Monochrom vs GFX50R

[Peter_S]

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Hi!
So here is another "this vs. that" question. I was pretty committed to purchase a Monochrom M9M or M246. I live in Norway, however, and M246 prices are mad (7000 EUR). The GFX50R used costs me the same here the same as a used M9M, a new GFX50R is 3500 EUR less than than the M246. So that is substantial.
I played with some GFX50R files and it is hard not to be impressed. The integration with Capture One is sweet, also.

I am aware that they are very different cameras. That all aside - has someone used both and can comment on their practical value for black/white photography? I used the Leica SL for a while with M-lenses...I did not like it, to be honest - manual focus with anything other then wide-open lenses was cumbersome - I imagine using the GFX50R will be somewhat similar.
So I was thinking to get the 23mm f/4 for landscapes, and use adapted glass (VM, Mamiya, Pentax) for portrait and such, where the accuracy of the EVF is beneficial.

I do need to take the odd color images, for which I use a Fuji XT1, and I possibly will upgrade to the XT2. That costs too.

Edited September 16, 2019 by Peter_S

[a.noctilux]

Hello Peter,

 I can only comment as happy user of the two Leica Monochrom.

Leica Monochrom is very expensive indeed, why I "bought" (in fact MM1 was a trade-in with my film M) them second hand at better price than new.

If you own already M mount lens(es), the Monochrom can reveal the best out of them.

The most benefit when I use Monochrom is what I'd call "b&w mindset" (seeing things directly in shades of gray) which can't be duplicated when using color sensor.

[Akaki]

Hello Peter

very good question. I have a mm 246, it’s, because I use it as an artist. MM246 works with delicate and very strong light structure. that's why a have it.

But it has a limit. because B&W only.

Now I am looking to Fuji XT3 or GX50R. That is a great machine. I thing for landscape photography GX50R is great machine. it has 51.4MP. Leica 24MP.

As I say a have MM 246 because I am an artist and I use MM for special project. I am not interesting with “nice” b&w photography.

MM is unique machine really great for experimental photography.

But.....

Shining - MM 246, Noctilux 0.95

 

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[Peter_S]

Akaki, this is a great shot.
I decided to stick with the Monochrom idea. I miss rangefinders after looking through EVFs for too long, and find RF focusing just faster. I also think the M246 will produce more "keepers", due to faster focusing being probably a bit less prone to shaking blur. Color work will be taken care of by a XT1 and Sigma Merrill.
Thanks for the input - now time to look for a good deal. Prices for MM1 seem to be on a high right now, and MM2 prices are still quite stiff. Patience.

 

[Likaleica]

I'm confused, Peter.  You have a 246, or at least you post pictures from a 246.  Did you sell it and you're looking to get back into it?  I would think 246 prices will drop when the M10M is released.  I think over time M9M prices will hold or increase.  

[Peter_S]

Hi Tim!

That was a loaner from Leica. Ever since using it I lusted for one (increased now by seeing 150cm prints from it). I agree - the prices for the M246 will likely drop. The MM1 prices are up again compared to last year, making the MM1 not an option at the moment.
 

vor 10 Stunden schrieb Likaleica:

I'm confused, Peter.  You have a 246, or at least you post pictures from a 246.  Did you sell it and you're looking to get back into it?  I would think 246 prices will drop when the M10M is released.  I think over time M9M prices will hold or increase.  

 

Edited September 21, 2019 by Peter_S

[Likaleica]

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On 9/21/2019 at 7:39 AM, Peter_S said:

Hi Tim!

That was a loaner from Leica. Ever since using it I lusted for one (increased now by seeing 150cm prints from it). I agree - the prices for the M246 will likely drop. The MM1 prices are up again compared to last year, making the MM1 not an option at the moment.
 

 

Well, you were amazingly prolific during your stewardship of that camera.  You post many great shots on the Forum, including from backcountry expeditions.  I figured you had it with you all the time.

[Peter_S]

vor 37 Minuten schrieb Likaleica:

Well, you were amazingly prolific during your stewardship of that camera.  You post many great shots on the Forum, including from backcountry expeditions.  I figured you had it with you all the time.

Thank you a lot, Tim! I appreciate it. I was trying to get the most out of the camera in the time I had it.
I ended up buying a M9M (new sensor), against my original intend. It was priced very well and well below the M246, enough to warrant the Gen 1 model.

I was biased towards the M246, but I think the M9M and I will get along well. I took many of my best images with an M8, so it will feel familiar.
 

[a.noctilux]

Peter,

In my view, if you accept the somewhat "old techno" of MM1, the output has nothing less than the M246 output.

It's the most important if you don't need the advanced techno like LV, video, or faster writing on the SD card.

I think that even the histogram showing on the MM1 LCD (not quick) is "better" with those 'zones-like lines'.

Maybe I'm used, for years, to this kind of b&w histogram that I regret not having this same kind of histogram on M246.

When the lighting is difficult, that helped me a lot.

In general I don't use much the rear LCD, never to "view on the go".

Have fun using your 'new MM1' 😉.

[Likaleica]

4 hours ago, Peter_S said:

Thank you a lot, Tim! I appreciate it. I was trying to get the most out of the camera in the time I had it.
I ended up buying a M9M (new sensor), against my original intend. It was priced very well and well below the M246, enough to warrant the Gen 1 model.

I was biased towards the M246, but I think the M9M and I will get along well. I took many of my best images with an M8, so it will feel familiar.
 

I love the MM, even though it's now a bit quirky with it's slow write speed, but I don't mind that at all.  I think it forces me to be more thoughtful in choosing an exposure.

[AceVentura1986]

14 hours ago, Likaleica said:

I love the MM, even though it's now a bit quirky with it's slow write speed, but I don't mind that at all.  I think it forces me to be more thoughtful in choosing an exposure.

My M9M is the best camera I’ve ever used. I’ve accustomed myself to it, tho. You are right, it does slow you down just enough to force you to contemplate what you’re doing. 

[Peter_S]

Well, I have used film-Ms and M8 for years, then an M9...now I use a Bessa III, Contax T3 and Sigma DP2 Merrill, so all no speed-demons. For all work requiring fast shooting, processing and editing, I got a Fuji X-T1.
I doubt the M9M will feel slow

[gunston]

On 9/16/2019 at 5:12 PM, a.noctilux said:

Hello Peter,

 I can only comment as happy user of the two Leica Monochrom.

Leica Monochrom is very expensive indeed, why I "bought" (in fact MM1 was a trade-in with my film M) them second hand at better price than new.

If you own already M mount lens(es), the Monochrom can reveal the best out of them.

The most benefit when I use Monochrom is what I'd call "b&w mindset" (seeing things directly in shades of gray) which can't be duplicated when using color sensor.

still using both MM and M246 ? which one do you like it the most?

[a.noctilux]

7 hours ago, gunston said:

still using both MM and M246 ? which one do you like it the most?

I do like the two Monochrom 🥰 and I don't know which is my prefered one,

I'm lucky not to choose only one, but use the two along with some differences in practices.

- each can not replace the other in use

- the MM1 is lighter and it's slow, a bit louder sound, but for me 100g less let me use more weighty lens or carry one more lens, with less battery life so carrying

one or two batteries more can cancel the "less is more Monochrom"

- the M246 can do more if I plan to use in varieties of unknow subjects (or see the rendering of the color filter in use), but this may need EVF also, so

more gear to carry with more weight and I don't know why in my hand the M246 feels "fatty" less comfortable than the MM1 handling

 

- the best thing is that I can't see in my files the " difference rendering " (I've read in some web articles) between LCD and CMOS sensor

(maybe my standard is not as high as people who see the differences)

- the last thing is I can not choose only one Monochrom and I'm done for next M10 Monochrom which I don't care anymore,

I'm so happy with the two Monochrom that I use now 😂

[a.noctilux]

I can't edit in the former post.

Sorry not LCD but CCD sensor of course.

[AceVentura1986]

15 hours ago, Peter_S said:

Well, I have used film-Ms and M8 for years, then an M9...now I use a Bessa III, Contax T3 and Sigma DP2 Merrill, so all no speed-demons. For all work requiring fast shooting, processing and editing, I got a Fuji X-T1.
I doubt the M9M will feel slow

Yes, exactly. As the Brits say, horses for courses. If I need fast shooting I’ve always got my Canons. The Monochrom, though my favorite camera, is not intended as a be all and end all. It really is a niche within the already small niche of rangefinders. 

[Peter_S]

Its here...wow. Feels good. All is working as it should (except the obligatory SD reading card error).
We are in full autumn colors here in Norway, so images will have to wait a little. I shall be back on the MM1 images section soon.
Thanks for all advice!
 

[a.noctilux]

I didn't know about the 'obligatory SD reading card error'.

Peter, can you let us know more details about this ?

I had some "errors writing" sometimes with my MM1, but each time with 'new formatting' it works fine.

...

Why not use your 'new MM1' for autumn 'colors', you would have some surprises (good ones, I think) ?

Maybe with some colored filters to enhance the differenciations between yellows/oranges/browns in shade of grays.

 

[Peter_S]

vor 6 Stunden schrieb a.noctilux:

I didn't know about the 'obligatory SD reading card error'.

Peter, can you let us know more details about this ?

I had some "errors writing" sometimes with my MM1, but each time with 'new formatting' it works fine.

...

Why not use your 'new MM1' for autumn 'colors', you would have some surprises (good ones, I think) ?

Maybe with some colored filters to enhance the differenciations between yellows/oranges/browns in shade of grays.

 

Hello!
I was referring to the unwillingness to read SD cards. True, formatting takes care off it, usually. Had the same thing with the M9 (and M8, if I remember right), and I tend to just find the card that behaves and just use that. No big deal.

I was reading up on "color" photography with the M Monochrom quite a bit, and find it an interesting idea. The thing is, I got a Sigma, which yields the results I desire 😃
Then again, the lens selection on the M is better, and it seems an experiment worth the while. I saw a recent article on Astro photography with the M Monochrom (in color). I have not wrapped my head around it entirely, to be honest.
 

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Hallo,

Look here: Leica M

[Likaleica]

You just need pure red, blue and green filters then make 3 separate exposures, attach them to colors, and then blend them together.  Kind of like an electronic version of dye transfer process.