their primo camera lens. Steve Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
luigi bertolotti Posted October 13, 2007 Share #39 Posted October 13, 2007 I am at the LHSA meetings here in Rochester. We enjoyed a special presentation at the Geo Eastman House yesterday by 2 ELCAN big wigs. They spent their time telling us about all the other things they do optically speaking (esp. defense contracts) but not a word about any future Noctilux changes. i doubt they would have come all this way if they were planning to trash their primo camera lens.Steve ...maybe they even didn't know their factory still manufactures, sometime, those strange little items.. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
leitz_not_leica Posted October 13, 2007 Share #40 Posted October 13, 2007 "is there a cornerfix equivalent in the noctilux world? adding a bit of blur and vignetting to the corners to your 50 summilux and transform it to a noctilux." My thoughts exactly...don't forget focus shift when stopped down. I have a pre-lux and a Nikon LTM 1.4, it's as small as my former 'cron. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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