Five new Leica SL lenses to be announced

[Guest VVJ]

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I like the SL body and the zooms, but to make it a complete system Leica should hurry up with some more primes IMO.

 

This timeline is a pretty huge disappointment.  Unfortunately I have no other words...

 

Leica must be the only company in the world that needs 2.5 years to bring a standard focal length like 35mm to the market...

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[steppenw0lf]

Weather resistant, and Including a lens road map.

 

Jeff

 

I do not like Fuji, but I like their lens setup. It has many of the lenses that Leica is not offering, yet.

Unfortunately it's another new line, again with an entry price of about 10k - where do all the future customers come from ...

 

And Fuji has a widest lens of about 18mm (Hasselblad one of 23mm) - according to some specialists this is therefore an incomplete system, what a shame !   

[jrp]

Well there are plenty of medium format-based businesses that now have a bigger choice and may well be tempted to go with the quality and price.  (The short flange distance means that it should be easier to design lenses that perform well to the edges.)

 

The lenses will be in the same price ball-park as SL lenses.  If you are shooting in the studio, there is now little reason to go with the SL (smaller, lower-res sensor, fewer lenses, price).  But I imagine that it is the S that will face the brunt of the competition.

 

The new Hasselblad is also a threat, as it is also of comparable price and is more compact than the Fuji, since it lacks an internal shutter.  In turn, however, it has a much more restricted range of lenses.

 

Nevertheless, the SL is best for outdoor, hand held, use. (Can a 50Mpx sensor be fully exploited hand held?)  It can go 24-280mm natively, and be supplemented by lenses that go down to 10mm or up to 800mm, if you need them and are prepared to use a convertor (ie, are not shooting anything that moves).  

[steppenw0lf]

Leica has very demanding customers, with very special wishes. So whatever they announce, it will always be a bitter disappointment for about three quarters of them.

First if the lenses are not what you want, be glad, you save a lot of money. Second if there is a lens that you like, you are really in trouble, because it will take a long time before you can get it. Good thing, you have a lot of time to save your pennies for it.

 

In the end the situation of SL customers is more or less the same as the situation of a user of Sony gear 3 years ago. Strange enough I have the impression that the reactions are different: Sony users started adapting other lenses, did little complaining and the camera was a big success - to users and to Sony.

Let's see if the SL users are just as clever and can do the same. 

[Vieri]

...

 

And Fuji has a widest lens of about 18mm (Hasselblad one of 23mm) - according to some specialists this is therefore an incomplete system, what a shame !   

 

 

In your rush to poke fun at me, you seemed to forget that the Fuji you are talking about is Medium Format, while the SL is 35mm. As well, you might not know that 18mm FOV equivalent is the widest offer of every MF manufacturer on the market so far, so the Fuji situation is actually the exact opposite of what you are trying to say: Fuji is actually the most complete MF system on the wide end 

 

If you look around at other 35mm FF manufacturer, on the other hand, you'll see that every single of them offer wider than 16mm, hence my position: if your offer is limited to 16mm on the wide end, your system is incomplete. Same thing if your system doesn't go longer than 280mm. Mind you, incomplete doesn't mean that the lenses on offer are bad, there is absolutely no relation between the two. The SL is a new camera, and so it is in the cards that the system is incomplete at launch, and that it may stay that way for quite some time. As other posters here noted, Leica seems to be slower than others in getting out a complete line-up; this may or may not be a problem for your work, but it doesn't change the fact that the system is, at present, incomplete. As well, the fact that you can use other brand's lenses to fill the gaps (and I do, using Voigtlander for 10, 12 and 15mm) doesn't change the fact that the system is, at present, incomplete. No matter how much fun you try and poke at people thinking differently than you.

 

Best,

 

Vieri

[Guest VVJ]

The SL is a new camera, and so it is in the cards that the system is incomplete at launch, and that it may stay that way for quite some time. As other posters here noted, Leica seems to be slower than others in getting out a complete line-up; this may or may not be a problem for your work, but it doesn't change the fact that the system is, at present, incomplete. As well, the fact that you can use other brand's lenses to fill the gaps (and I do, using Voigtlander for 10, 12 and 15mm) doesn't change the fact that the system is, at present, incomplete. 

 

 

Amen!

[Jeff S]

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Before I can even think about the lens lineup of a particular system (which is very important), I need to determine if I get along with the VF (viewing and focusing) experience.  That's a deal breaker for me, with any system.  I've always preferred a stellar OVF; the SL presents the first EVF that I find 'tolerable', but still not not my ideal.  

 

I was underwhelmed by the X1D VF at the demo I attended in June, but admittedly that was a prototype not ready for prime time.  I hope the Fuji VF excels.

 

Jeff

[steppenw0lf]

Every system is at the beginning incomplete. But the SL system allows the completion with "foreign" gear unlike most other systems.

So the situation at the wide end is very comfortable. Many lenses, even with AF (Canon 11-24) and IS not being crucial.

Additionally, using stacking, angles much wider than any optical system can offer and at higher resolutions are also available.

 

At the other end - the missing large teles for wildlife, with OIS or a built-in IS - the situation is much worse and the system is REALLY incomplete compared to competitors. So stop complaining on a high level, while you have many options to continue your work.

 

Photographers depending upon tele-lenses are not so often complaining - they have probably given up (like Doug Herr) and wait for a next generation of cameras/lenses.

As usual the person in a slightly uncomfortable situation complains a lot - while the person in a really difficult situation simply is quiet and tries to find a solution to go on for a while.

 

It looks as if you are simply used to having a big collection of lenses, as the M system is there since many decades. Even this system was never as richly equipped as during the last decade - with the additional lenses from Zeiss and Voigtlaender. So this system is at the Zenith of its dissemination. And has therefore a different problem, the problem to keep this state.

The SL system is in a completely different place in its life cycle - still far from its Zenith. But it can easily attach to the M system, which hopefully helps it to get a smooth start. Sony for example took several years for a decent lens collection, and succeeded mainly/to a fair degree because of its collaboration with Zeiss. So Sony probably made the better collaborations than Leica, but this is easy if you are a giant (Zeiss is no match and no danger to Sony) and everybody is willing to cooperate with you.

 

Summary: UWA stops at 24mm on paper, at 16mm with M, at 15mm with R and is quite all right, even without addition of Nikon or Canon options. And down to 10mm with Voigtl - much wider than most MF cameras will ever offer. Many will never need anything shorter than 15mm. (Actually many amateurs will never need anything shorter than 24mm or max. 20mm.)

Tele is high class (90-280) but relatively poor as it stops at 280mm. Of course R can be attached, but without OIS or IBIS this is no match for professional users. The competition is far away (just think of the Leica for Pana 100-400 OIS lens which is equivalent to 200-800 and can be used handheld. If the pana cameras get closer in resolution, this is a big temptation - even if the lens is not as perfect as FF Leica standards.) 

A 1.4x or 1.7x extender could improve the situation if it allows AF and OIS, but the competition has still a lot more.

 

Sp let's complain and state as often as possible that a system is incomplete without one or more extenders for the tele lenses. (and therefore stops at 280mm)   

 

P.S: Regarding missing lenses: A simple (some call it boring) 2/28 is probably missing in many a pros collection. Probably in more bags than a 12 or 15mm will ever be. But of course there are splendid M lenses to stand in for a while.

[Vieri]

... So stop complaining on a high level, while you have many options to continue your work.

 

...

 

Sp let's complain and state as often as possible that a system is incomplete without one or more extenders for the tele lenses. (and therefore stops at 280mm)   

 

 

 

I don't recall complaining, at all. I just pointed out that the SL needs a native ultra-wide angle option, and a longer tele option as well of course (but it all started from discussing the 16-35, hence my not mentioning a tele), to be considered complete. And this is where I stand, period. The fact that you can use R lenses or other manufacturer's lenses is as valid for the long end as it is for the ultra-wide end, and doesn't solve the issue. As I said, this has nothing to do with being able to work or not, or with the quality of the current native lens offering. A simple reason to want a native SL ultra-wide is to have AF and weather sealing, for instance. A better one is to have Leica quality glass. And so on...

 

In short, once more. A system to be considered complete needs, IMHO, native ultra-wide and long lenses. The SL doesn't have them yet. Therefore, the SL system is - at the moment - incomplete. As I said before, we are talking of a very new system, so I am sure that Leica will develop it in time. I hope it will be sooner than later, but then again (as other have noted) Leica is not the fastest when it comes to new releases.

 

 

You mention the lack of extenders and tele lenses, probably because you need them for your work; makes lot of sense, and I appreciate and respect that. I mention the lack of ultra-wide because I need them for my work: it makes as much sense, and perhaps you might appreciate and respect that other photographers' needs are different than yours. The world is beautiful because it's different

 

Best,

 

Vieri

[wlaidlaw]

None of the SL lenses are of interest to me at the moment, as just spent this half year's lens budget on a mint 1999 11619 Special Edition Chrome Type 5 Summicron with LTM mount. 

 

Wilson

 

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[FlashGordonPhotography]

Well there's good new for me. I have saved a ton of money because I have absolutely no interest in any of this (except the 50mm I was always planning for).

 

The 16-35 does nothing except AF that my WATE doesn't do and I save on size and focal length overlap. There would have been trouble if it had been a 12-24. Had the 90mm been an 85mm 1.4 I would have been gone for all money but for now either the 90-280 is only a stop slower or I can use my 100 Makro Planar. 35 and 75 are focal lengths that I own in other cameras and hardly ever use.

 

If I get the urge I can use a Canon 11-24 and 85L. Probably for the price of the Leica wide zoom with change as well.

 

A good day for my wallet...... Except for the Fuji announcement. Or a S007? Hmmmm.....

 

Gordon

[Jeff S]

 

The 16-35 does nothing except AF that my WATE doesn't do and I save on size and focal length overlap.

 

And weather sealing.

 

Jeff

[LocalHero1953]

And weather sealing.

 

Jeff

Indeed. I feel a bit embarrassed in finding this to be the main feature of the SL lenses (the wide zoom to be truthful) that I find attractive. It has no bearing on IQ or handling compared to, say, the WATE. OTOH, the weather sealing of the SL system can be immensely liberating for outdoor photography - I have spent an afternoon in the pouring rain in the UK Peak District that I wouldn't have struggled with with the M.

[Jeff S]

Indeed. I feel a bit embarrassed in finding this to be the main feature of the SL lenses (the wide zoom to be truthful) that I find attractive. It has no bearing on IQ or handling compared to, say, the WATE. OTOH, the weather sealing of the SL system can be immensely liberating for outdoor photography - I have spent an afternoon in the pouring rain in the UK Peak District that I wouldn't have struggled with with the M.

 

I'm looking for a system (camera and lenses) to complement my M, including outdoor and landscape applications, and won't consider one without weather sealing.  IQ doesn't happen without an image to start.  For me, it's a key assessment criteria along with other considerations, starting with the VF experience.

 

Jeff