Working Professionals

[CBM_Photo]

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Any other full time working Pro's out there using the SL? As much as I love the cameras I'm thinking of replacing them for several reasons related to working as a pro, rather than the cameras themselves. Let me explain. I use Profoto lighting on my studio, Capture One on the studio server and shoot tethered 90% of the time. The SL can tether to C1 (via LIS and Hot Folders), but it's clunky, tethering to Lightroom is direct, but I've found it unreliable. I can't use all the features of the profoto lights (HSS for example) because profoto doesn't (and won't) provide a dedicated trigger for the Leica as they do for Nikon, Cannon and now Sony. I asked, they blame Leica, Leica blames them, same BS I heard with capture one. Leica say the SL is targeted to working pro's but they haven't taken into account that we use an ecosystem of lights, triggers, software and workflows that Leica doesn't seem to understand or support. I'm thinking of moving to Nikon or even Phase One cameras and getting out of the Leica system, which will be sad, I love the SL and have a ton of money invested in it  (2 bodies, both zooms, SF64 speedlight and a lot of M glass) Anyone having the same thoughts?

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[tpf1952]

I'm a full time shooter and I divide my use of gear between the SL and the M240. I use both Lightroom and C1 and for a variety of reasons prefer C1. More experience using Lightroom for tethering but want to believe C1 should be less clunky tethered. I shoot multiple setups in different rooms when shooting tethered, and every time I have to reestablish the camera/laptop connection (Lightroom), things don't always work. Clients tap their toes/we sometimes give up on tethering.

 

Regardless, I like using the SL for this kind of work; mix SL with M lenses (wider or faster lenses or both). Use off camera flash with Pocket Wizard or other radio triggers. Manual focus with the joy stick is a "joy." Only gripe with using SL lenses in manual: wish the function button for focus checking was top right rather than lower left. Insane choice, Wetzlar!

 

For covering events, on-camera flash with Leica is a huge disappointment (former Nikon/Canon/Sony user). Even the new SF 64 is clunky. Sometimes the only way to make things works is to put the flash on manual and remember my distance.

 

Hope this helps.

 

Tom

[CBM_Photo]

I'm a full time shooter and I divide my use of gear between the SL and the M240. I use both Lightroom and C1 and for a variety of reasons prefer C1. More experience using Lightroom for tethering but want to believe C1 should be less clunky tethered. I shoot multiple setups in different rooms when shooting tethered, and every time I have to reestablish the camera/laptop connection (Lightroom), things don't always work. Clients tap their toes/we sometimes give up on tethering.

 

Regardless, I like using the SL for this kind of work; mix SL with M lenses (wider or faster lenses or both). Use off camera flash with Pocket Wizard or other radio triggers. Manual focus with the joy stick is a "joy." Only gripe with using SL lenses in manual: wish the function button for focus checking was top right rather than lower left. Insane choice, Wetzlar!

 

For covering events, on-camera flash with Leica is a huge disappointment (former Nikon/Canon/Sony user). Even the new SF 64 is clunky. Sometimes the only way to make things works is to put the flash on manual and remember my distance.

 

Hope this helps.

 

Tom

 

Problem with Capture One is that there is no dedicated tethering for the SL (or the S for that matter) C1 achieves tethering via Leica Image shuttle which places images in directory that C1 then automatically imports via a "hot folder" LR does have a tethering plug-in, but as we have both seen, it's unreliable. I raised this with Leica and they suggested the same workflow as C1, use LIS, and importing into LR via a folder that is set to "automatic" This works better, but is a 2 step process, so is SLOWWWW I shoot mainly in my studio so the lack of integration with e profoto lights is more of an issue. Bottom line is that Leica needs to build the ecosystem that nikon, cannon and sony has to be a serious contender in the pro world.. 

[tpf1952]

Totally agree. How a company can make such a marvelous product and drop the ball on flash/tethering boggles the mind. Best of luck with your decisions.

 

Tom

[douglas fry]

Yes I shoot professionally on an SL and M240, but have never used tethering, even when I was on Canon 1DX's its just one more variable to go wrong. If a client really wants to see the images then take an SD card out and use PhotoMechanic to download them. Its a method that never goes wrong, there are no surprises and the images are safe. What the client gets with SL or M240 is arguably better images, better colour etc so maybe just manage the clients expectations better and explain how you prefer to work?.

 

I use Pocket Wizard with the Elinchrom Quadra Ranger system and for me its flawless, and the cameras are robust and reliable. I dont use HSS however I shoot environmental portraits.

 

Perhaps look at PW's with your system?

 

Covering an event for me is fantastic with the M240 and a Nikon manual flash, focussing is easy and a slow (ish) shutter to retain some ambient with a pop of flash at about 1/64th seems to be my default at about every event. The trouble began when on Canon as it would assess every single exposure and make all the obvious errors, like a black guy in a dinner jacket with a dark background would come out over exposed for example. Shooting manually on the M means its correct every time.

 

So I suppose either (only as a suggestion) modify your workflow to stick with Leica, or switch to a PhaseOne which is designed to work with C1Pro

[tpf1952]

I too use PW with Elinchrom Quadra Ranger; no complaints there. Likewise, I share your experience with Nikon flash. Been using an old SB-24 in manual mode with the M240: no surprises. But still, on-camera flash with the SL: auto options should work better; much better. Recycling times of the SF 64 are nothing to write home about. Thought about getting the Metz power pack, but identifying the right cable and locating an online dealer that sells the power pack for the SF 64 is a hunt. 

[CBM_Photo]

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Yes I shoot professionally on an SL and M240, but have never used tethering, even when I was on Canon 1DX's its just one more variable to go wrong. If a client really wants to see the images then take an SD card out and use PhotoMechanic to download them. Its a method that never goes wrong, there are no surprises and the images are safe. What the client gets with SL or M240 is arguably better images, better colour etc so maybe just manage the clients expectations better and explain how you prefer to work?.

 

I use Pocket Wizard with the Elinchrom Quadra Ranger system and for me its flawless, and the cameras are robust and reliable. I dont use HSS however I shoot environmental portraits.

 

Perhaps look at PW's with your system?

 

Covering an event for me is fantastic with the M240 and a Nikon manual flash, focussing is easy and a slow (ish) shutter to retain some ambient with a pop of flash at about 1/64th seems to be my default at about every event. The trouble began when on Canon as it would assess every single exposure and make all the obvious errors, like a black guy in a dinner jacket with a dark background would come out over exposed for example. Shooting manually on the M means its correct every time.

 

So I suppose either (only as a suggestion) modify your workflow to stick with Leica, or switch to a PhaseOne which is designed to work with C1Pro

 

Actually C1 is the thing I would ditch first, it's the cheapest piece of the puzzle. A few weeks ago, I did a shoot with another guy here in LA and he had the PhaseOne XF100 (awesome, awesome, but a second mortgage needed!) which has the profoto remote control in the camera, no need for a trigger, it was tethered to C1 with the profoto control module software, so he could look at the screen, adjust the light by clicking on the image, and he could control the camera as well, all from within C1! This is a complete closed loop system and the thing I wish Leica would do with these other vendors. I have to say if you ask profoto or broncolor or anyone else about working with Leica, they will tell you, Leica are a law unto themselves as far as support for other systems go...a bit like apple I guess

[FlashGordonPhotography]

Another full time working photographer here. Mostly Architecture and real estate and commercial portraits which are mostly shot on location, which often leads to other work for annual reports and brochures. I also shoot about a dozen wedding a year (I shot 50+ a year for over a decade). And I am a commercially licenced drone pilot which is new. Many photographers prefer to specialise and I did when shooting weddings. However I'm enjoying being a generalist and as I'm over an hour from Sydney being a generalist gets me more work.

 

I shoot using more than one system. I shoot the majority of my work on the SL. However I also shoot with the M and S systems (S is also new to me) as well as some Sony and Pentax. I've also shot extensively with Canon, Olympus and Fujifilm. I'm known for trying new things so often a conversation will start with, "I was wondering if it was possible....". As a result I tend to have a fairly large gear inventory compared to most. But the majority does get used on a semi regular basis.

 

Based on my specific needs the SL is now my preferred camera. When I bought it I nearly returned it and was quite vocal about its shortcomings. Based on two things my opinion has changed. First was firmware 2.0. Second was the Novoflex adaptor. That allowed me to use my Canon TS lenses on the SL. The SL is the best platform I've used for those lenses. Very occasionally I still need the extra resolution of the Sony but 90% of my work with those lenses is on the SL.

 

I actually prefer Lightroom to C1, although I have both. I have my settings dialled in to where I want them now so I find the workflow extremely efficient. Because my portrait work is mostly on location with limited time I don't tend to need tethering. I do have a small studio as well and I'm looking at how tethering might work there into the future but it will still be a smaller part of my day. I've dabbled with LIS and Lightroom tethering. It'd be nice to have it work but for now, for me, it's not essential. Capture One has never been generous in camera support. Neither my S or Pentax are supported because Phase think I'll drop 100K just to use C1. I won't. I also much prefer Lightroom's catalogue and organisational system to the bolted on C1 version.

 

I use flash extensively and lately I've been introducing LEDs for some jobs. I use both TTL on camera and Elinchrom and Godox portable units. The Elinchroms and Godox units work brilliantly. I hardly ever use HSS with manual flash. It'd be nice to see an Elinchrom HS transmitter but I don't see it happening. That market is just so small I don't see them putting in the effort. It's more likely that one of the Chinese brands like Cheetah will get something that works for HSS. But I've been working this way for so long I can just keep going. I am planning to try a couple of CS lenses for the S though if I can find some time. I might have to fly to Melbourne as that's where Leica is based and I don't see any of the dealers carrying CS lenses.

 

In TTL I have the SF64, 58 and 40. Since f.w.2.0 I have no real issues with it. My flashes work reliably and consistently. I have the BR button mapped to FEC and it works fine with the SF64. I also have a cheap eBay TTL cable (Nikon type) and that works fine and supports all functions when I need a TTL flash a couple of meters off camera. I do think Leica should be making their flash protocols open and available. It's just a good thing to do for Leica.

 

I absolutely agree that the magnify button is in the wrong spot. The Canon TS lenses are manual focus but the camera treats them as AF which means I can't use the joystick to magnify. I'd also like to see the EVF behaviour changed so it's independently adjustable. I'd fail to see how, in M mode, when exposure preview is disabled with a TTL flash, that anyone at Leica thought that was a good idea. Has no one at Leica ever balanced a background exposure with TTL flash fill??

 

My other big issue is compulsory LENR. I do work where people can't be recognisable in a scene. And the easiest way is a tripod and long exposures. Shooting a hundred 5 second shots and having to wait for 5 seconds a hundred times is a total PITA. The S is worse with LENR AND a maximum time of 60 seconds!!

 

Mostly though I'm finding the SL the perfect tool for my needs. Flawless, definitely not. Would I like to firmware fixes and better accessory support? Absolutely. But I have no deal breakers. However, I am quite happy to pull out my A7R2 when it's required. But that's not often.

 

Gordon

[rriley]

Let me explain. I use Profoto lighting on my studio, Capture One on the studio server and shoot tethered 90% of the time. The SL can tether to C1 (via LIS and Hot Folders), but it's clunky, tethering to Lightroom is direct, but I've found it unreliable. I can't use all the features of the Profoto lights (HSS for example) because profoto doesn't (and won't) provide a dedicated trigger for the Leica as they do for Nikon, Cannon and now Sony. I asked, they blame Leica, Leica blames them, same BS I heard with capture one. Leica say the SL is targeted to working pro's but they haven't taken into account that we use an ecosystem of lights, triggers, software and workflows that Leica doesn't seem to understand or support. I'm thinking of moving to Nikon or even Phase One cameras and getting out of the Leica system, which will be sad, I love the SL and have a ton of money invested in it  (2 bodies, both zooms, SF64 speedlight and a lot of M glass) Anyone having the same thoughts?

 

I also have an SL: love the finder and the lenses but I agree with you regarding the compatibility issues and I recently bought a Phase One.  The built in interface with Profoto and the tethered functionality of Capture One really make a difference when compared to the lack of both features in the SL and the Phase One captures are just fantastic.  I have kept the SL but did sell the M and R lenses that supplemented the zooms and I am giving some consideration to just going ahead and selling the SL too.  I have a Q and the Phase One and they may well prove to serve all my needs.

[Ingo]

I use my XF/IQ250 for tethered shoots in the studio and headshots on location and the SL on the road/weddings/events. I would like to replace the P1 with the SL. The image quality is sufficient and good enough for my needs. But the workflow with the P1 is a dream..

[Vieri]

Another full time shooter here - I do landscape with the SL and the S (007), so no tethering problems here. Happy camper, the SL is great (even if a higher resolution SL to complement it would be even better) and so is the S, but there are things I'd like to see fixed in FW with both cameras; the most important for me would be real long exposure in the S. One minute, IMO, is not long exposure, is medium exposure at best.

 

Best,

 

Vieri

[R3D-D0T]

Another full time shooter here - I do landscape with the SL and the S (007), so no tethering problems here. Happy camper, the SL is great (even if a higher resolution SL to complement it would be even better) and so is the S, but there are things I'd like to see fixed in FW with both cameras; the most important for me would be real long exposure in the S. One minute, IMO, is not long exposure, is medium exposure at best.

 

Best,

 

Vieri

 

If you already have an S and primarily do landscapes, why use the SL?

[Vieri]

If you already have an S and primarily do landscapes, why use the SL?

 

 

The SL with adapters for both S and M lenses allows me to have:

 

- A backup body;

- Extra focal lengths (using S lenses on the SL);

- Wide and ultra-wide angle lenses when needed (10 and 15mm Voigtlander);

- "Real" long exposures when needed (SL goes up to 30 minutes, the S just one minute).

 

Best,

 

Vieri

[orc999]

I shoot pro and I understand your issues.

So far I like the results and I invested a lot too.

Main benefit are the M lenses, as they are very light to travel.

 

The original USB cable from Leica makes a big difference.

Other cables that I did you use with the 645z and Canon without problems just don't work stable.

 

I hate to say that but as a pro if you want to go the easy way: Canon.

They have service centers everywhere(and fix stuff), 3rd party support on almost all products(HSS,TTL,...and from beginning). LR/C1 just works. Tethering is stable.

If things go really bad and you break something most shops carry a Canon body and/or lenses(comparably cheap) if you need one quick.

 

But then most Canon lenses are not sharp on the 5dsr and focus is not super precise in that resolution, while manual focus aid is not really good(unless you like to use life view for macro work). Thats probably they had to come up with that new focus feature.

[Ingo]

Tethering with the SL is still not 100% stable.
Somebody in this forum told me that it helps if you remove the SD cards but I haven't checked this yet.

[caissa]

Using WiFi and the SL app is very stable. (iOS or Android)

[Ingo]

Using WiFi and the SL app is very stable. (iOS or Android)

 

Yes, I agree. But this is a different story. Currently the focus on the app is just to control the SL remotly. I had a talk with Leica and they told me that they intend to add a pure 'show me the pictures' function in one of the next updates. Then it comes closer to the functionality of Capture Pilot.

[orc999]

Tethering with the SL is still not 100% stable.

Somebody in this forum told me that it helps if you remove the SD cards but I haven't checked this yet.

true, I removed the SD cards one time, simply because it would not shoot anymore and complain about not being able to write to the sd cards.(I have latest Sandisks). And make sure you have the original Leica USB cable(....while USB being a standard, but then apple manages to be super successul being the only phone company not doing the micro USB port)

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[dancook]

I would like to get the Leica SL and use it for wedding work, but it's 'only' semi-professional second shooting. I'd replace my D750 with it.

[FlashGordonPhotography]

I would like to get the Leica SL and use it for wedding work, but it's 'only' semi-professional second shooting. I'd replace my D750 with it.

You'll be pleased. The SL is ideal for weddings, although more lenses is always welcome. The zooms are stellar and the Noctilux is absolutely great on the SL. I use either the Zeiss 100MP or the S 120 APO for a macro solution and I'll probably use the new Sigma Art for a wide zoom (I'm using the WATE at the moment). The extra reach of the zooms is really appreciated and they're designed so that in the rare cases where AF won't go, manual focus is a breeze.

 

At the moment I'm using the zooms when I need the speed of AF and MF primes for the portraits. I'm really looking forward to the 50mm. And possibly the 90mm, next year, although I'm so happy with the IQ of the S 120mm I may not bother with the 90mm.

 

The other thing is how quiet the camera is, even with the normal shutter. It's a joy.

 

TTL flash is on camera only but you can use a Nikon cable to get a short off camera solution. I tend to move to manual flash anyway off camera so I use Godox units, which work perfectly.

 

Gordon