50mm Summilux-SL ASPH Review

[Peter Branch]

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I have to admit, that I often wonder about the same thing. If you want to see some interesting images, this forum would probably be the last place to visit...

 

At the risk of being controversial I think the Forum has changed.

 

I've been a member for many years and have noticed a shift away from "Fact Based" posts to more "Opinion".

 

Actual photographs are Facts, pure and simple, so they have become a minority population in this environment.

 

I also think, based on experience, that getting pictures to look good on the forum is more difficult that it perhaps should be in this day and age.  

Edited March 22, 2017 by Peter Branch

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[wattsy]

I think we should be upfront about this. You're on the payroll of Nikon, geetee works for Canon and I'm owned by Sony.

 

There can be no other explanation for not being convinced by this wonderful and enormously practical lens.

 

 

 Thanks for blowing my cover. I don't know about your masters but mine are terrified by the number of "reference" lenses that Leica are selling. I think they are worried that people will no longer be satisfied by a £150 50/F1.8G lens and will be changing systems to the £10,000 SL (body + lens) for that extra bit of sharpness in the corners and "better rendering". I think there is also some concern that these same people might be beguiled by the slower way of working that comes with an AF performance that even the Leica Miami shop describes as "somewhat sluggish".

[wattsy]

I've been a member for many years and have noticed a shift away from "Fact Based" posts to more "Opinion".

 

 

I think that's the story of our present times, Peter.

[almoore]

Thanks for blowing my cover. I don't know about your masters but mine are terrified by the number of "reference" lenses that Leica are selling...

Here at Sony we're close to throwing in the towel. As Leica ramps up production of this surprisingly compact and affordable lens to the level where literally tens of them are reaching dealers every week, we realise we're unlikely to sell another 50.

 

This is the new age. This is the Leica SL age.

Edited March 22, 2017 by almoore

[geetee1972]

 

That will never happen unless you actually try it for yourself, then you can form a informed opinion that is only relevant to yourself.

 

You are right - I will find one and try it for myself.

 

 

Actual photographs are Facts, pure and simple, so they have become a minority population in this environment.

 

Turth, beauty and love. That's all the matters because it's all we have.

[LD_50]

An Internet forum post linking to a lens review certainly isn't a place to find photos. There are threads specifically for this, obviously.

 

As to the comparison to other brands and judgement of those who choose each, what a waste of time. I'm out of this discussion as it has no value to me and doesn't even relate to the thread topic.

[Mikeleica]

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I only came to this thread to see if I could find the actual specs of this lens ( still can not ), as I nearly spit out my coffee when I saw photos of it in a for sale ad on the Facebook Leica classifieds.

 

I hope the SL and this new "Bigly" 50mm lens do great for Leica. It's not my product though, I checked out the SL last year, felt like putting on a glove made out of Legos. 

[IkarusJohn]

Because they're typically bought by people who choose them for their status rather than their performance...

That applies to any high performance, luxury or performance product.

[geetee1972]

 

That applies to any high performance, luxury or performance product.

 

Certainly it does but I think up until recently that was less the case with Leica. Their image was more assocaited with art, documentary and expression. If that is in danger of being swamped by Russian oligarchs looking to hang them from the rear view mirror of their AMG G Waggon, then people will abandon the brand.

[IkarusJohn]

Certainly it does but I think up until recently that was less the case with Leica. Their image was more assocaited with art, documentary and expression. If that is in danger of being swamped by Russian oligarchs looking to hang them from the rear view mirror of their AMG G Waggon, then people will abandon the brand.

 

 

I do know what you mean.  My father had a 1975 BMW 525i - a fantastic car.  But when BMWs became the car of choice of real estate agents and the like, its brand did suffer.  I'm not so sure that the comparison is apposite (no, I'm not constructing a straw man).

 

Leica cameras have a very specific approach to photography which appeals to a very specific market sector (as you say).  Leica has always produced gold plated, Hermes, Titanium and other collectibles which have no appeal to the traditional Leica photographer - that's how they milk that last extra bit of turnover out of a camera.  I don't see the traditional Leica photographer abandoning the brand because they don't like some of the people buying their cameras.

 

Leica announced some time ago that they wanted to achieve 1% of market share.  They were never going to do that competing with the Japanese manufacturers on their own turf, or by selling to their loyal Leicaisti - the more oligarchs who have M10 cameras with Noctiluxes hanging from the rear view mirrors of the AMG wagons, the more profitable Leica will be, and the better for us.

 

Leica has been profitable since they were saved by the M9 (and ditching the R10).  That has meant they can produce cameras that others would never produce - the Monochrom, the M-D, the M-A, the M60 and M(262).  The Safari, Kravits and all the other fashion-statement cameras are of zero interest to me, save that they help Leica improve their bottom line.

 

If people want to buy Noctiluxes as ornaments, should we really worry?

[Chaemono]

Certainly it does but I think up until recently that was less the case with Leica. Their image was more assocaited with art, documentary and expression. If that is in danger of being swamped by Russian oligarchs looking to hang them from the rear view mirror of their AMG G Waggon, then people will abandon the brand.

 

Yes, that's a message that Leica and all potential Leica buyers should hear loud and clear. They are turning into a Russian oligarchs' brand. Couldn't have said it better. So stop making that SL50, Leica, darn it! 

[geetee1972]

 

If people want to buy Noctiluxes as ornaments, should we really worry?

 

 

No, we shouldn't. Very senisible post and I agree with your entirely.

[Donzo98]

On a happier note... I have a 50SL coming Hopefully I will have it on Friday...

 

Pics to follow...

[Chaemono]

You must be one of the last ones. People will start abandoning the brand soon as they see Russian oligarchs hanging those SL50s from their rear view mirrors.

[Joshua Lowe]

My oligarch friend Segei bought two SL50s that his third mistress (Olga Svetlana) wears as earrings.

[tom0511]

Because they're typically bought by people who choose them for their status rather than their performance. It's an indication of values; of what the person thinks is important. Is it truth, beauty and love (or goodness if you want to reference the original Greek transcendentals), or is it money, status and power?

 

It's not true in every instance of course and anyone who subscribes to the former would by definition give everyone the benefit of the doubt, but there are patterns you see in life (like how some groups typically have more priviledge than others or how we asign roles depending on gender) and the pattern of choosing the latter and ignoring the former is one of them.

 

All that said, I have not made a judgement on the 50SL, I'm only commenting based on what other people have said; it's a supposition that needs to be tested and I will be very happy to be proven wrong, i.e. that the AF performance on the 50SL does justify the price premium over the manual versions.

 

Why would I choose a Leica for status? It is rather the opposite, I choose it because it works well for me and I enjoy the excellent optical quality, the user interface, the build and the IQ.

In regards of status its not a great choice, you rather get questions, "why you spend so much money on a camera"

 

The fact that there are not millions of great images here...not everybody who has the hobby to play guitar is a great guitar player, and I assume it is the same for photography. But who cares, I think you dont have to be a great photographer to be allowed to use good gear.

[tom0511]

I do know what you mean.  My father had a 1975 BMW 525i - a fantastic car.  But when BMWs became the car of choice of real estate agents and the like, its brand did suffer.  I'm not so sure that the comparison is apposite (no, I'm not constructing a straw man).

 

Leica cameras have a very specific approach to photography which appeals to a very specific market sector (as you say).  Leica has always produced gold plated, Hermes, Titanium and other collectibles which have no appeal to the traditional Leica photographer - that's how they milk that last extra bit of turnover out of a camera.  I don't see the traditional Leica photographer abandoning the brand because they don't like some of the people buying their cameras.

 

Leica announced some time ago that they wanted to achieve 1% of market share.  They were never going to do that competing with the Japanese manufacturers on their own turf, or by selling to their loyal Leicaisti - the more oligarchs who have M10 cameras with Noctiluxes hanging from the rear view mirrors of the AMG wagons, the more profitable Leica will be, and the better for us.

 

Leica has been profitable since they were saved by the M9 (and ditching the R10).  That has meant they can produce cameras that others would never produce - the Monochrom, the M-D, the M-A, the M60 and M(262).  The Safari, Kravits and all the other fashion-statement cameras are of zero interest to me, save that they help Leica improve their bottom line.

 

If people want to buy Noctiluxes as ornaments, should we really worry?

 

I see it that way: As long as Leica can sell some limited editions to very rich people and therefore keep the price of the standard editions lets say 5% lower I am fine.

Leica has the snobby/luxury image anyways, so who cares.

One thing I do know, the 50SL is not just a luxury product, it is the best 50 I have used so far, maybe together with the 50 APO. I dont have to pixel peep to see this.

The impressing thing of the 50 SL is taht you can use t at f1.4 without getting this softy/creamy effekt you get with most other fast 50mm lenses.

And with the AF I can focus it faster and more precise than I ever good focus the 50/1.4 on the M.

[Peter Branch]

.......... And with the AF I can focus it faster and more precise than I ever good focus the 50/1.4 on the M.

 

For those of us brought up on "M" technology I think that that is one of the key lessons taught by using an SL .

AF, though not perfect, will, if carefully used, give a higher percentage of hits, particularly in fast changing situations, than any rangefinder.

The SL can also focus accurately and consistently at f/1.4 - it's not a lucky dip anymore - which, lets face it, it always was with the "M".

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[Peter Branch]

..............If people want to buy Noctiluxes as ornaments, should we really worry?

 

A few visits to Leica Mayfair will soon demonstrate that there are a significant number of Leica customers who will never interact with this forum.

 

I remember a middle aged man who just wanted "The Best" and bought an M240 with a Noctilux.

He had not the first idea how to use it, but one of the staff spent a long time patiently explaining the basics to him.

I've often wondered if he ever managed to take any worthwhile photographs.

 

On another occasion I encountered someone who was confused as to how to select between his 50mm lenses.

Two Noctilux, an Apo-Summicron and a Summilux ASPH.  Which should he use, where and when?

A classic case of options paralysis.  Incredible maybe but the staff were again very patient.

I'm still not convinced that he understood what he was being told

 

Then again a man came in to collect his M9 and three lenses which had been returned from Solms following their "Annual Service".

It became clear he really did send them all away every year and willingly paid the bill.

[thighslapper]

I find it hard to believe Leica is a status product when the general public ...... and the majority of even the camera buying public are totally ignorant of it as a camera brand.

 

In 10 years I've had 3 people comment on my camera - worldwide - and a few others obviously recognise it but have said nothing.

 

I can't think of anything less useful as bling. 

 

Peter ..... the Mayfair clientele are a breed apart .... in fact as you allude some appear to be a different species completely.

 

I 'bumped into' a Noctiux there a few years ago and said I would think about it. In the time I had wandered around Harvey Nicholls anguishing about my frivolous impulsive purchase and returned to the shop, an American had bought it on a whim ......plus 30,000 GBP worth of other lenses .... and expressed complete disinterest in claiming back the VAT. When a similar situation occurred 6 months later I grabbed it joking I didn't want that American bloke buying it before me again. Apparently he had been back in the previous week and spent another 30,000 on what appeared to be another random selection of gear. The staff were unfazed. This sort of thing happens regularly in a city where many have more money than they know what to do with. Merely well-off people like me are small fry. 

Edited March 23, 2017 by thighslapper