Noise reduction software for film scans

[LocalHero1953]

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A decade or more ago I scanned all my old negatives and slides with a Minolta scanner. I found that scanning enhanced the grain in the digital file on screen, which irritated me. I rarely printed the results, so I did not discover whether the grain was noticeable on paper.

I have recently dipped my toe in the film water again with large format and 35mm. This time I am scanning with a SL2-S on a tripod above a LED panel, and using pixel-shift to maximise the resolution. The grain is still enhanced, a lot in some cases, and of course mainly in 35mm.

Neither the Lightroom noise reduction tools nor Topaz Denoise AI work well at suppressing grain while maintaining other detail.

How do others here deal with this? Are there tools out there that are specific to noise/grain control in film? I found a thread on FM Forums from a couple of years ago suggesting Neat Image, and possibly Nik Define. I have the latter but haven't tried it yet, nor have I tried anything in Photoshop. 

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[jaapv]

https://libribook.com/ebook/9009/real-world-image-sharpening-adobe-photoshop-2nd-edition-pdf

[LocalHero1953]

6 minutes ago, jaapv said:

https://libribook.com/ebook/9009/real-world-image-sharpening-adobe-photoshop-2nd-edition-pdf

Thank you. I have just discovered your post with the same recommendation in a 2013 thread!

[Simone_DF]

How are you converting your negatives? Maybe Negative Lab Pro could help? The software has a free trial version

https://www.negativelabpro.com/guide/basics/#sharpening

[LocalHero1953]

I have NLP, but hadn't thought to try it for this. Most of my 35mm scanning is of B&W, for which I find Lightroom easier than NLP.

[250swb]

Make sure there isn't a default 'Clarity' or 'Structure' software setting interfering with your SL2 scans. I don't use Lightroom but I guess ACR is similar for both and I've found any sharpening or Clarity adjustments within ACR play havoc with grain (for example clarity can start to make geometric patterns out of grain). I scan with a Nikon Z7 and it produces authentic looking grain right out of the camera (your SL2 should as well), but nothing high tech is switched on, so no image stabilisation (the Devil makes work for idle IBIS), just aperture priority and the lowest ISO setting. After going through ACR I then use ColorPerfect to invert the negative Tiff file whether B&W or colour, and again with nothing other than the default/auto setting. The image is then finished in Photoshop.

That aside I would check to see if you get less grain by switching pixel shift off, it isn't an option on the Z7 so I've never tried it myself but I wonder how it copes with grain? As for noise reduction software I've never come across any that can properly distinguish grain from attendant noise.

Edited December 7, 2021 by 250swb

[LocalHero1953]

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From all these comments I need to try harder with the tools I have. I had a User Profile on the SL2-S for large format copying with pixel shift, and simply used the same for 35mm, which is way OTT - I don't need 12000x8000 pixels for a 35mm negative, certainly not for routine scanning. I shall switch it off.

I do have Clarity set to zero in LR, but I shall experiment with different noise reduction and sharpening settings to see what difference they make. I would prefer to use LR to invert my negatives, as it makes it easier to batch process a roll and tweak the settings, but I shall do some trials with PS and the plugins I already have (Nik suite and Negative Lab Pro) to see if I can do a basic inversion and input noise reduction before doing any further editing in LR.

Edited December 7, 2021 by LocalHero1953

[jaapv]

One technique I found on the Internet (it is intended for pattern noise but might work on random noise as well) FWIIW

1. Scan the photo once as usual.
2. Rotate the photo 180% on the scanner and scan again.
3. In Photoshop, un-rotate the second scan.
4. Import it as a layer on top of the first scan.
5. Auto-Align Layers using Photoshop command.
6. Assign second scan 50% opacity to blend images together.

[LocalHero1953]

Without rescanning 35mm negatives, I have found that 6000 x 4000 scans show much less grain noise than 12000 x 8000: that's the same whether I look at scans made originally at 6000 x 4000 or files downsized from the higher scanned resolution. Lightroom's own noise reduction tools also seem to work better on the lower res files.

LR's tools seemed to work more obviously if I first invert the scanned negative DNG and then convert it to a positive TIFF. 

Negative Lab Pro doesn't seem to have any effect on noise. A trial version of Neat Image seems to work, but I found it a bit opaque - it might be more obvious if I read up on it more; ColorPerfect (another trial) is much the same, and I didn't find it that intuitive to my lazy mind. Photoshop's noise reduction and sharpening tools are very powerful and it is easy to go over the top.

I shall persist with Lightroom for the moment, but I'd welcome anyone else's tips.

Edited December 7, 2021 by LocalHero1953

[philipus]

Hi Paul

In case it helps, one way I have found quite effective is the sharpening and noise reduction tool in Adobe Camera Raw. I use it on my C41 scans after having inverted them (and done nothing else with them) in ColorPerfect. Except for the sliders I mention in the following I leave all sliders in their default positions.

Step one is to desaturate the noise using the Color slider. In my experience the colours disappear at a value of 15-20. Higher values change nothing to my eyes.

Step two is the Luminance slider. It will soften the image visibly. The value will depend on the particular image and the emulsion on which the photo was shot. I normally begin with 10-15 but on some images (and usually on 120 film) I can go a lot higher without ill effects.

Step three is to sharpen using the Amount slider. Because the Luminance slider "smudged away" (to use a technical term) a lot of the finer noise, the sharpening will mainly bring back image detail. For 35mm film (and again depending on the ISO of the emulsion, how well the film was exposed and if it's an expired film) 15-20 usually looks ok; more can look odd. For 120 film it's possible to go a lot higher, even up to half of the slider. There's a strong correlation between the Luminance and Amount sliders so it can pay off to play around with them and compare results.

Also, much of the noise can be "hidden" using clever editing with the Blacks and Shadows sliders (again in ACR which is what I use but similar sliders exist in other programs I believe).

It's of course possible to tweak the results by changing the other sliders too, but for most situations the above will give really good results. For instance, I've managed to make extremely grainy and noisy scans of expired Fuji Superia 1600 look ok. Below is an example (larger scan on Flickr).

Good luck

Philip

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[LocalHero1953]

4 minutes ago, philipus said:

Hi Paul

In case it helps, one way I have found quite effective is the sharpening and noise reduction tool in Adobe Camera Raw. I use it on my C41 scans after having inverted them (and done nothing else with them) in ColorPerfect. Except for the sliders I mention in the following I leave all sliders in their default positions.

Step one is to desaturate the noise using the Color slider. In my experience the colours disappear at a value of 15-20. Higher values change nothing to my eyes.

Step two is the Luminance slider. It will soften the image visibly. The value will depend on the particular image and the emulsion on which the photo was shot. I normally begin with 10-15 but on some images (and usually on 120 film) I can go a lot higher without ill effects.

Step three is to sharpen using the Amount slider. Because the Luminance slider "smudged away" (to use a technical term) a lot of the finer noise, the sharpening will mainly bring back image detail. For 35mm film (and again depending on the ISO of the emulsion, how well the film was exposed and if it's an expired film) 15-20 usually looks ok; more can look odd. For 120 film it's possible to go a lot higher, even up to half of the slider. There's a strong correlation between the Luminance and Amount sliders so it can pay off to play around with them and compare results.

Also, much of the noise can be "hidden" using clever editing with the Blacks and Shadows sliders (again in ACR which is what I use but similar sliders exist in other programs I believe).

It's of course possible to tweak the results by changing the other sliders too, but for most situations the above will give really good results. For instance, I've managed to make extremely grainy and noisy scans of expired Fuji Superia 1600 look ok. Below is an example (larger scan on Flickr).

Good luck

Philip

Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here…

Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members!

Flickr
TTL 50/1.4A

Thanks, Philip, especially for the detail. Plenty for me to try.