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mikeodial

From X Vario to CL - is it worth the move?

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I am considering consolidating equipment and have an X Vario (which I love) and a Fuji x100f with a 50mm teleconverter lens. I am looking to have a single walkabout camera and wondering if the CL will fit the bill with a zoom similar to the one on the X Vario.

Has anyone made this transition and if so can you let me know if you think it is worth the move. The new Sigma FF camera body has some appeal was well, with either Voightlander or TL lenses. 

Thoughts welcome. 

Most of my photography is landscape, some street and portraits. 

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AF is  better, the camera as a whole is faster and more versatile. The X-Vario is a camera, the CL is a system. Yes, it is worth the upgrade. Buying a FF camera to use with TL lenses does not really make sense. The Sigma  -although it can take stills- is basically a Video-oriented camera, aimed at vloggers.

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The CL Is brilliant. 10fps 50k ISO, great EVF and the haptics from the Leica III. A worthy upgrade.

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3 hours ago, jaapv said:

AF is  better, the camera as a whole is faster and more versatile. The X-Vario is a camera, the CL is a system. Yes, it is worth the upgrade. Buying a FF camera to use with TL lenses does not really make sense. The Sigma  -although it can take stills- is basically a Video-oriented camera, aimed at vloggers.

I wouldn't say the new Sigma is aimed at vloggers. It is billed as a modular production camera for use on anything from commercials to independent productions. If it was aimed at vloggers, it would at least have an articulating screen which could be used for selfie shooting. The Sigma doesn't have this at all. In fact, it almost requires you to use multiple accessories to make it viable, like a handgrip, an external EVF, battery pack for extended shooting, etc. I work in this area and I've been following the Sigma full frame camera pretty closely. It's expected that it will be rigged with a cage, lens supports, a monitor, maybe even a matte box and V-lock battery.

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9 hours ago, mikeodial said:

I am considering consolidating equipment and have an X Vario (which I love) and a Fuji x100f with a 50mm teleconverter lens. I am looking to have a single walkabout camera and wondering if the CL will fit the bill with a zoom similar to the one on the X Vario.

Has anyone made this transition and if so can you let me know if you think it is worth the move. The new Sigma FF camera body has some appeal was well, with either Voightlander or TL lenses. 

Thoughts welcome. 

Most of my photography is landscape, some street and portraits. 

Mike, definitely;  but keep your XV if you can. When comparing the CL with standard zoom, it is less effective at the macro setting. Why? Because you are much closer to your subject which is sometimes not the better option. Apart from that,  you have a significantly more flexible system available to you. 

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I sold my XVario and Q to help pay for the CL.  I preferred the menus on the XVario and the inclusion of a macro setting.  However, I think the CL produces better images and the built in EVF is excellent.  In the end, I wanted to be able to use different lenses so the CL was the right choice for me.

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Yes of course. CL is totally in another league

Fast AF and fast operation

Faster shutter speed with electronic shutter available.  

Better menu and user interface

Better build quality 

Being an interchangeable camera it has access to better lenses selection (you can even get a proper macro lens) Almost every Leica lenses ever produced are compatible : M, R, TL, SL and LTM

Very nice OLED EVF ! Way better than really old clip on EVF 2. 

Bigger, cheaper and easier to find batteries  

Touch screen

Wifi connectivity  

 

 

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12 hours ago, nicci78 said:

Yes of course. CL is totally in another league

Fast AF and fast operation

Faster shutter speed with electronic shutter available.  

Better menu and user interface

Better build quality 

Being an interchangeable camera it has access to better lenses selection (you can even get a proper macro lens) Almost every Leica lenses ever produced are compatible : M, R, TL, SL and LTM

Very nice OLED EVF ! Way better than really old clip on EVF 2. 

Bigger, cheaper and easier to find batteries  

Touch screen

Wifi connectivity  

 

 

Where is your evidence of better build quality? 

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I still have an X 113 but it seldom gets used. The CL is my main camera these days. A total pleasure to use with native and adapted lenses.

Should you upgrade? I would. but only YOU know for certain.

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I traded in my xvario for the CL and it’s a great little camera. Bonus points: I get to use my Leica M lenses and the new 60mm macro lens is amazing and it’s just so much easier than using the xvario, for me.

 

rosie

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On 8/11/2019 at 10:50 AM, wda said:

Where is your evidence of better build quality? 

May be by just comparing the two cameras next to each other. Sometimes it just that easy. 

Edited by nicci78

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43 minutes ago, nicci78 said:

May be by just comparing the two cameras next to each other. Sometimes it just that easy. 

I am pleased you withdrew your interesting but unconvincing evidence. Country of manufacture is no guarantee of build quality. In my experience both camera bodies are very well built and should live long enough to give very good value. Build quality should not be a deciding factor. 

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For Leica cameras, build quality should be a deciding factor. It is too pricey to pass on such important factor.

M cameras should always be made with brass. 

Q2 is somehow better build than Q or CL. But being 100% magnesium instead of 50/50 aluminium + magnesium.  However Q2 feels inferior. Because of its plastic feeling.

Edited by nicci78

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People misunderstand build quality. It’s not about the superficialities or tactility. It’s about how an object is designed and constructed - the fact that 999 out of 1000 will have the same tolerances and will work in real life with the same failure rate. It’s easy for a manufacturer to change the perception of quality - stuffing car doors with sound deadening for instance - but that’s not build quality. Making the doors with minimal tolerances time and time again is build quality.

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@mikeodial: Since 2014 I habe been a fan of the X Vario (and I still am), but since I bought the CL, the XV stays at home. The main reason in the fantastic 11-23 zoom. If the X V could less than 18 I wouldn`t have change. But now I am happy that I bought the CL. Additionally I use the Panasonic 24-105 lens at the CL and both lenses offer a better quality than the XV. Maybe you can keep the X V and buy a CL only with a 11-23 zoom and than use both cameras?

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On 8/15/2019 at 3:53 AM, Le Chef said:

People misunderstand build quality. It’s not about the superficialities or tactility. It’s about how an object is designed and constructed - the fact that 999 out of 1000 will have the same tolerances and will work in real life with the same failure rate. It’s easy for a manufacturer to change the perception of quality - stuffing car doors with sound deadening for instance - but that’s not build quality. Making the doors with minimal tolerances time and time again is build quality.

We do not have the same definition sorry. 

Making perfect industrial plastic door with minimum tolerance. Is not excellent build quality against state of the art wood door, build by a real artisan. 

Tactility is the most important part. It is what makes real German cars (not Opel) feels superior to the rest of the industry.

Japanese cars are nice, but they feel cheap plastic. Add the design team is missing syndrome. You get non inspiring cars.

 

Edited by nicci78

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4 hours ago, nicci78 said:

We do not have the same definition sorry. 

Making perfect industrial plastic door with minimum tolerance. Is not excellent build quality against state of the art wood door, build by a real artisan. 

Tactility is the most important part. It is what makes real German cars (not Opel) feels superior to the rest of the industry.

Japanese cars are nice, but they feel cheap plastic. Add the design team is missing syndrome. You get non inspiring cars.

 

I will stick by the definition given to me by BMW, Ford, Mercedes Benz and Toyota, thank you.

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On 8/10/2019 at 3:43 PM, nicci78 said:

 

Very nice OLED EVF ! Way better than really old clip on EVF 2. 

 

Source on EVF being OLED? I was told it is LCD

 

It is a very good EVF btw

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CL and Q2 have OLED viewfinder. Just like the rest of the industry. Respectively 2.36 and 3.68 MP 

Epson Seiko gave up their LCD viewfinder. Their last LCD viewfinder equipped cameras are Visoflex 020 and SL  

Sony just won and has a monopoly over every photo manufacturers. Yes everybody are now using Sony OLED panels. Hopefully Panasonic gave up their stupid sequential field LCOS viewfinder for Sony’s

 

 

 

Edited by nicci78

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