pop Posted January 3, 2017 Share #821 Posted January 3, 2017 Advertisement (gone after registration) If a person needs EVF, then he does not need a Leica M. . I am not quite as old as you are; however, carrying two or three camera systems on the same outing exceeds my carrying capacity. There was a reason for Oscar Barnack designing a small and portable camera. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted January 3, 2017 Posted January 3, 2017 Hi pop, Take a look here Leica M 10. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
ianman Posted January 3, 2017 Share #822 Posted January 3, 2017 So I had to go through pages of explaining and re-explaining in my usual long winded style, when you could have chimed in at any time with a clear and concise explanation of what I was talking about? Bizarrely, I seem to remember Tailwagger putting my own position in a very clear, brilliant way Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
lct Posted January 3, 2017 Share #823 Posted January 3, 2017 Old photographers have been using Visoflexes for studio, macro and telephoto since the fifties. I see no reason why younger ones could not do exactly the same in 2017 or later. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pgk Posted January 3, 2017 Share #824 Posted January 3, 2017 Right... I will remember that when you are trying to explain a simple and entirely open concept to someone and they refuse to understand what you mean, too! You mean like ..... 'dumb lenses' ..... ? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ianman Posted January 3, 2017 Share #825 Posted January 3, 2017 [insert popcorn emoji here] ( ) Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/266426-leica-m-10/?do=findComment&comment=3178362'>More sharing options...
pgk Posted January 3, 2017 Share #826 Posted January 3, 2017 If this thread tells us anything it is that Leica need two very different M models - a very basic model indeed (lose the Aperture Priority idea, and JPEGs and all the superfluous stuff that are irrelevant in REAL photography), and an all frills version which has lots of bolt on goodies, video, snapshot mode and all the other essential bits to make a camera versatile and really viable despite its technical limitations. And yes I am being (somewhat) tongue in cheek for those who don't realise this . But actually this is what this whole thread boils down to. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
imants Posted January 3, 2017 Share #827 Posted January 3, 2017 Advertisement (gone after registration) Old photographers have been using Visoflexes for studio, macro and telephoto since the fifties. I see no reason why younger ones could not do exactly the same in 2017 or later. Easier to use a remote tablet setup for studio work plus better results Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter H Posted January 3, 2017 Share #828 Posted January 3, 2017 If this thread tells us anything it is that Leica need two very different M models - a very basic model indeed (lose the Aperture Priority idea, and JPEGs and all the superfluous stuff that are irrelevant in REAL photography), and an all frills version which has lots of bolt on goodies, video, snapshot mode and all the other essential bits to make a camera versatile and really viable despite its technical limitations. And yes I am being (somewhat) tongue in cheek for those who don't realise this . But actually this is what this whole thread boils down to. No thanks. I've been advocating two Ms for ages, but neither should be as you describe the second version. If you could just get over your conviction that an EVF is somehow a "bell and/or whistle" that serious and experienced M photographers don't really need, we wouldn't have to go to such extremes. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jmahto Posted January 3, 2017 Share #829 Posted January 3, 2017 If this thread tells us anything it is that Leica need two very different M models - a very basic model indeed (lose the Aperture Priority idea, and JPEGs and all the superfluous stuff that are irrelevant in REAL photography), and an all frills version which has lots of bolt on goodies, video, snapshot mode and all the other essential bits to make a camera versatile and really viable despite its technical limitations. And yes I am being (somewhat) tongue in cheek for those who don't realise this . But actually this is what this whole thread boils down to. Highlight mine... not only two, there is room for many more models On a gradual scale: - Basic (and costliest) M: No A mode. No Auto ISO. No JPEG. No LCD. No Video. No EVF. No GPS. No WiFi. No Girlfriend: CODE: (000000000) - Next (little cheaper) M: Yes A mode. No Auto ISO. No JPEG. No LCD. No Video. No EVF. No GPS. No WiFi. No Girlfriend: CODE: (100000000) - Next (little cheaper) M: Yes A mode. Yes Auto ISO. No JPEG. No LCD. No Video. No EVF. No GPS. No WiFi. No Girlfriend: CODE: (110000000) - Next (little cheaper) M: Yes A mode. Yes Auto ISO. Yes JPEG. No LCD. No Video. No EVF. No GPS. No WiFi. No Girlfriend: CODE: (111000000) - Next (little cheaper) M: Yes A mode. Yes Auto ISO. Yes JPEG. Yes LCD. No Video. No EVF. No GPS. No WiFi. No Girlfriend: CODE: (111100000) - Next (little cheaper) M: Yes A mode. Yes Auto ISO. Yes JPEG. Yes LCD. Yes Video. No EVF. No GPS. No WiFi. No Girlfriend: CODE: (111110000) - Next (little cheaper) M: Yes A mode. Yes Auto ISO. Yes JPEG. Yes LCD. Yes Video. Yes EVF. No GPS. No WiFi. No Girlfriend: CODE: (111111000) - Next (little cheaper) M: Yes A mode. Yes Auto ISO. Yes JPEG. Yes LCD. Yes Video. Yes EVF. Yes GPS. No WiFi. No Girlfriend: CODE: (111111100) - Next (little cheaper) M: Yes A mode. Yes Auto ISO. Yes JPEG. Yes LCD. Yes Video. Yes EVF. Yes GPS. Yes WiFi. No Girlfriend: CODE: (111111110) - Next (Most popular) M: Yes A mode. Yes Auto ISO. Yes JPEG. Yes LCD. Yes Video. Yes EVF. Yes GPS. Yes WiFi. Yes Girlfriend: CODE: (111111111) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ianman Posted January 3, 2017 Share #830 Posted January 3, 2017 There was a reason for Oscar Barnack designing a small and portable camera. Exactly. I hope they built him a nice big coffin 'cos there must be a lot of spinning going on in there !! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter H Posted January 3, 2017 Share #831 Posted January 3, 2017 Exactly. I hope they built him a nice big coffin 'cos there must be a lot of spinning going on in there !! Why? Surely he'd be delighted that his basic design still generates this much interest and enthusiasm after all these years. And just because he lived many years ago doesn't mean he was a traditionalist who didn't like innovation. Quite the opposite, I expect. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pico Posted January 3, 2017 Share #832 Posted January 3, 2017 Leica need two very different M models - a very basic model indeed (lose the Aperture Priority ... [and one loaded to maximum hyper inflated features to blow the mind of an acute 12 year-old genius] Okay, minimizing and extrapolating are fun. What is not funny is that taking the median is worse than either. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ianman Posted January 3, 2017 Share #833 Posted January 3, 2017 Jayant, may I request you add a model for people with a sense of humour and another for people without a sense of humour. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter H Posted January 3, 2017 Share #834 Posted January 3, 2017 Jayant, may I request you add a model for people with a sense of humour and another for people without a sense of humour. oooooooh! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pgk Posted January 3, 2017 Share #835 Posted January 3, 2017 No thanks. I've been advocating two Ms for ages, but neither should be as you describe the second version. If you could just get over your conviction that an EVF is somehow a "bell and/or whistle" that serious and experienced M photographers don't really need, we wouldn't have to go to such extremes. My conviction is quite simply that an EVF fundamentally changes the concept of the M rangefinder. You may not appreciate this Peter but that is what it undoubtedly does. As I have repeatedly asked, why is it that nobody is requesting a rangefinder be built into the SL? Could it be that the SL doesn't need one? So why does a rangefinder camera need an EVF? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Printmaker Posted January 3, 2017 Share #836 Posted January 3, 2017 As I mentioned in an earlier post, I've put my name on a list for a M10. The camera will replace both my M9 and S2. I've also ordered an EVF for those occasions where I would use the S2 (macro, portraits, etc.). Makes sense to me. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter H Posted January 3, 2017 Share #837 Posted January 3, 2017 My conviction is quite simply that an EVF fundamentally changes the concept of the M rangefinder. You may not appreciate this Peter but that is what it undoubtedly does. As I have repeatedly asked, why is it that nobody is requesting a rangefinder be built into the SL? Could it be that the SL doesn't need one? So why does a rangefinder camera need an EVF? But we're talking about an accessory. Not something that changes the nature of the camera for those who don't want it changed. An add-on, like a half-case for example, which I consider to be a ridiculous ornament but which others enjoy, so they can have it and I can ignore it and we're all happy. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ianman Posted January 3, 2017 Share #838 Posted January 3, 2017 But we're talking about an accessory. Well some aren't. Some people are asking for a M with built-in EVF... but alongside the traditional (brilliant, fantastic, for real photographers <- humour) OVF model. I don't mind either but if they do go down the seperate OVF model (brilliant, fantastic..... <- humour), EVF model route, then I hope the real version reverts to CCD :-) Is there an emoji for can of worms ? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill Livingston Posted January 3, 2017 Share #839 Posted January 3, 2017 My conviction is quite simply that an EVF fundamentally changes the concept of the M rangefinder. You may not appreciate this Peter but that is what it undoubtedly does. As I have repeatedly asked, why is it that nobody is requesting a rangefinder be built into the SL? Could it be that the SL doesn't need one? So why does a rangefinder camera need an EVF? Then I, and quite a few others, strongly disagree... You seem to continue to present this as a single solution path forward. I would equally not want the M to become an EVF only camera... but I would want an EVF body as an option. And no, I don't use AF, JPG files, video or even have the screen on my M-P active... but I would not remove any of those because there are others out there who DO use them... and it costs me nothing to switch them off in the menu! Really? Would you force your views on all potential and current M users, believing yours is the One True Path? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter Kilmister Posted January 3, 2017 Share #840 Posted January 3, 2017 Aren't you all bored with this topic? 42 pages of speculation, argument, waffle, etc. Wait and see. One day "wait and see" will arrive. Just wait, just calm down .... please! Apprehension is worthless. Criticism of an unannounced product is futile. Criticism of an announced product is objective. Just wait. Then, at that moment, let fly! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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