Leica SL Prices

[rriley]

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I understand that the  Leica SL price in Hong Kong is the US equivalent of $5,250 at current exchange rates.  

 

Why pay $7,450 at US stores with a price differential this large?

 

Yes, I know there can be fulfillment issues, payment issues and warranty issues HK vs USA but, still, that is quite a large price difference.

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[Jeff S]

I prefer to stick with known, reputable US dealers that will immediately handle any sales or service issues.  Warranties don't substitute for customer service.  And, even when dealing with Leica, it's nice to have a dealer advocate.

 

Plus, I wouldn't be so sure that there weren't any additional import or related fees that would close the price gap.

 

I'd also wonder about issues if and when I wanted to offer the gear for sale or trade....especially if there were service issues along the way.

 

All that said, if there's a Leica Store there that others here have used with success, that might at least warrant more consideration.

 

Jeff

[ramarren]

I buy my Leica gear from one of two dealers I've done business with for the past 25+ years. I'd rather keep them in business by remaining their customer, rather than just going to the cheapest vendor possible halfway around the world from here.

 

Yes, even if it costs me a fair bit more. 

[adamdewilde]

This is bullshit.. I got into a long debate with the CEO and other relevant management. Bottom line the company doesn't give a shit about us. It's a cash grab.

 

I knew this was going to happen. As it's been this way with ALL Leica gear, including the S-system. I asked Leica if they sorted out the issues in pricing. I was told that the SL would be fixed in it's pricing +/- a few hundred in exchange rate fluctuations worldwide. Low and behold, I end up paying $5,000 USD more for my SL+Zoom then I should have.

 

Leica's response is to give me a slight discount on SL gear. This slight discount doesn't even equal the prices I can get from my dealer with the "generous" discount (the CEOs words not mine) Leica was offering me.

 

Really these guys are just in it for the cash grab. No customer loyalty whatsoever.. And I've spent well over $100,000 on gear from them. So now I'm in the process of unloading all my Leica gear. They don't want loyal working professionals as customers, they want collectors who toss money at them, and then never bother them with repairs etc. 

 

 

This is me not evening bringing up the issues I've had with their gear and repair times etc. 

 

(For the record, I'd also like to support my "local" Singapore dealer, but a $200 flight to my very nice dealer in HK who also has a wife and kids to support is fine by me. Especially considering the savings are in the THOUSANDS.)

[adamdewilde]

I understand that the  Leica SL price in Hong Kong is the US equivalent of $5,250 at current exchange rates.  

 

Why pay $7,450 at US stores with a price differential this large?

 

Yes, I know there can be fulfillment issues, payment issues and warranty issues HK vs USA but, still, that is quite a large price difference.

 

No warranty issues BTW. And no fulfilment issues if you buy from the right people. 

[sillbeers15]

I cannot agree more. Our relationship with Leica is like customers to a prostitude. 'Pay, get what you want and don't return to bother me' and I agree that I am the sucker who lust for Leica stuff.

 

This is bullshit.. I got into a long debate with the CEO and other relevant management. Bottom line the company doesn't give a shit about us. It's a cash grab.

 

I knew this was going to happen. As it's been this way with ALL Leica gear, including the S-system. I asked Leica if they sorted out the issues in pricing. I was told that the SL would be fixed in it's pricing +/- a few hundred in exchange rate fluctuations worldwide. Low and behold, I end up paying $5,000 USD more for my SL+Zoom then I should have.

 

Leica's response is to give me a slight discount on SL gear. This slight discount doesn't even equal the prices I can get from my dealer with the "generous" discount (the CEOs words not mine) Leica was offering me.

 

Really these guys are just in it for the cash grab. No customer loyalty whatsoever.. And I've spent well over $100,000 on gear from them. So now I'm in the process of unloading all my Leica gear. They don't want loyal working professionals as customers, they want collectors who toss money at them, and then never bother them with repairs etc. 

 

 

This is me not evening bringing up the issues I've had with their gear and repair times etc. 

 

(For the record, I'd also like to support my "local" Singapore dealer, but a $200 flight to my very nice dealer in HK who also has a wife and kids to support is fine by me. Especially considering the savings are in the THOUSANDS.)

[Sandokan]

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I didnt believe it so I checked.  A dealer in HK, is offering HK$72'800 for the SL plus 24-90 lens. About US$9400. So a few thousand cheaper than BH Photo. I do not know how legitimate it is?

 

Well, too bad. I bought it from a known and friendly dealer with whom I have a good relationship. What is that worth?

 

Do you in Singapore, like some other territories like the Middle East have a poor service from your dealers? 

 

Anyway, we all know that Leica have a huge markup on the cost of production to the price they charge dealers. How much markup do the dealers charge? So if the HK dealers want to act like a warehouse and markup by a small percentage, where do you think they are cutting costs?

[sillbeers15]

I didnt believe it so I checked.  A dealer in HK, is offering HK$72'800 for the SL plus 24-90 lens. About US$9400. So a few thousand cheaper than BH Photo. I do not know how legitimate it is?

 

Well, too bad. I bought it from a known and friendly dealer with whom I have a good relationship. What is that worth?

 

Do you in Singapore, like some other territories like the Middle East have a poor service from your dealers? 

 

Anyway, we all know that Leica have a huge markup on the cost of production to the price they charge dealers. How much markup do the dealers charge? So if the HK dealers want to act like a warehouse and markup by a small percentage, where do you think they are cutting costs?

Leica covers international warranty. In Singapore, all repairs can only be performed by factory in Germany. Perhaps the only difference is freight cost, a small price to risk against an attractive savings for non Pros. My experience purchasing from both did not differentiate the value they provide. 

[fcomarin69]

Here in Singapore I can't complaint. Before Sales and After Sales have been great. 1)They don't try to sell me something I don't need. 2) They always responsive if is a problem on any of my equipment. (They did a very good customer service with my Leica T, and so far my  SL is behaving great) The price I paid in SG for the SL was just few hundred more than the US price in B&H (Around 4 or 5 hundred).

[rriley]

 

Anyway, we all know that Leica have a huge markup on the cost of production to the price they charge dealers. How much markup do the dealers charge? So if the HK dealers want to act like a warehouse and markup by a small percentage, where do you think they are cutting costs?

 

I think that Leica USA sets the retail prices for it's marketing area.

[Belle123]

It costs what it costs.  If I want to save a little, I look for Leica gear in secondary markets and have had excellent luck except for one lens.  Usually buy cameras new from good dealers in case get a lemon.  I don't belly ache and blame and trash Leica if I don't want to spend the money.  I cherish the gear I have.  And so far, in twenty years, never needed service.  Maybe I am just lucky.

[albertknappmd]

I always buy from a reputable dealer as the likelihood of an "issue" on a body or lens while small is readily addressed by the reputable dealer. It iw worth the extra expense...

Albert     

[adamdewilde]

I always buy from a reputable dealer as the likelihood of an "issue" on a body or lens while small is readily addressed by the reputable dealer. It iw worth the extra expense...

Albert     

 

 

Yeah, I've bought tons of Leica gear from reputable dealers in all over the world (I travel a lot, and have a few homes). Most dealers are terrible, not because they want to be, but because Leica forces their hand with poor customer service.

 

I've had a few conversations with big dealers (I can't mention who). But they've complained to me about Germany. Basically Leica CS is so bad, it's making some dealers loose customers.

 

I've seen this first hand with my own gear. And the way they've treated me. And I have quite a few friends who have strayed from Leica or are in the process of getting rid of their gear. Kinda like myself. 

 

To many problems to bother keeping my Leica gear.

[ramarren]

I don't quite understand why you would continue to buy Leica gear in the first place if you have had many problems with it, poor customer service, have problems with the pricing, etc. Why put yourself through all that misery and then spend post after post complaining about it? 

 

Personally, I've had very few problems with any Leica gear I've bought over the past half century. When I have, Leica Customer Service has taken care of it for me without any issues, and promptly. The prices are what they are ... If I value the gear that much, I pay the price.

 

So I'm a satisfied customer. Sorry to hear that you are not. 

[Stuart Richardson]

Leica has also treated me wonderfully. I mostly deal directly with Leica Germany directly, and I have been there in person on one occasion. I have had a number of different issues in the past, but I have had this in most systems where I have a lot of equipment. This goes with the territory for professional photographers or even very diligent amateurs. Every problem has been acknowledged, addressed and solved. Some have taken some time, but since being on their professional program, I have been offered replacement gear when needed, though I seldom take advantage of the offer since I am in Iceland and need to pay customs on anything coming in...not fun on an S body, even if I get it back when it is returned. 

 

I even got a very nice message from the customer service representative I usually dealt with when he retired, and I can assure you I have never received a similar contact from Sony or Nikon! 

 

In any case, experiences differ of course, and it is too bad that yours has not been good. 

 

As for the thread topic, I think the main issue is one of currency and market management. For a very long time the US prices were among the lowest, as taxes on cameras are almost nonexistent in comparison to countries with VAT. Add 19-25% VAT on top of an already expensive camera and prices get even more extremely out of control. A lot of European photographers decided it was simpler just to buy the cameras and lenses in the US or Hong Kong, and as such, European dealers were losing a lot of sales. 

 

I think that Leica decided very clearly that they wanted to focus on creating a market where people bought only from their local dealers, which they were rapidly converting into Leica stores. In order to achieve this in Europe, they changed the structure so that the pricing of cameras would be the same around the world, including the VAT. So if you were a Norwegian buying a camera in Norway, the price would be the same as what it would cost an American buying in the US. The trick, however, is that an American buying in Norway would be able to get the body for 24% under the cost, as Norway has a large VAT. The other trick is that companies and professionals can reclaim their VAT, so they wind up paying a lot less than US photographers...at least at the moment. I think there are also some currency issues, as the dollar is strong versus the euro and especially the pound, so that adds to the problem, since a lot of the prices were initially set when the currencies were more balanced. I can't speak to Hong Kong, but I think that is what is going on in Europe at least.  

[adamdewilde]

I don't quite understand why you would continue to buy Leica gear in the first place if you have had many problems with it, poor customer service, have problems with the pricing, etc. Why put yourself through all that misery and then spend post after post complaining about it? 

 

Personally, I've had very few problems with any Leica gear I've bought over the past half century. When I have, Leica Customer Service has taken care of it for me without any issues, and promptly. The prices are what they are ... If I value the gear that much, I pay the price.

 

So I'm a satisfied customer. Sorry to hear that you are not. 

 

 

Honestly, it's obvious. The lenses are good. The rendering is nice. I have no problems with the products. I just have problems with the customer service and repair times. And the morals and ethics of the people running the company.

 

Shit if I had a billion dollars I'd buy Leica and run it, profitable or not, just so I could continue to use great glass. 

But as a working professional, I can't indorse Leica. And until they shape up, I won't use them professionally, or at all if I can sell all my Leica gear.

 

The reason I waste my time posting is because there is so much of either A) fanboyness where Leica can't do any wrong. People who can't afford/don't understand the brand and just bash it because they've not used it. My perspective is unique, and I feel the need to share it if the conversation comes within my field of view.

 

I also suspect that by sheer volume of gear that has passed through my hands, I've had more problems then you. Though also on the flip side, I've had very little problems with Canon, Fuji (no problems yet) and Nikon. And when I do have a Canon problem, they fix it in one to two hours. Latest the next day. Also I would like to note that Leica is opening tons of stores (4 in my little city/state/country), and they have a "repair center" here. But they can't/don't fix anything. These guys sit on their thumbs. So if I want something simple done I have to go pay some local lens repair man to fix my lens when possible.

[adamdewilde]

Leica has also treated me wonderfully. I mostly deal directly with Leica Germany directly, and I have been there in person on one occasion. I have had a number of different issues in the past, but I have had this in most systems where I have a lot of equipment. This goes with the territory for professional photographers or even very diligent amateurs. Every problem has been acknowledged, addressed and solved. Some have taken some time, but since being on their professional program, I have been offered replacement gear when needed, though I seldom take advantage of the offer since I am in Iceland and need to pay customs on anything coming in...not fun on an S body, even if I get it back when it is returned. 

 

I even got a very nice message from the customer service representative I usually dealt with when he retired, and I can assure you I have never received a similar contact from Sony or Nikon! 

 

In any case, experiences differ of course, and it is too bad that yours has not been good. 

 

As for the thread topic, I think the main issue is one of currency and market management. For a very long time the US prices were among the lowest, as taxes on cameras are almost nonexistent in comparison to countries with VAT. Add 19-25% VAT on top of an already expensive camera and prices get even more extremely out of control. A lot of European photographers decided it was simpler just to buy the cameras and lenses in the US or Hong Kong, and as such, European dealers were losing a lot of sales. 

 

I think that Leica decided very clearly that they wanted to focus on creating a market where people bought only from their local dealers, which they were rapidly converting into Leica stores. In order to achieve this in Europe, they changed the structure so that the pricing of cameras would be the same around the world, including the VAT. So if you were a Norwegian buying a camera in Norway, the price would be the same as what it would cost an American buying in the US. The trick, however, is that an American buying in Norway would be able to get the body for 24% under the cost, as Norway has a large VAT. The other trick is that companies and professionals can reclaim their VAT, so they wind up paying a lot less than US photographers...at least at the moment. I think there are also some currency issues, as the dollar is strong versus the euro and especially the pound, so that adds to the problem, since a lot of the prices were initially set when the currencies were more balanced. I can't speak to Hong Kong, but I think that is what is going on in Europe at least.  

 

Sure, and I would be OK with that if HK weren't pricing S-bodies at $13,000 USD while where I'm living (a $200 ticket away) they're pricing them at $20,000 and then when I ask them (Leica themselves, not a third party dealer), IF the prices are stable as they told me they were trying to make them. I get a YES, and I buy into a system to have my HK dealer call me a few months later when the camera is available in HK to tell me that he can sell it SOO much cheaper. Luckily my S-007 had so many problems I decided to get rid of it quick.

 

Again, I relayed this distressing news to Leica and was assured that the SL+Zoom would be more tightly controlled (pricing wise). To then have the same shit happen to me, this time around $5,000 USD in pricing discrepancies (I'm going off BHphoto rates here, not even what my country charges). To then have the CEO tell me that he doesn't give a shit about me, he's more interested in working with people who will pay his asking price and then not bother him. Rather then working with someone who's spent over $150k on Leica gear since the release of the M9.

 

So look, say what you want, but it's obvious Leica only gives a shit about selling to A) Collectors who won't use the system Dentists who'll use the system sparingly. Everyone else they sell to is a hassle to them, and not the ideal client. 

We're all paying luxury pricing, and not getting luxury service. Heck sometimes no service at all.

 

The CEO actually told me that people would defend the brand. Even if I mentioned the pricing discrepancies. I thought surely that you would all defend your wallets, as it's no small amount ($5,000 at a minimum). BUT if you want to defend Leica, and justify spending more money on the same product, go ahead. I think it's poor business ethics and I hope something is done about it. It affects the brand, it affects resale.

Think about it.. How wary would you be if I told you this new lens will be almost 40% off in six months? Happened to me now several times with M lenses. Would you buy the lens? Would you hold out and see what happens? What would you do? What if you REALLY wanted the lens, but the rendering wasn't what you expected and you decided to sell, would you be happy that you're loosing 50% of it's value just being a tester? 

 

It's sick. It's a joke.. It's the shit you all complain that Sony does with their minor body updates.. It's one of the driving reasons behind defending your Leica purchases. Leica's retain value bla bla bla.. Well, now they don't because Leica can't get their shit together.

 

 

Anyway, I'm done with this. Be suckers, let them cheat you out of your money.

[sortvitt]

Seems that prices on newly launched gear is quite similar across the markets I usually visit (Singapore/HK/Japan/EU/US) after taking VAT into consideration. Price differences appear after availability gets better, HK seem keener to drop prices to move gear.

 

Leica has also treated me wonderfully. I mostly deal directly with Leica Germany directly, and I have been there in person on one occasion. I have had a number of different issues in the past, but I have had this in most systems where I have a lot of equipment. This goes with the territory for professional photographers or even very diligent amateurs. Every problem has been acknowledged, addressed and solved. Some have taken some time, but since being on their professional program, I have been offered replacement gear when needed, though I seldom take advantage of the offer since I am in Iceland and need to pay customs on anything coming in...not fun on an S body, even if I get it back when it is returned. 

 

I even got a very nice message from the customer service representative I usually dealt with when he retired, and I can assure you I have never received a similar contact from Sony or Nikon! 

 

In any case, experiences differ of course, and it is too bad that yours has not been good. 

 

As for the thread topic, I think the main issue is one of currency and market management. For a very long time the US prices were among the lowest, as taxes on cameras are almost nonexistent in comparison to countries with VAT. Add 19-25% VAT on top of an already expensive camera and prices get even more extremely out of control. A lot of European photographers decided it was simpler just to buy the cameras and lenses in the US or Hong Kong, and as such, European dealers were losing a lot of sales. 

 

I think that Leica decided very clearly that they wanted to focus on creating a market where people bought only from their local dealers, which they were rapidly converting into Leica stores. In order to achieve this in Europe, they changed the structure so that the pricing of cameras would be the same around the world, including the VAT. So if you were a Norwegian buying a camera in Norway, the price would be the same as what it would cost an American buying in the US. The trick, however, is that an American buying in Norway would be able to get the body for 24% under the cost, as Norway has a large VAT. The other trick is that companies and professionals can reclaim their VAT, so they wind up paying a lot less than US photographers...at least at the moment. I think there are also some currency issues, as the dollar is strong versus the euro and especially the pound, so that adds to the problem, since a lot of the prices were initially set when the currencies were more balanced. I can't speak to Hong Kong, but I think that is what is going on in Europe at least.  

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[sortvitt]

The days of Leica retaining value is definitely over. Except certain M gear it seems the electronic S and SL bodies and lenses will depreciate at the same rate others are.

Sure, and I would be OK with that if HK weren't pricing S-bodies at $13,000 USD while where I'm living (a $200 ticket away) they're pricing them at $20,000 and then when I ask them (Leica themselves, not a third party dealer), IF the prices are stable as they told me they were trying to make them. I get a YES, and I buy into a system to have my HK dealer call me a few months later when the camera is available in HK to tell me that he can sell it SOO much cheaper. Luckily my S-007 had so many problems I decided to get rid of it quick.

 

Again, I relayed this distressing news to Leica and was assured that the SL+Zoom would be more tightly controlled (pricing wise). To then have the same shit happen to me, this time around $5,000 USD in pricing discrepancies (I'm going off BHphoto rates here, not even what my country charges). To then have the CEO tell me that he doesn't give a shit about me, he's more interested in working with people who will pay his asking price and then not bother him. Rather then working with someone who's spent over $150k on Leica gear since the release of the M9.

 

So look, say what you want, but it's obvious Leica only gives a shit about selling to A) Collectors who won't use the system Dentists who'll use the system sparingly. Everyone else they sell to is a hassle to them, and not the ideal client. 

We're all paying luxury pricing, and not getting luxury service. Heck sometimes no service at all.

 

The CEO actually told me that people would defend the brand. Even if I mentioned the pricing discrepancies. I thought surely that you would all defend your wallets, as it's no small amount ($5,000 at a minimum). BUT if you want to defend Leica, and justify spending more money on the same product, go ahead. I think it's poor business ethics and I hope something is done about it. It affects the brand, it affects resale.

Think about it.. How wary would you be if I told you this new lens will be almost 40% off in six months? Happened to me now several times with M lenses. Would you buy the lens? Would you hold out and see what happens? What would you do? What if you REALLY wanted the lens, but the rendering wasn't what you expected and you decided to sell, would you be happy that you're loosing 50% of it's value just being a tester? 

 

It's sick. It's a joke.. It's the shit you all complain that Sony does with their minor body updates.. It's one of the driving reasons behind defending your Leica purchases. Leica's retain value bla bla bla.. Well, now they don't because Leica can't get their shit together.

 

 

Anyway, I'm done with this. Be suckers, let them cheat you out of your money.

[rriley]

The days of Leica retaining value is definitely over.

 

 

Which is the reason why it seems to make more sense to buy in Hong Kong.

 

The price differential, HK vs USA & VAT States, is impossible to ignore!