Will R10 too expensive for me?

September 5, 2007

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The Nikon F5 and the Canon 1V makes the R8 like a Dinosaur, THATS A GOOD LAUGH.

The laugh is that you can't distinguish past tense from present tense. My comment was that the F5 and 1V made the R8 look like a dinosaur, at the time. Even die-hard R-lovers reviled its size and weight given that it had no features that justified the increase, such as an on-board motor drive or AF. Then they waited nearly 2 years for a motor drive to become available. At the time of the R9 release there were still scores of un-sold R8s in the distribution chain.

Well sir, in this Digital world, both of these cameras are now duds, useless as titts on a bull.
The R8/9 are the only 35mm cameras that can take on board A DIGITAL BACK.

A discontinued digital back, of which no new ones remain available and no further production is planned. I'd say that puts it about neck and neck with that hermaphrodite bovine you alluded to

It's becoming a big joke now, as so many on this forum think that Digital is now or nothing.
I take pity on Leica, as being pressured by so many to develop a Digital SLR.

Just a moment ago you said "in this Digital world, both of these cameras are now duds, useless as titts on a bull." Which side of your own argument are you on?

THE WORLD IS BECOMING TO MUCH OF A WANK!

I hardly think vulgarity (nor poor grammar, it's "too" not "to") helps make your case...whatever it may be.

September 5, 2007

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mgcd · September 5, 2007

Even die-hard R-lovers reviled its size and weight given that it had no features that justified the increase, such as an on-board motor drive or AF.

Really? I did not want to get into this discussion but as a die-hard R lover I was not aware of that. If anything I loved everything about it especially the fact that it did NOT have AF. We did have to wait to get the winder, never cared for the motor-drive.

A discontinued digital back, of which no new ones remain available and no further production is planned. I'd say that puts it about neck and neck with that hermaphrodite bovine you alluded to

Strange, my DMR is firmly plugged into my R8... None remain available new because they're completely sold out...

Cheers,

telyt · September 5, 2007

One advanced feature the R8 incorporated that the designers of the F5 and EOS 1V failed to include was the ability to use a digital back.

September 5, 2007

One advanced feature the R8 incorporated that the designers of the F5 and EOS 1V failed to include was the ability to use a digital back.

Victor Hasselblad incorporated that feature in-to the 500C in 1957

September 5, 2007

Really? I did not want to get into this discussion but as a die-hard R lover I was not aware of that. If anything I loved everything about it especially the fact that it did NOT have AF.

There seems to be a comprehension problem to-day I did not say that die-hard R users wanted AF. I said that AF and/or an integral motor would have been justifications for the size differential between R7 and R8. As it was, the R8 was lambasted because nothing of its added features warranted such an increase in size and weight. Long-time R users dubbed the R8 the "Hunchback of Solms". (NB: I happen to think it's aesthetically beautiful).

None remain available new because they're completely sold out...

If the DMR was so successful and if what the public really wants is a digital back for the R8/R9, why then is Leica designing a dedicated digital body? Surely since they've already developed the DMR , it would be more profitable for them to simply upgrade it. The whole business about Imacon pulling out and parts not being available in no way precludes Leica from using the basic design.

stunsworth · September 5, 2007

Well now we know you have a knack for stating the obvious...

Tell me Vinay, are you patronising without realising it, or is this a game to you? For your patients' sake (assuming you really are a doctor) I hope you have a more positive attitude when speaking to them.

September 5, 2007

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Tell me Vinay, are you patronising without realising it...(assuming you really are a doctor)

A bit of the pot calling the kettle black don't you think? I edited out the line you found offencive even though the comment wasn't directed at you.

mgcd · September 5, 2007

There seems to be a comprehension problem to-day I did not say that die-hard R users wanted AF. I said that AF and/or an integral motor would have been justifications for the size differential between R7 and R8. As it was, the R8 was lambasted because nothing of its added features warranted such an increase in size and weight. Long-time R users dubbed the R8 the "Hunchback of Solms". (NB: I happen to think it's aesthetically beautiful).

There certainly is! Here you go again stating that "Long-time R users..." again, you state things and when called on them you say you meant something different. Perhaps "some" R users did, but many, including this one did NOT. It may be more intelligent on your part, to be more discerning when making blanket statements...

If the DMR was so successful and if what the public really wants is a digital back for the R8/R9, why then is Leica designing a dedicated digital body? Surely since they've already developed the DMR , it would be more profitable for them to simply upgrade it. The whole business about Imacon pulling out and parts not being available in no way precludes Leica from using the basic design.

You can try to twist this as much as you want to "try" to appear clever (not working by the way...), the DMR was sold out, no ifs or buts about it. Who says they will not use the same basic design, you're making assumptions once again. None of us know what existing designs and or assembly parts would be leveraged in a future R camera. In any case, as I am sure you know, the only thing that is permanent in life is change itself, the market is constantly changing and evolving.

Cheers,

marknorton · September 5, 2007

This is all getting a bit nasty. Worse, it may be another year before we know what's what.

In the meantime, there's (likely) 3 new Canons and (likely) 3 new Nikons it will be compared against and in the time in between, a body out of production, an ageing lens range which may or may not still be being produced. Their sole digital SLR offering right now is the Digilux 3 with a 2x crop factor.

They may yet snatch victory from the jaws of defeat but Leica have a huge mountain to climb.

September 5, 2007

Perhaps "some" R users did, but many, including this one did NOT. It may be more intelligent on your part, to be more discerning when making blanket statements...

I will only point out that your use of "many" without citing a specific number or percentage, is tantamount to a 'blanket statement'. I will not however, choose to impugn your intelligence as you've chosen to do to me.

You can try to twist this as much as you want to "try" to appear clever (not working by the way...)

That my facts appear twisted to you is a consequence of your perspective. I have no interest whatsoever in winning your approval for my cleverness.

Who says they will not use the same basic design, you're making assumptions once again.

Ah, so instead you would have us accept your assumption that the R10 may be a digital back for the R8/R9, not a dedicated R10 body? I suppose it's possible, but unlikely.

September 5, 2007

In the meantime, there's (likely) 3 new Canons and (likely) 3 new Nikons it will be compared against and in the time in between, a body out of production, an ageing lens range which may or may not still be being produced. Their sole digital SLR offering right now is the Digilux 3 with a 2x crop factor.

They may yet snatch victory from the jaws of defeat but Leica have a huge mountain to climb.

Spot-on. Thank you for another sane assessment, based on fact rather than emotion.

mgcd · September 5, 2007

Ah, so instead you would have us accept your assumption that the R10 may be a digital back for the R8/R9, not a dedicated R10 body? I suppose it's possible, but unlikely.

Where did I write that??? Highly unlikely as you say. However, this does not preclude a possible sharing of design and part assemblies.

Anyway, I'm cranky today and I think I'm reacting to this seeming patronising attitude that I (and Steve) detect in your words.

Cheers,

sdai · September 5, 2007

As a die hard Canon user, I always find Leica's cameras and lenses very attractive ... so what's the big fuss over nothing among Leica's own customers?

Calm down, folks. There's no reason why we shouldn't believe Leica knows exactly what they're doing ... so far, all signs are quite positive, no?

Let's just blame the OP who started a wrong thread ... since when Leica has been cheap? You want it, then you'd figure out how you're gonna pay for it. Case dismissed, go home. LOL

September 5, 2007

I'm reacting to this seeming patronising attitude that I (and Steve) detect in your words.

I think your attitude-detector needs a CLA Never meant to be patronising. I've lived in so many different countries over the years, believe me I've lost all ability to nuance

mgcd · September 5, 2007

I think your attitude-detector needs a CLA Never meant to be patronising. I've lived in so many different countries over the years, believe me I've lost all ability to nuance

Fine I'll go with that.

Cheers,

platoali · September 5, 2007

As a die hard Canon user, I always find Leica's cameras and lenses very attractive ... so what's the big fuss over nothing among Leica's own customers?

Calm down, folks. There's no reason why we shouldn't believe Leica knows exactly what they're doing ... so far, all signs are quite positive, no?

Let's just blame the OP who started a wrong thread ... since when Leica has been cheap? You want it, then you'd figure out how you're gonna pay for it. Case dismissed, go home. LOL

This thread has more than 74 replies and has been viewed more than 1700 times. This clearly shows that many in and out of Leica community have some serious thoughts about it. I don't think it was a wrong thread.

If you think the prices is OK, good for you. But many like me have many comments about it. When I'm talking about cheaper Leica bodies and lenses, I'm not talking about low quality products. I'm thinking about better and cheaper Manufacturing methods.

I don't want to see Leica as a luxary brand. What I want to see is that top quality products with reasonable prices that can attract serious photographers.

hamey · September 5, 2007

Probably the best SLR I have ever used was the Leica SL.

No motor drive, no winder, but a single stroke hand job.

No auto focus, no GPS, and a LCD screen.

The metering was simple, SPOT METER.

It was never fitted with rechergable batteries, BUT A SIMPLE 1.5 volt, mine lasted 10 years.

A fantastic bright viewfinder, that cameras today cannot equal.

It's solid and easly crack somebody's head open if attacked.

Another words NO BELLS AND WHISTLES.

AND IT HAD THIS WONDERFUL ABILITY TO TAKE FANTASTIC SHOTS

Don't get me wrong I love modern Technology, but only a fool is blinded by ....over SOPHISTICATION.

I am using my M7 more and more, and it's amazing the shots that this gem is giving me.

People look at me funny, do they feel sorry for me, perhaps because they think I am using an old Camera.

If only these knuckle heads know.

As for the future R10, I hope Leica takes a lesson from it's past masters.

....................................Keep it simple..................................

As for the cost????$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$????????????????$$$$$$$$$$$$

Cheers.

Ps... Oh yes, my SL still works, and it's 35mm light sensor has never given me any trouble.

.........Smart lot these Germans.

MrEd · September 5, 2007

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