where ? Ingress Protection Code for various m10 monochrom lenses

[crok]

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where can i find info about Ingress Protection Code of various lenses compatible with m10 monochrom ?

 

thank you,

crok

[jaapv]

As far as I am aware most if not all M mount lenses do not have such a code.

[crok]

4 minutes ago, jaapv said:

As far as I am aware most if not all M mount lenses do not have such a code.

hello jaapv,

basically i am planning to work mostly outdoor only. i prefer to some dust resistant and water (drizzle, sudden start of rain or rain drop).

basic inbuilt protection (must)

if no codes are available, where can i find reviews (purely neutral) or a little bit of love ?

[jaapv]

You could try searching this forum. Leica's position is that their products are engineered well enough to be somewhat resistant to water ingress in inclement weather, but they cannot guarantee it. The user experience in this forum seems to confirm that position. In all my years here I only recall two moisture death cases of digital Leica Ms. One by internal condensation when left in a bag in a tent in Greenland and one by being dropped in the sea. Never about an M lens. There are many posts about survival in rain storms, blizzards and even when dunked in a river. I never hesitated using an M in wet weather.

Don't forget that M lenses are mechanical: there are no electronics to corrode.

[jaapv]

One addition: I see that you mention dust. There has been one user with an M8 and the WATE lens using the combo in Namibian sand storms with success, I have been in the Kalahari which is pretty dusty with no problems -  but taking due care. Do be aware that M cameras have no no sensor dust reduction system.

[farnz]

1 hour ago, crok said:

where can i find info about Ingress Protection Code of various lenses compatible with m10 monochrom ?

 

thank you,

crok

As you might already know, ingress protection is standardised through EN 60529 and divides protection into two parts: particles ('dust'), and moisture and a certified test house will test and classify the object tested and nominate the appropriate IP-rating.

If Leica (for whatever reason) hasn't done the EN 60529 tests then there will be no IP-rating to find.

However it might be reasonable to informally roughly estimate Leica lenses on the basis of the IP-rating system and its values.  By virtue of the lenses manufacturing tolerances my rough estimate would be (ignoring partial vacuums created by movement of elements during focussing) that they would fall between IP43 and IP44 depending on age and condition.

IP 4x means that there is protection against objects that are larger than 1 mm.

IP x3 means there is protection against light spray from above

IP x4 means there is protection against water splashes from any direction.

My caveat is that if I was assessing Leica M lenses professionally then under strict test conditions the IP-rating might reduce to IP32 owing to the lengths of the test periods and proper, objective scrutiny.

Pete.

[crok]

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hello farnz and jaapv,

both of your posts are educative and encouraging.

i will first decide about which lens to buy and look for complaints (can avoid posts here and making same mistake) or issues (will search and read for shortcomings, after all nothing is 100% perfect (my belief)) or queries (learn how to use lens) or compliments here and elsewhere.

[jaapv]

1 hour ago, farnz said:

As you might already know, ingress protection is standardised through EN 60529 and divides protection into two parts: particles ('dust'), and moisture and a certified test house will test and classify the object tested and nominate the appropriate IP-rating.

If Leica (for whatever reason) hasn't done the EN 60529 tests then there will be no IP-rating to find.

However it might be reasonable to informally roughly estimate Leica lenses on the basis of the IP-rating system and its values.  By virtue of the lenses manufacturing tolerances my rough estimate would be (ignoring partial vacuums created by movement of elements during focussing) that they would fall between IP43 and IP44 depending on age and condition.

IP 4x means that there is protection against objects that are larger than 1 mm.

IP x3 means there is protection against light spray from above

IP x4 means there is protection against water splashes from any direction.

My caveat is that if I was assessing Leica M lenses professionally then under strict test conditions the IP-rating might reduce to IP32 owing to the lengths of the test periods and proper, objective scrutiny.

Pete.

Yes Pete I agree. However we should always look at the effects of moisture ingression. A mechanical lens which is made of glass and mostly non-corroding or minimally corroding materials will survive easily where a lens containing electronic circuits will succumb. Having said that, my TL 18-56 recovered from internal condensation to the point of forming droplets 💧 inside. I would class that as “don’t try this at home”, though. 

[jaapv]

26 minutes ago, crok said:

hello farnz and jaapv,

both of your posts are educative and encouraging.

i will first decide about which lens to buy and look for complaints (can avoid posts here and making same mistake) or issues (will search and read for shortcomings, after all nothing is 100% perfect (my belief)) or queries (learn how to use lens) or compliments here and elsewhere.

For lenses you will find very few if any complaints. Most is about fungus due to wrong storage. 

[farnz]

3 minutes ago, jaapv said:

Yes Pete I agree. However we should always look at the effects of moisture ingression. A mechanical lens which is made of glass and mostly non-corroding or minimally corroding materials will survive easily where a lens containing electronic circuits will succumb. Having said that, my TL 18-56 recovered from internal condensation to the point of forming droplets 💧 inside. I would class that as “don’t try this at home”, though. 

I quite agree, Jaap, for normal 'operational' use but of course EN test specifications don't take such things into account.

I've used M lenses, as I feel sure you have too, in wet conditions and they've had no problem perhaps up to IPx5 level, which is encouraging but Leica would be unwise to claim that and open itself up to financial claims from a certain unwelcome sector of society. 

Pete.

[pgk]

If you look into IP codes you will find that many are based on duration under specific conditions and those for water ingress are about water resistance not waterproofness which is a very different thing. Regardless of any resistance rating, most IP tests are for the item being tested under constant conditions but in practice we use equipment and lenses especially are focussed and have apertures chawed which is not covered by static, duration tests. As has already been pointed out, you can estimate equivalent IP ratings but the bottom line is that if you are in conditions which worry you then protect the camera and lens as much as you are able to. I have used my M9s and M lenses from boats (liveabords and smaller boats including RIBs) and they are fine providing that you keep them dry as much as possible and equally if not more importantly, you dry them thoroughly after - mine live in Pelicases with containers od indicator silica gel desiccant when not in use to ensure that nothing remains at all damp. This minimises the potential for fungus to grow which is a threat in damp conditions, and I am happy to use my gear in adverse conditions provided I ensure that it is dried out after.

Sand or grit is something else and unless a lens is designed to ensure to abrasive material can get into the moving parts then it can be a problem for most equipment. Again, I'd avoid extremest dusty/sandy conditions regardless of the make of lenses. One of my customers uses dSLRs in VERY dusty conditions (rock dust) and has mixed results with some cameras surviving for years and others failing before long - switchgear is the problem so settings are not changed if at all possible and IF lenses used, but there is no option in this case and equipment failure has to be costed in.