M 10-D monochrome please

[Belle123]

Advertisement (gone after registration)

So, just got the announcement of the new M 10 D camera.  Would love to see it in a monochrome version!  please.

[Advertisement]

The Leica Q3 is available for pre-order at B&H Photo Video and Adorama

[Quorrell]

Me too!

[RF’sDelight]

+1 ✋🏼

[Jeff S]

Please don’t stick a dumb wind lever on an initial M10M release.

Jeff

[Jager]

With due respect to those who love the new M10-D features... but my guess is that Leica will not take what's already a niche camera and apply a second, even narrower, set of niche qualities to it.

[Belle123]

That may be true.  In fact, I suspect the 246 is last of the monochrome versions, unfortunately.  We are a super small market.  Too bad.  Oh well.  End of my Leica M buying.  The 246 was the last.......unless.  I get as good files converting medium format to b/w most of the time, but is not the same shooting experience.

Edited October 25, 2018 by Belle123

[a.noctilux]

Advertisement (gone after registration)

On 10/24/2018 at 3:45 PM, Belle123 said:

So, just got the announcement of the new M 10 D camera.  Would love to see it in a monochrome version!  please.

If we "Monochrome Lovers" ask hard enough, Leica Camera wouln't resist launching this ultimate Monochrom.

We have to wait some time.

I'd even accept the false-lever-wind-thumby.

 

Out of curiosity, as I've never use the wind-on lever as thumb support, I tried that with my M-A then M4,

😋

Oh my, that is not bad at all with hefty lens mounted.

I thought that I'd prefer plastic articulate M4 lever to hold,

but (short) experiences prove that the solid metal lever IS far strong-feel = so Leica choice of metal thumb rest is first-class 👍 👍

[carbon_dragon]

I go back and forth on the idea of actually BUYING a Monochrom (of some variation). On the one hand, the idea is a fun one -- you have to actually use those black and white filters again, and you have no choice but to take black and white and presumably it does a great job. On the other hand, you can set the M10 to Monochrome and shoot black and white and the experience seems to be very good. You could probably shoot jpeg only and dial the sharpness up 1 or 2 ticks to simulate the Monocrhom's higher resolution because of the lack of a Bayer filter. And then don't you really HAVE most of the experience? You even have the great ISO performance. Maybe not quite as good as the monochrom, but pretty close with the M10.

It just doesn't seem to be worth $3-6K (or 8K for a M10 Monochrom presumably). 

[a.noctilux]

The difficult-to-understand-b&w-mind-set may be the valid answer (for me).

 

As Monochrome CCD user for years before buying M10, I thought that "b&w convert from M10" would be good enough to sell my Monochrome.

But with time, I appreciate Monochrome more and more with those "real color filters used in the field" not possible (for me) to be duplicate with software.

When using "real color filter" to adapt the subject contrast in real-life-real-time, I couldn't duplicate that situation in PP with color files.

Maybe that just me, and I understand that we are all different.

 

Same thing (almost) with M-D that I bought after M10 (out of curiosity to use without physical LCD screen, as I always use my digital M screen off).

Time proves that I love to use the M-D more than M10.

 

Edited October 25, 2018 by a.noctilux

[Belle123]

21 hours ago, carbon_dragon said:

I go back and forth on the idea of actually BUYING a Monochrom (of some variation). On the one hand, the idea is a fun one -- you have to actually use those black and white filters again, and you have no choice but to take black and white and presumably it does a great job. On the other hand, you can set the M10 to Monochrome and shoot black and white and the experience seems to be very good. You could probably shoot jpeg only and dial the sharpness up 1 or 2 ticks to simulate the Monocrhom's higher resolution because of the lack of a Bayer filter. And then don't you really HAVE most of the experience? You even have the great ISO performance. Maybe not quite as good as the monochrom, but pretty close with the M10.

It just doesn't seem to be worth $3-6K (or 8K for a M10 Monochrom presumably). 

That really is the difference between those of us who really appreciate the monochrome versions, and those that probably won’t or have no need.  There is a difference, but it is not for everyone.   Besides the performance, the fact we are willing to pay more for less of a camera.....but getting more out of our b/w images, says something.  For me it comes from a life time of appreciating the works of past photographers who really pushed the envelope in the dark room creating incredibly beautiful b/w images.  The real work begins after photo is taken.  So, in the digital age, having a camera that gets you closer to that film experience is what the monochrome does for me, or a larger format camera.

[mmradman]

Why would ultimate monochrome be without rear display?  Leica MP or MA, both film cameras, are petty good for that.

Common trait to digital cameras is ability to view picture and most digital camera users prefer to have rear screen.  

If M10 ever gets mono treatment it would be Leicas decision based on sales figures, agin decision for rear screen or not would be most probably determined by historical sales figures.

[ramarren]

The difficulty with the M Monochrom is precisely that: having to go back to B&W filters again, once you understand the spectral sensitivity of the base sensor, in order to organize the right contrast ratios for the particular scene you're shooting. This costs ISO performance (you need to use higher sensitivity because the filters typically absorb a lot of light, from 1 to 4 stops) and you also have to take time to change them as needed. 

I had an order in for the MM typ 256 but cancelled it. Basically because I'd been waiting too long, but also because the announcement for the SL happened and I knew that would be a better camera for me. I'm completely comfortable capturing DNG only and rendering my monochrome photographs from raw, and whatever advantage there might be the to the MM sensor, well, it's probably not significant to me. But I understand the desire for it and sympathize. 

[mmradman]

I wouldn’t call it difficulty using B&W correction filters, more essence of B&W photography, highly enjoyable with digital Monochrom sensor.

[pico]

1 hour ago, mmradman said:

I wouldn’t call it difficulty using B&W correction filters, more essence of B&W photography, highly enjoyable with digital Monochrom sensor.

And the practical ISO range above film should nullify the objection to lens filters.

 

[IkarusJohn]

5 hours ago, mmradman said:

Why would ultimate monochrome be without rear display?  Leica MP or MA, both film cameras, are petty good for that.

Common trait to digital cameras is ability to view picture and most digital camera users prefer to have rear screen.  

If M10 ever gets mono treatment it would be Leicas decision based on sales figures, agin decision for rear screen or not would be most probably determined by historical sales figures.

Why would those who like the MD concept and who want a Monochrom as well, not view a Monochrom version of the M-D as the ultimate camera?  The reasons for disliking the LCD apply equally to a Monochrom camera as to a colour digital?  Film cameras are something else again.

It would be a relatively small market, but I suspect a Monochrom version would be eaqually appealing.

[a.noctilux]

23 minutes ago, pico said:

And the practical ISO range above film should nullify the objection to lens filters.

 

Yes, of course Pico.

When using red filter, close down a bit ...3200 ISO can be handy and can give on some pictures the lovely "grain" that I appreciate on Monochrome CCD.

 

John, I hope Leica Camera hear us and offer (at not too high cost) this ultimate Monochrome M10-D.

[IkarusJohn]

Ah, not for me.  I remain addicted to my Monochrom1.

[a.noctilux]

Well,  you are right, John.

I know and appreciate only Monochrom CCD, maybe CMOS sensor would not be the same.

Have heard/read that some people took the M246 after MM1 then quickly return to MM1 again.

[Advertisement]

Hallo,

Look here: Leica M

[pico]

I will never buy a monochrome Leica. My experience with B&W film over the past fifty years has informed me of the extent and shortcomings of monochrome and for what it is worth my favorite personal images are film B&W. However, digital has liberated color and I am so very happy to reinterpret digital color to B&W because it offers enormous capabilities that B&W contrast filters cannot.

 

Edited October 26, 2018 by pico

[IkarusJohn]

Interesting, Pico.

I thought the Monochrom (Henri) was daft.  Not as daft as having a shutter re-cocking lever on a digital camera, but daft nonetheless.  Then I played with the digital files, and they blew my mind - compared to the M9 files, the resolution, flexibility of the files and the lovely texture of the images really captured my imagination.

It also triggered a memory for me, which I’m sure you also feel - photography, proper photography, was black and white.  Colour was a gimmick, and a B&W image was what photography was really about.  I use Tri-X in my M-A, and I must confess I’m not sure I see an advantage to those images over the Monochrom ones (probably a reflection of my skill, or lack of it).

Cheers
John