My M10 survived -27C

[Ozytripper]

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I just got back from a trip to North East China (Jilin, Changbaishan and Harbin) with temperatures from -10C to -27C plus wind chill.

 

To those who are from the colder regions of the world these temperatures may be "normal" but for a first timer in this climate it was quite an adventure.

 

I brought an M10, M9P, Mate, Wate, 50mm F2 Apo, 50mm F1.5 Summarit and the Zeiss 35mm F1.4, Surprisingly all the camera and lenses performed flawlessly (well - almost). The M10 and the Mate got the most use while the M9P with the Wate mounted most of the time was lightly used. Both the 50mm F2 apo and the 50mm F1.5 Summarit was only mounted once on the M10.

 

Up to -10C I was getting about 100+shots per battery on the M10 but at -20C I was down to about 40 shots per battery and at -27C i was down to about 20 shots before the low battery warning came on and the camera duly shut down soon after. When I was back in the hotel charging the "worn" batteries they all showed 80% charged (the chargers's amber light was on with the green light flashing)

 

All camera functions were as per normal on both cameras. No rangefinder patch disappearing, no hesitation in the shutter trigger and LCD screen working perfectly

 

Double ziplock freezer bags helped prevent condensation forming on the cameras and lenses when moving from the cold to a warm interiors. There were a couple of occasions when even the zip lock bags began to feel brittle in the cold but they did not crack or break

 

All lenses still focused smoothly like they always do in warmer environments

 

In my opinion there was only one major problem (for me anyway). The cute little base plate battery cover became a major PITA. It became almost impossible to change batteries. In such cold conditions the hands and fingers were already unresponsive and sensitive so trying to remove the base plate with gloves on was basically impossible. ((I had hand grip base plate with the screw on bottom). I had a thick glove on my left hand and a thin glove with rubber palms and a leather patch on the index finger - still impossible to turn the screw to remove the base plate.Sothe only way todoit was to remove the glove, try to change batteries as quickly as possible, put the glove back on and pray that there was no frost bite. By the way once the glove is off the hand and fingers begin to feel pain from the cold and turning the screw raised the pain level five fold!!!

When it was -27C with the wind blowing, I gave up taking photos when the battery died. Not game to remove my glove at all

So Leica if you are reading this please get rid of this cute nostalgia thing and put a battery window on instead.

 

One other interesting thing that happened was that the LCD screen was perpetually iced over from moisture in my exhalation. The camera body was regularly frosted over too albeit much less than the LCD screen. On one occasion my glove got frozen onto the M10 body and when I tried to pull it off the glove got ripped - there goes my brand new glove!! 

 

I must say that I was impressed by the robustness of the M10 (and M9P) and the lenses too. 

 

Camera in double zip lock freezer bags

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Edited December 28, 2017 by Ozytripper

[Ozytripper]

some photos

 

 

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more photos

 

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last batch

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Edited December 28, 2017 by Ozytripper

[lpeeples]

The arte di mano case with the battery door is your answer.  Works great and the design should protect the compartment from moisture.

[Gobert]

Brrrr, cold there!

Nice pics anyway.

[robert blu]

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Very interesting, I'll be in the Alps beginning of january  and your observations make me more relaxed, even if temperature should not be much below  minus 10 °C. 

I always use ziplock bags with my cameras when going back to a warmer place. When you were outside did you keep your camera under the jacket/parka or in a bag/bagpack  and taking out only when you forecasted a shoot opportunity around?

 

No need to say beautiful "freezing" photos, post more please!

robert

[Ozytripper]

Thanks Robert and no I did not keep the camera under the jacket or in a bag as:

my jacket was too tight to fit anything else in (I had a t shirt, thermal shirt, fleece turtle neck, goose down vest and a goose down outer jacket)

Also read somewhere that keeping the camera under a jacket may cause condensation when one takes it out to shoot.

 

 

 

 

"When you were outside did you keep your camera under the jacket/parka or in a bag/bagpack  and taking out only when you forecasted a shoot opportunity around?"

 

No need to say beautiful "freezing" photos, post more please!

robert

[Ko.Fe.]

Under second jacket, not first one close to you.

I just used my M4-2 at -26c where I live, again. Last time it was -28c and film broke.

[albertknappmd]

What an experience!

Glad you came through unscathed.

Always avoid breathing on your cameras and lenses as the condensation can sometimes lead to annoying consequences.

As for a case, a leather one does help and Luigi makes one that opens up the battery with minimal effort  http://www.luigicases.com/

 

Albert     

[Bill W]

Nice experience and images but no way would I want to shoot in that kind of cold. 

[adan]

Very nice report. Glad you survived as well as your Leicas.

 

I've shot at -32C/-26F - once (Chicago, building fire pictures). Not with a Leica (I wish!), but a Nikon F. No batteries, but I still had to remove the baseplate and back to change film, and it was not easy even manipulating the camera dials, so I shot gloveless for a couple of minutes at a time, and you bet my hands were "burning" red-raw, and almost unusable with cold even in that brief time. Took about 5 minutes to "recover," hands tucked deep into my jacket.

 

(The firemen were doing shifts - 30 minutes in the open, 30 minutes recovery in borrowed, heated, city buses. And of course they were getting sprayed with water. After things died down, I saw one fireman coming off duty. He took off his heavy fire-coat (well, actually, he was so cold and stiff that a partner took off his coat for him) - and it was so stiff with ice that it stood up on the sidewalk by itself.)

 

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-15C/+5F is pretty common in the Colorado mountains, though - and so I now have a pair of mittens with a fingerless part, plus hinged, Velcro™-sealable "caps" for my fingers and thumb. Really a required accessory for photography in extreme cold, with almost any camera.

 

About like these: http://d2q9kw5vp0we94.cloudfront.net/big/12950220_2.jpg

 

One can also get ultralight "undergloves" or liners to wear under such mittens, for some additional "contact" protection with frigid gear, while retaining delicate grip and "feel".

 

http://thumbs2.ebaystatic.com/d/l225/m/mnWncD4ONWmKCodCpAaEQbA.jpg

Edited December 28, 2017 by adan

[Reciprocity]

 

 

Up to -10C I was getting about 100+shots per battery on the M10 but at -20C I was down to about 40 shots per battery and at -27C i was down to about 20 shots before the low battery warning came on and the camera duly shut down soon after. 

 

 

Wow, that is not good at all. I would easily get 200-300 shots on an all day shoot in temps that are -10 to -15C with my M240, well over 600 with a D810 or D750. 

 

It has been pretty warm here lately being 0-5C so I can't really say I have had the chance to check my M10 out in the cold but this makes me want to really make sure the spares are close to my body. 

 

My record cold was -40C plus a 25MPH wind chill, no issues with film breaking or batteries going but I shoot in cold weather a lot so I know the drill.

Edited December 28, 2017 by Reciprocity

[Nordvik]

Wow, that is not good at all. I would easily get 200-300 shots on an all day shoot in temps that are -10 to -15C with my M240, well over 600 with a D810 or D750. 

 

It has been pretty warm here lately being 0-5C so I can't really say I have had the chance to check my M10 out in the cold but this makes me want to really make sure the spares are close to my body. 

 

My record cold was -40C plus a 25MPH wind chill, no issues with film breaking or batteries going but I shoot in cold weather a lot so I know the drill.

-10 to -15 is not cold for man or machine. By -27 both can get into trouble. -38 is the coldest I have registered at home.

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[Keith_W]

Glad to hear you made it back to sunny Melbourne safe and sound Ozy! Just two weeks ago I was in the German Alps and shooting in -10C conditions with my M10, and right now I am sweltering in the heat of the Australian summer, trying to fend off jet lag. 

 

I did not endure conditions as cold as yours, but my M10 performed flawlessly in the cold and snow. I did not have any issues with condensation, apart from my Visioflex 020 fogging up and becoming unusable. I could still operate my camera with my gloves on. I agree that opening that silly bottom plate to get at the battery is quite inconvenient with gloves on. 

 

On a typical day I would take 200-300 shots. Even with a Visioflex EVF and plenty of chimping, I would usually be able to do it with only one battery. 

[Ozytripper]

Very nice report. Glad you survived as well as your Leicas.

 

I've shot at -32C/-26F - once (Chicago, building fire pictures). Not with a Leica (I wish!), but a Nikon F. No batteries, but I still had to remove the baseplate and back to change film, and it was not easy even manipulating the camera dials, so I shot gloveless for a couple of minutes at a time, and you bet my hands were "burning" red-raw, and almost unusable with cold even in that brief time. Took about 5 minutes to "recover," hands tucked deep into my jacket.

 

(The firemen were doing shifts - 30 minutes in the open, 30 minutes recovery in borrowed, heated, city buses. And of course they were getting sprayed with water. After things died down, I saw one fireman coming off duty. He took off his heavy fire-coat (well, actually, he was so cold and stiff that a partner took off his coat for him) - and it was so stiff with ice that it stood up on the sidewalk by itself.)

 

coldfire.jpg

 

-15C/+5F is pretty common in the Colorado mountains, though - and so I now have a pair of mittens with a fingerless part, plus hinged, Velcro™-sealable "caps" for my fingers and thumb. Really a required accessory for photography in extreme cold, with almost any camera.

 

About like these: http://d2q9kw5vp0we94.cloudfront.net/big/12950220_2.jpg

 

One can also get ultralight "undergloves" or liners to wear under such mittens, for some additional "contact" protection with frigid gear, while retaining delicate grip and "feel".

 

http://thumbs2.ebaystatic.com/d/l225/m/mnWncD4ONWmKCodCpAaEQbA.jpg

Thanks Adan,

nice photos you posted - I can feel the cold just looking your photos. If I ever go back to cold places like that I will try thode gloves you recommended.

You were brave to take your gloves off. Even with gloves on when i am outside at -20C my hands were still unresponsive enough to hold cutlery properly for the first 5 or 10 minutes when i go indoors for lunch and dinner  

[Ozytripper]

Glad to hear you made it back to sunny Melbourne safe and sound Ozy! Just two weeks ago I was in the German Alps and shooting in -10C conditions with my M10, and right now I am sweltering in the heat of the Australian summer, trying to fend off jet lag. 

 

I did not endure conditions as cold as yours, but my M10 performed flawlessly in the cold and snow. I did not have any issues with condensation, apart from my Visioflex 020 fogging up and becoming unusable. I could still operate my camera with my gloves on. I agree that opening that silly bottom plate to get at the battery is quite inconvenient with gloves on. 

 

On a typical day I would take 200-300 shots. Even with a Visioflex EVF and plenty of chimping, I would usually be able to do it with only one battery. 

Thanks Keith,

lucky I am currently working in Hong Kong so I did not fly back to 35C heat from -27C. Definitely too much of a physical shock otherwise.

As Nordvik posted above -10C is very different from -20C and below. Add in wind chill and things really get scary. We get -10C in our own little Alpine regions in Victoria but this -27C is really different. 

Edited December 29, 2017 by Ozytripper

[Reciprocity]

As Nordvik posted above -10C is very different from -20C and below.

It’s actually not if you are accustomed to and even thrive in this kind climate which I do. Now in terms of batteries, starting and warming up a car, etc. it can often have a big effect.

 

But to only get a bit over 100 images on a charge at -10C (14F) with the M10 is really troubling to me. I look forward to getting out of this relative heat wave of 0-5C to give it a go my self.

[Ozytripper]

It’s actually not if you are accustomed to and even thrive in this kind climate which I do. Now in terms of batteries, starting and warming up a car, etc. it can often have a big effect.

 

But to only get a bit over 100 images on a charge at -10C (14F) with the M10 is really troubling to me. I look forward to getting out of this relative heat wave of 0-5C to give it a go my self. 

I agree with you that there is probably little difference for those who are acclimatized. I see locals who were running around without gloves. None of us in the group who were not from that climate could have withstood the cold without gloves for a few minutes.

 

Eating ice cream was also a novelty for tourist there

 

As for the battery performance note that the M10 is way poorer than the M240 in normal temperatures. I think I usually get between 200 and 300 shots from one battery in normal temperatures which is about half of what an M240 was capable of?

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[Ozytripper]

This was my glove setup when it gets really cold

 

On the right hand I was wearing a thick glove while on the left hand a thinner fleece and rubberized material on the palm. Thereis also a leather patch on the tip of the index finger.

 

I find that it works well as the thicker glove can still grip the focus tab on the Leica lenses. The lighter glove gives me better feelof the shutter button and makes it easier to remove the base plate to change batteries.

 

The thicker glove featured below was not the one I actually wore but something similar. I have already thrown mine as it got ripped from being stuck to the camera body by frozen condensed moisture,

 

Practical but looks a bit silly running around with two unmatched gloves

 

 

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