IkarusJohn Posted February 26, 2017 Share #1341 Posted February 26, 2017 Advertisement (gone after registration) I think if I was driven to 50MP, or larger, I would go to medium format. 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted February 26, 2017 Posted February 26, 2017 Hi IkarusJohn, Take a look here Leica SL or Hasselblad X1D. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
ski542002 Posted February 27, 2017 Share #1342 Posted February 27, 2017 I think if I was driven to 50MP, or larger, I would go to medium format. I'd still stay with the SL. The system flexibility/adaptability can't be beat. Not that Leica is "cheap", but my client base can't justify the expense of funding a complete MF system. Dumping the Leica to fund the MF system would limit my capabilities. I qualify to lease a full (3 or 4-lens) MF system, but at close to $2000/month lease payments for 3 years, when biz get's slow that'd be a painful monthly fee to have to pay Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
IkarusJohn Posted February 27, 2017 Share #1343 Posted February 27, 2017 (edited) I'd still stay with the SL. The system flexibility/adaptability can't be beat. Not that Leica is "cheap", but my client base can't justify the expense of funding a complete MF system. Dumping the Leica to fund the MF system would limit my capabilities. I qualify to lease a full (3 or 4-lens) MF system, but at close to $2000/month lease payments for 3 years, when biz get's slow that'd be a painful monthly fee to have to pay If price is the driving factor, how do you justify Leica? For paid work, is the output so much better than the cheaper alternatives? I'm just curious, not making a point. My comment was purely based on the fact that 50, 75 or 100 MP spread over a larger sensor will always be a better option than cramming more MP into a smaller space. I haven't looked but does anyone make a 36 or 50MP APS-C sensor? It would make the system smaller and cheaper, and there are plenty of good lenses in that format, including using 35mm lenses (like the compact M lenses) cropped. I appreciate that changing systems, particularly to medium format, involves wider costs (not least lenses) but for the quality, the XCD lenses look cheap by Leica standards ... Edited February 27, 2017 by IkarusJohn 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
CBM_Photo Posted February 28, 2017 Share #1344 Posted February 28, 2017 Which SL EVF issue...? (working perfectly well for me). No issue the current SL, the EVF is great, what I'm talking about is getting an EVF that does justice to the sensor. The EVF on the X1D is not nearly as good at the one on the SL despite the 50mp sensor. To really do the camera justice the EVF would need to be higher resolution that the current SL, and to date this isn't possible... 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
LD_50 Posted March 1, 2017 Share #1345 Posted March 1, 2017 No issue the current SL, the EVF is great, what I'm talking about is getting an EVF that does justice to the sensor. The EVF on the X1D is not nearly as good at the one on the SL despite the 50mp sensor. To really do the camera justice the EVF would need to be higher resolution that the current SL, and to date this isn't possible... Why would you need a higher resolution EVF for a higher resolution sensor? You just need a high enough resolution EVF to represent the scene without visible pixels, high enough dynamic range, and fast enough refresh rate. The SL EVF would look as good on the X1D (in terms of resolution) as it does on the SL. The sensor resolution has little to do with the EVF quality. 4 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ski542002 Posted March 1, 2017 Share #1346 Posted March 1, 2017 If price is the driving factor, how do you justify Leica? For paid work, is the output so much better than the cheaper alternatives? I'm just curious, not making a point. My comment was purely based on the fact that 50, 75 or 100 MP spread over a larger sensor will always be a better option than cramming more MP into a smaller space. I haven't looked but does anyone make a 36 or 50MP APS-C sensor? It would make the system smaller and cheaper, and there are plenty of good lenses in that format, including using 35mm lenses (like the compact M lenses) cropped. I appreciate that changing systems, particularly to medium format, involves wider costs (not least lenses) but for the quality, the XCD lenses look cheap by Leica standards ... Hi IcrausJohn: When my Canon bodies were getting long-in-the-tooth, I needed to decide to stick with Canon, or move to something else. That was before the 50mp Canon DSLR's release, but I don't think I would have gone that route anyway. At the time I was intrigued with Mirrorless but more important, I really missed having full mechanical manual focus lenses with real depth-of-field scales. So my move to Leica was more about the optics and less about the camera body. I made the move right after the M240 became available. When the SL was released, it was a logical upgrade for me. I can shoot things with the SL that would be difficult with my Canon bodies, primarily because of mirrorless & the M-based optics. When I purchased my Canon body new, it cost more than the M240 & SL. Of course the Leica optics are more costly, but I think the image & build quality are worth it. 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter H Posted March 2, 2017 Share #1347 Posted March 2, 2017 Advertisement (gone after registration) Hasselblad have just announced four new lenses for the X1D: a 35-75 zoom, a120 macro, a 65 and a 22mm wide which Godfrey might find interesting. 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ramarren Posted March 2, 2017 Share #1348 Posted March 2, 2017 Hasselblad have just announced four new lenses for the X1D: a 35-75 zoom, a120 macro, a 65 and a 22mm wide which Godfrey might find interesting. Damn them! I'm already assessing how much I can get for my Nikon Super Coolscan 9000 ED and Hasselblad 500CM+lenses ... I'm sure there's a good bit of time to assemble the cash. A 'digital Hasselblad SWC' has been my Holy Grail in cameras for a while. The Leica SL does an "okay" job of it with the Super-Elmar-R 15mm or Tri-Elmar-M 16-18-21, but the square crop leaves you with only 16 Mpixels. An X1D nets 37 Mpixels on square crop, and a 22mm lens on that square crop nets field of view and depth of field dynamics closer to the SWC. Ultra-Wide is when you really do need the additional resolution to get the most out of your photos... sigh. 5 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter H Posted March 2, 2017 Share #1349 Posted March 2, 2017 Damn them! I'm already assessing how much I can get for my Nikon Super Coolscan 9000 ED and Hasselblad 500CM+lenses ... I'm sure there's a good bit of time to assemble the cash. A 'digital Hasselblad SWC' has been my Holy Grail in cameras for a while. The Leica SL does an "okay" job of it with the Super-Elmar-R 15mm or Tri-Elmar-M 16-18-21, but the square crop leaves you with only 16 Mpixels. An X1D nets 37 Mpixels on square crop, and a 22mm lens on that square crop nets field of view and depth of field dynamics closer to the SWC. Ultra-Wide is when you really do need the additional resolution to get the most out of your photos... sigh. I think you're right. Their announcement today says it'll be launched "over the next 12 months". This is a very interesting system for me, and I'm quite pleased that I'll have to wait for it to mature a bit before having to find the cash.... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ramarren Posted March 2, 2017 Share #1350 Posted March 2, 2017 I think you're right. Their announcement today says it'll be launched "over the next 12 months". This is a very interesting system for me, and I'm quite pleased that I'll have to wait for it to mature a bit before having to find the cash.... I may break it up a little by ordering the body soon and the lens as soon as it is released. I expect a 22mm ultra-wide lens is going to be one of the pricier lenses in the system.. spread the hits out, it feels better than seeing a five digit sum go out in one lump. I remember paying for the SL + SL24-90 in one check: gulp. 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted March 2, 2017 Share #1351 Posted March 2, 2017 I may break it up a little ... I just sent my Nocti 75 Apo and M-D to Sean at Camera West/SF Leica ... looks like the X1D and 30/45 for now ... probably the 22 down the road. Of course he wants me to embrace the M10 and a couple of lenses as my personal system. How can I say no? Bob Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
IkarusJohn Posted March 3, 2017 Share #1352 Posted March 3, 2017 With the sale of my M60, and with the X1D I pre-ordered sitting at the dealer, my resolve is waning ... Like Godfrey, the thought of a 22mm down the track is seriously tempting. A 22-30-45 set (18.33 - 25 - 37.5 equivalent) would be compelling. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff S Posted March 3, 2017 Share #1353 Posted March 3, 2017 Like Godfrey, the thought of a 22mm down the track is seriously tempting. A 22-30-45 set (18.33 - 25 - 37.5 equivalent) would be compelling. I think the crop factor is .79x... http://shuttermuse.com/hasselblad-x-system-crop-factor-xcd-lens-full-frame-equivalent-focal-lengths/ ....if so, 22/30/45 = 17.4 / 23.7 / 35.6 Jeff Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
phovsho Posted March 3, 2017 Share #1354 Posted March 3, 2017 Apologies if I missed it, but what is max aperture on these lenses? Will any of them be f2? 2.8? Thanks. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
IkarusJohn Posted March 3, 2017 Share #1355 Posted March 3, 2017 (edited) I think the crop factor is .79x... http://shuttermuse.com/hasselblad-x-system-crop-factor-xcd-lens-full-frame-equivalent-focal-lengths/ ....if so, 22/30/45 = 17.4 / 23.7 / 35.6 Jeff No, I think it's 0.83 ... I can't remember why. I think it is because the 90mm equates to 75? Actually, the aspect ratio is different, so that will just be an approximation. Originally, I thought the 45 equated to 35 and the 90 to 75 ... What would the most useful comparison be? Area? Or diagonal. Edited March 3, 2017 by IkarusJohn 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter H Posted March 3, 2017 Share #1356 Posted March 3, 2017 John, I think Jeff is correct. And phovsho, Hasselblad haven't told us what the maximum apertures will be except for the macro (f3.5) but generally I'm definitely not expecting f2 or even 2.8 although one of them may be slightly faster than the rest, perhaps the 65mm. I think they are more interested in keeping the size down on this range. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
helged Posted March 3, 2017 Share #1357 Posted March 3, 2017 (edited) Leica can hardly be said to be a company that is in front of the MP race - and for good reasons - but the S and SL-systems need to be updated/upgraded in order to appear competitive in an increasingly demanding and diminishing market. With X1D, Hasselblad has conquered a niche where Leica could have been. Similarly, Fuji GFX put pressure on Leica pro products. Looking forward - the S-line has to be updated/upgraded to remain alive. There are speculations of anything between 50-80 MP in a new S. Then there is the question when Leica is ready to release info about a new S; time is running fast with X1D and GFX entering the market. Can we expect a new S - or at least info about it - on this side of the (northern) summer? I hope so. When the specs of the new S are known, this may also indicate what we can expect from the second incarnation of the (already excellent) SL. As a potential medium format user, I think I will await some time - likely until this summer - to learn about Leica's plans for S and possibly SL. During this time, loads of reviews and user experiences will be out, possibly some firmware updates, as well. Obviously, no statement from Leica by then is also a type of info... Edited March 3, 2017 by helged 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter H Posted March 3, 2017 Share #1358 Posted March 3, 2017 Leica doesn't announce plans. It launches products from time to time. We buy some of them. That's it. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
helged Posted March 3, 2017 Share #1359 Posted March 3, 2017 Point taken - but Leica put forward a SL lens roadmap some time back. And regarding the S-system, I would think that no news is not necessarily the best news for Leica or existing S-owners. 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter H Posted March 3, 2017 Share #1360 Posted March 3, 2017 (edited) Point taken - but Leica put forward a SL lens roadmap some time back. And regarding the S-system, I would think that no news is not necessarily the best news for Leica or existing S-owners. The conventional wisdom is that it's commercially daft to announce plans. I don't subscribe to that view but that's how Leica plays it. I believe it costs them at least as many customers and sales as it gains them, but we'll never really know. In the meantime, the X1D is looking good to me... Edited March 3, 2017 by Peter H Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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