35mm Summilux, #12504, being used on an M10

[MikeMyers]

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I've got a 1960 35mm Summilux lens, made in Canada, #12504.  Here's a Ken Rockwell review:

https://www.kenrockwell.com/leica/35mm-f14.htm

I've still got my old film Leica's, and an M8.2, and a M10.  I've used this lens with all of them.

Having watched many of the Red Dot Forum discussions, I understand that this lens was designed to be used with film, and that the newer digital Leica cameras are capable of resolution beyond what this lens is capable of.  On the positive side, it's small, and light, and I've always been happy with it.  (Maybe I didn't know what I was missing??). Maybe I never understood this as clearly as when I watched the discussion on "vintage lenses".

While I could spend many thousands of dollars on a newer model, I'm wondering how this lens would work on my M10.  I was satisfied with it before, and I suspect I'll be just as satisfied now, despite knowing that the camera is capable of more than what this lens can do.

Have any of you actually tried this, and if so, what were your thoughts?

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[a.noctilux]

Hello Mike,

 

some error on the part number, #12504 is only hood used on the Summilux 35mm

https://www.l-camera-forum.com/leica-wiki.en/index.php/12504

Good lens with characters, nothing can replace this too nice lens, a bit flarey wide open some would complain for 1m mfd, no filter thread, etc.

I use happily one or more since decades

 

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Leica Order No. - 11870-black - 11860-titan - 11871-M3 (w/ specs)

 

 

More or less, but 70 pages to read

 

Edited September 18, 2022 by a.noctilux

[rtai]

It’ll work just fine on an M10. Stopped down to f/4 and the difference is minimal.
You have one from from 1960 production year? It may be a collector’s item. 

[darylgo]

Hi Mike,

The 35 Pre Asph is lens that gives a beautiful smooth rendering on digital.  It will not compete with the likes of the 35 FLE or 35 Apo for resolution.  With higher megapixel cameras and the latest Leica lenses the resolution and contrast is very high, while very desirable and the holy grail many years ago for small format cameras it is also nice to couple the older lenses with high resolution sensors to give a softer rendering.   Portraits, landscapes, street all are good uses for this lens and high contrast is tamed well.  The lens continues to command higher prices each year for both it's rendering and collectability, Leica would be wise to re-release it.  Shot it wide open on your M10, it's quite beautiful.  If you enjoy these types of images the almost 100 year old 3.5cm Elmar goes further into the soft rendering/high megapixel look.  

[MikeMyers]

Sounds very positive.  The S/N is 2221959.  According to the box, the lens is an "11870 Z".  I used to know how to look up the year of manufacture based on the serial number.  Ken Rockwell has that stored away on his website.

Yes, the #12504 is the lens hood.

Thanks to Ken Rockwell, I am using a 58mm Nikon lens cap to clip into the lens hood at the far end - very convenient.  

Maybe I will get to try it out tomorrow, and post the result here.   ......I love the lens because it is so small and light, and I always did enjoy the images.

Thanks for all the feedback!!!

 

Added later:   https://www.kenrockwell.com/leica/lens-serial-numbers.htm

Apparently the lens was made in 1966.

Edited September 18, 2022 by MikeMyers
more info added

[Jeff S]

2 hours ago, MikeMyers said:

While I could spend many thousands of dollars on a newer model, I'm wondering how this lens would work on my M10.  I was satisfied with it before, and I suspect I'll be just as satisfied now, despite knowing that the camera is capable of more than what this lens can do.

 

The Summilux is a capable lens, so no reason to doubt its effectiveness on the M10.  Have you read the Appendix in the following article (posted in a bunch of other similar discussions)?

https://www.lensrentals.com/blog/2019/10/more-ultra-high-resolution-mtf-experiments/
 

Jeff

[J Peterman]

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That should be an infinity lock early version 2 serial number.  A very nice copy of a very nice lens indeed!

[MikeMyers]

11 hours ago, Jeff S said:

The Summilux is a capable lens, so no reason to doubt its effectiveness on the M10.  Have you read the Appendix in the following article (posted in a bunch of other similar discussions)?

https://www.lensrentals.com/blog/2019/10/more-ultra-high-resolution-mtf-experiments/

No, I never saw that before.  It seems to be an easy-to-understand way of thinking about this.  .......and if I keep using the lenses I already own, I wonder how buying an M11 might improve my images over an M10, and while the file sizes will increase, the image quality might remain just as it is - unless I wanted to start replacing all my lenses, which I can't afford to do, and as I'm now finding out, maybe it wouldn't make that much of a difference - other than filling up my hard disk much more quickly.

 

9 hours ago, J Peterman said:

That should be an infinity lock early version 2 serial number.  A very nice copy of a very nice lens indeed!

Yep, it does have the infinity lock, which I used to think was "annoying".  I bought it used, a lifetime ago, and it came with the original box.  At one point, the microscopic screws around the lens loosened, and I snugged them up using a jewelers screwdriver.  At some point, I'd like to get it checked out.  The only annoying thing about it, is filters.  Apparently I need to buy "series 7" filters, that get inserted into the lens shade.  For walking around, street photography type of use, it's wonderful.  

[rtai]

3 hours ago, MikeMyers said:

No, I never saw that before.  It seems to be an easy-to-understand way of thinking about this.  .......and if I keep using the lenses I already own, I wonder how buying an M11 might improve my images over an M10, and while the file sizes will increase, the image quality might remain just as it is - unless I wanted to start replacing all my lenses, which I can't afford to do, and as I'm now finding out, maybe it wouldn't make that much of a difference - other than filling up my hard disk much more quickly.

 

Yep, it does have the infinity lock, which I used to think was "annoying".  I bought it used, a lifetime ago, and it came with the original box.  At one point, the microscopic screws around the lens loosened, and I snugged them up using a jewelers screwdriver.  At some point, I'd like to get it checked out.  The only annoying thing about it, is filters.  Apparently I need to buy "series 7" filters, that get inserted into the lens shade.  For walking around, street photography type of use, it's wonderful.  

You have a treasure and didn’t know it! I want one to use but they are quite rare and dear. 

[MikeMyers]

1 minute ago, rtai said:

You have a treasure and didn’t know it! I want one to use but they are quite rare and dear. 

Apparently so, but it is just one of my old Leica lenses bought a lifetime ago.  Back then, none of them were anything special.  I preferred using my old M film cameras, and when I found lenses for sale, I often bought them even if I didn't know when or where I might use them.  I've got an equally old, or maybe older, 50mm Summicron, and I bought a 90mm Summicron which Don at his World Headquarters (DAG) fixed up for me - it had been damaged long before I bought it.  I've also got some Voigtlander lenses, mostly wide angle, back from when I wanted to be able to take   extreme wide angle shots.

Long ago, Leica was "just another camera".  People didn't worship them, they just used them.  It was rugged, reliable, easy to use, and seemed to last forever.  I was perfectly happy with the old film cameras, and I didn't buy the M8.2 until I realized how good it was for infrared photography - then I grabbed one, in an "open box sale" from Roberts Imaging.  I could do things with that camera that weren't possible with my other digital cameras.

 

Regarding lenses for Leica cameras, Camera Quest has a gazillion of Voigtlander lenses for sale, at all sorts of prices.  Costs are far less than for a comparable Leica lens.  One reason is that they're readily available, and aren't "rare antiques for collectors".  

 

Check this page - I've been buying from them for ages....    https://www.cameraquest.com

[rtai]

Just now, MikeMyers said:

Apparently so, but it is just one of my old Leica lenses bought a lifetime ago.  Back then, none of them were anything special.  I preferred using my old M film cameras, and when I found lenses for sale, I often bought them even if I didn't know when or where I might use them.  I've got an equally old, or maybe older, 50mm Summicron, and I bought a 90mm Summicron which Don at his World Headquarters (DAG) fixed up for me - it had been damaged long before I bought it.  I've also got some Voigtlander lenses, mostly wide angle, back from when I wanted to be able to take   extreme wide angle shots.

Long ago, Leica was "just another camera".  People didn't worship them, they just used them.  It was rugged, reliable, easy to use, and seemed to last forever.  I was perfectly happy with the old film cameras, and I didn't buy the M8.2 until I realized how good it was for infrared photography - then I grabbed one, in an "open box sale" from Roberts Imaging.  I could do things with that camera that weren't possible with my other digital cameras.

 

Regarding lenses for Leica cameras, Camera Quest has a gazillion of Voigtlander lenses for sale, at all sorts of prices.  Costs are far less than for a comparable Leica lens.  One reason is that they're readily available, and aren't "rare antiques for collectors".  

 

Check this page - I've been buying from them for ages....    https://www.cameraquest.com

I am a user not a collector so the market value of these items only interest me as far as whether I can comfortably afford them. Here you have a lens desirable to both collectors and users alike. I own later versions of the v2 and am quite content. Just my opinion but “sharp and contrasty” is so pedestrian any lens - Voigtlander, Konica KM, Zeiss ZM, APO Asph will do. No one can tell what you used from the photos. 

[J Peterman]

e49 filters from Leica or B&W work just fine.  You might have to flip it upside down between the halves for the 12504 hood to fully thread.  I use both, a clear Leica and 3 stop B&W ND MRC, and they work great.

The infinity lock & steel rim versions have better build quality with the brass focusing tab that doesn’t break like the plastic tab on later builds.  I don’t find the locking mechanism itself to be much of an issue.  Early V2 infinity lock models may also focus a bit closer which is an additional benefit.