Guest guy_mancuso Posted October 2, 2007 Share #21 Posted October 2, 2007 Advertisement (gone after registration) Sparkie it really is a mental debate and it sucks because you question yourself. But let's look at it as a spacing issue for a second because this a very normal decision process is to cover a range here are some options that normally make sense. Not sure it will help but makes you think 12,18,24,35 15,21,28,50 15,24,35 12,21,28 than add the WATE 12,WATE,28,50 12,WATE,24,35 WATE,24,35 Wate,28,50 This maybe the normal spacing issue than if you throw in the speed factor it changes. you have to decide if speed counts for one and than your spacing setup. see i did all this and said screw it and just got them all, but not everyone wants to do that either. No one said this was easy:D Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted October 2, 2007 Posted October 2, 2007 Hi Guest guy_mancuso, Take a look here 21/2.8 vs 24/2.8 or?. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
stunsworth Posted October 2, 2007 Share #22 Posted October 2, 2007 There seem to be two sets to go for IMHO 21/28/50 or 24/35/50 (or 75). The advantage of the first is that it revolves around the existing 28mm. The advantage of the second is that there's no need for external viewfinders. Given that Sparkie has said that he wants the 24, the decision to keep or sell the 28 depends on his financies. If the money's there, then keep the 28, if it's not then sell it to finance one of the others. 24/28 in the same bag is too close IMHO, but on the other hand a 28 is my favourite single focal length. All IMHO, and although it's great fun spending other people's money in the end it's Sparkies decision. And for all my advice I have a 28mm Voigtlander Ultron that isn't going to be sold, because a. it's a cracking lens, and b. the poor quality of the paint work means that I'd get very little for it now that quite a bit of the brass is showing. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
sparkie Posted October 2, 2007 Author Share #23 Posted October 2, 2007 I have replaced my 24 mm hood with a round metal one , you can see more and less of a monster out front. I also did the same with a 21mm when I had one and my 28 cron also sports a metal hood. The 35mm cron i left alone with it's hood though since it is small. Worth trying there on e-bay and sellers name is heavystar. Good tip. NOW the question is.. is there a rubber collapsible one on the market? like for the 40/2.0C That would make a nice portable unit Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
robertwright Posted October 2, 2007 Share #24 Posted October 2, 2007 I think even if you buy the 24 you can keep the 28 cron for speed. so its a daytime/nightime swap. using this logic I hope you have the 35 lux since it would be the all round 35 in this lineup. No need for the cron. the 15 is a no brainer no matter what. I have not used the wate but tried one out and did not find that much use for the 18 setting. The jump from 15 to 24 is a natural one in my opinion. that is until someone makes an 18mm 2.8... I think the WATE is kind of anti-leica (here we go... it is slow speed, slow to use, cumbersome, etc. Not exactly what you carry a leica around for. But that is purely subjective. The 24 will probably be your bodycap lens except at night when the 28 cron comes out, which makes a kind of sense, a night it helps to work a little tighter since the darkness hides so much of the wide view. Anyway, it will be my solution when I sell the 21 and 28 elmarits. happy hunting. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
sparkie Posted October 2, 2007 Author Share #25 Posted October 2, 2007 Exactly! There's a guy with a name exactly like mine who's been asking Leica where the Fast Wide Prime is! My checkbook is ready. 15mm f1.4 asph, please! Heh, now that would be one chuck of glass I'd be very happy with a 19/1.4, 21/1.4 or 24/1.4 :D Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
sparkie Posted October 2, 2007 Author Share #26 Posted October 2, 2007 If you buy the 24, assuming you can even find one since they are unobtanium right now, you can try it and sell it probably in a nano-second if you don't like it. And it's very unlikely you won't like it However, since you already have the 28, the 21 is a better focal spacing... Tough call. And BTW, whatever you do, DON'T SELL THE 28! I'd pass on the 24 and go to the 21 before I sold my 28... If you want to be restricted to f4, then you nailed it --- buy a Mamiya M7 and a few lenses or even a Bronica 645 and all the lenses, both of which will cost you less than what you sell the WATE for Yeh, the 24/2.8 is not available on the shelves. You are right Jack, the 21 is the better spaced lens. But if the 24 is THAT Good, then I'd rather get it instead. Heart talking over the head. Btw I don't have the 28 'cron, just the lowly 28/2.8 ASPH. I think you were refering to the 28 'cron. The thing thats bugging me is that the 21 & 24 are both are only f2.8. And I bet that I splash out and 6 months later Leica announces a 21/2.0!! I swore a couple of years back that I would not buy any brand New glass period, just 2nd hand. But since then I have bought the 50/1.4 ASPH LHSA and 28/2.8 ASPH. *ugh* Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
sparkie Posted October 2, 2007 Author Share #27 Posted October 2, 2007 Advertisement (gone after registration) I agree i would sell my gold teeth before i sold the 28 cron. Just to nice a lens sorry to dissapoint but i only have a humble 28/2.8 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
sparkie Posted October 2, 2007 Author Share #28 Posted October 2, 2007 I think even if you buy the 24 you can keep the 28 cron for speed. so its a daytime/nightime swap. I only got the 28 elmarit, My hi-speed lenses are the 35/1.4 Aspherical and 50/1.4 ASPH using this logic I hope you have the 35 lux since it would be the all round 35 in this lineup. No need for the cron. Yes, before the M8, my 35/1.4 was the ultimate lens I think the WATE is kind of anti-leica (here we go... it is slow speed, slow to use, cumbersome, etc. Not exactly what you carry a leica around for. But that is purely subjective. The 24 will probably be your bodycap lens except at night when the 28 cron comes out, which makes a kind of sense, a night it helps to work a little tighter since the darkness hides so much of the wide view. Anyway, it will be my solution when I sell the 21 and 28 elmarits. happy hunting. I agree, the WATE just seems to rub against what I'm used to. The 24/2.4 sounds great, but its still 2 stops slower than my 'lux! I could sell my 28/2.8 and buy a 28/2.0, but I just love the compactness and light weight of the elmarit. Maybe I just wait till leica brings out the 21/1.4 or 24/1.4! :D Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
xjr Posted October 2, 2007 Share #29 Posted October 2, 2007 Also, what is the chance Leica will bring out a 24/2.0 or even a 21/2.0 ?? None if they have any sense ! If you can find a 24mm buy it...if. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
innerimager Posted October 2, 2007 Share #30 Posted October 2, 2007 24 will probably be your bodycap lens except at night when the 28 cron comes out, which makes a kind of sense, a night it helps to work a little tighter since the darkness hides so much of the wide view. Anyway, it will be my solution when I sell the 21 and 28 elmarits. happy hunting. If I had the 28 cron I might go this way, but having the 24/2.8, 28/2.8 asph. and 35/1.4 asph I'll probably use the 24 daytime, and the 35 for night, and sell the 28/2.8, once I get the 24 back from NJ with 6 bit coding.....Peter Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
lct Posted October 2, 2007 Share #31 Posted October 2, 2007 Miss a 24/2 for the M8 unless Leica plan to launch a full frame M seriously. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack_Flesher Posted October 2, 2007 Share #32 Posted October 2, 2007 I only got the 28 elmarit, My hi-speed lenses are the 35/1.4 Aspherical and 50/1.4 ASPH Okay, different story and the answer is a lot easier, assuming you don't just love the 28 focal Sell the 28 Elmarit (they are going like hotcakes too) and get the 24 Asph. You'll have the ideal fast 24/35/50 lens set and probably do everything you ever need to. OTOH, if you just *love* that 28 focal, and are lackluster over the 35, then IMO you should get a 21 asph AND the 28 Cron, and then sell the 28 Elmarit and possibly 35 Lux if you need the bucks. (FWIW, I hardly use the 35 focal length on my M8 and don't even bother carrying it most times, preferring the 28 and 50 --- but that's me and YMMV...) And I would not hold my breath for a fast 21 from Leica anytime soon. I think they are going to slower, less expensive lenses because high ISO performance is improving by leaps and bounds. (Did you see the new Nikon DSLR has an optional ISO 25,000 setting?) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
wparsonsgisnet Posted October 2, 2007 Share #33 Posted October 2, 2007 Heh, now that would be one chuck of glass I'd be very happy with a 19/1.4, 21/1.4 or 24/1.4 :D Sparkie -- this is Leica's speciality. Imagine someone making an f1.0 lens today. Why it would cost thousands of dollars! Fast, Wide, Prime. C'mon Leica! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
KJB Posted October 2, 2007 Share #34 Posted October 2, 2007 Yeh, the 24/2.8 is not available on the shelves. You are right Jack, the 21 is the better spaced lens. But if the 24 is THAT Good, then I'd rather get it instead. Heart talking over the head. Btw I don't have the 28 'cron, just the lowly 28/2.8 ASPH. I think you were refering to the 28 'cron. The thing thats bugging me is that the 21 & 24 are both are only f2.8. And I bet that I splash out and 6 months later Leica announces a 21/2.0!! I swore a couple of years back that I would not buy any brand New glass period, just 2nd hand. But since then I have bought the 50/1.4 ASPH LHSA and 28/2.8 ASPH. *ugh* If you decide to go with the 21asph and sell the 35 lux asph then shoot me a PM if you're interested in a swap Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
sparkie Posted October 2, 2007 Author Share #35 Posted October 2, 2007 Sparkie -- this is Leica's speciality. Imagine someone making an f1.0 lens today. Why it would cost thousands of dollars! Fast, Wide, Prime. C'mon Leica! Yeh Leica is very capable of producing f1.0 lenses. have you seen the size of a 90/1.0 ?!? It is just monstrous! I think a summilux 24 or 28 is definitely possible and sizes still smaller compared to canon lens sizes. As for a 21 ro 15 'lux, erm I think it might be just too big and expensive. Look at the size of the 15/2.8 Distagon and its only f2.8! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guy_mancuso Posted October 2, 2007 Share #36 Posted October 2, 2007 F2 maybe F1.4 never going to happen but i keep pushing them, maybe someday but i would not wait for one. There will always be a market for a used 24mm 2.8 and one this good to boot. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
wparsonsgisnet Posted October 2, 2007 Share #37 Posted October 2, 2007 If I were to suggest a lens to Leica (hmm...), it would be a 15mm *prime* or maybe something slightly wider. It should be fast. F 4 is totally out of the question. 2.8 or faster? C'mon Leica. The money's waiting.... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
carstenw Posted October 2, 2007 Share #38 Posted October 2, 2007 What is going to happen much faster than a 24/2.0 is an M9 with a FF sensor. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
sparkie Posted October 2, 2007 Author Share #39 Posted October 2, 2007 Jack, on a film M the 35 is my most used lens and a 28 is a semi wide and a very dynamic reportage FL. On the M8 I'm not sure which is equiv to the '28' look, the 24 or 21. the maths says its the 21, but I'm not sure in reality. My main problem with the 24 is its only f2.8 Yes, the Nikon & canons have incredible hi iso performance. I dont have a 5D, just a 1DMK2. The 1DS3 outta be interesting when it gets in the hands of users and we can really see how good it is. At the moment I'm still just a fence sitter. Much as I love M gear, it can't do everything and thats usually where the DSLRs step in. KJB, if I decide to go for the 21, I'll probably buy one. As I just can't see myself letting go my 35/1.4. Its hard to come by this lens and one of my most essential lenses in my bag. But if I ever get a whim to swap, I'll let u know Guy, push for the 'lux. We'll most definitely get a 'cron. Anything faster will be a bonus. Right on Bill. f2.8 is the cut-off. f2.0 is acceptable. f1.4 ideal/perfect. Carsten, and when the FF M9 is announced the 24/2.0 will be marketed as the new barbie lens Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
robertwright Posted October 2, 2007 Share #40 Posted October 2, 2007 Okay, different story and the answer is a lot easier, assuming you don't just love the 28 focal Sell the 28 Elmarit (they are going like hotcakes too) and get the 24 Asph. You'll have the ideal fast 24/35/50 lens set and probably do everything you ever need to. OTOH, if you just *love* that 28 focal, and are lackluster over the 35, then IMO you should get a 21 asph AND the 28 Cron, and then sell the 28 Elmarit and possibly 35 Lux if you need the bucks. (FWIW, I hardly use the 35 focal length on my M8 and don't even bother carrying it most times, preferring the 28 and 50 --- but that's me and YMMV...) And I would not hold my breath for a fast 21 from Leica anytime soon. I think they are going to slower, less expensive lenses because high ISO performance is improving by leaps and bounds. (Did you see the new Nikon DSLR has an optional ISO 25,000 setting?) I agree here, the 28 elmarit will languish once you get the 24, thats my bet. You want to replicate the 28 full frame look which is why you are considering the 21-my experience has been the 21 sits in the bag all the time unless I need it for a room interior and need that specific length. Also my 35 cron is nearly my favourite lens, it was on the M6 almost, edged out by the 28. But the crop factor and the frameline debacle have bent all my focal lengths and 15, 25, 35 is winning right now. anyway its easy, selling the 28 elmarit asph will be a cinch in this market, and indeed with the price increases and before the summarits come out, it is a sellers market. But I would not hold my breath for a 24 f2-I think more likely a 24 summarit in the bargain price range may be more likely?... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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