EdwardM Posted April 4, 2016 Share #61 Posted April 4, 2016 Advertisement (gone after registration) Martin, Please forget the negative people on this wonderful forum. The positive people outnumber them. There is an old English word for negative people = gainsayers. In modern terms Eeyore fits the bill. Good luck to you for buying and selling whatever you want. It is a free world ... unless you are Eeyore. disagree:) to feel what pure ignorance is you should ask somebody on russian forum re gear change. Just ask what you think about Leica M9 or Canon or Nikon or Sony, whatever. Firstly, they immideately ask you to post examples of your photos, right after you post your photographs, you get "you don't need expensive camera, you have no idea how to shoot, you can use your iPhone instead of. after, you get the comment that there is no justice in the world if idiot like you can afford and buy such expensive cameras.etc... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted April 4, 2016 Posted April 4, 2016 Hi EdwardM, Take a look here Considering system change from Canon to Leica. Need help :). I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
Bill Livingston Posted April 4, 2016 Share #62 Posted April 4, 2016 Martin, Please forget the negative people on this wonderful forum. The positive people outnumber them. There is an old English word for negative people = gainsayers. In modern terms Eeyore fits the bill. Good luck to you for buying and selling whatever you want. It is a free world ... unless you are Eeyore. I think you mean 'naysayers' rather than 'gainsayers'... Gainsayers contradict... rather like I just did! ( Although I have just proved that the forum is clearly filled with both! ) Totally agree with your sentiment though... I have started to ignore the negative posts... and although there are a few, they tend to be posted by the same people, so ignoring them is relatively easy! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
@McLeica Posted April 4, 2016 Share #63 Posted April 4, 2016 disagree:) to feel what pure ignorance is you should ask somebody on russian forum re gear change. Just ask what you think about Leica M9 or Canon or Nikon or Sony, whatever. Firstly, they immideately ask you to post examples of your photos, right after you post your photographs, you get "you don't need expensive camera, you have no idea how to shoot, you can use your iPhone instead of. after, you get the comment that there is no justice in the world if idiot like you can afford and buy such expensive cameras.etc... That made me laugh. First point, they're right of course. Second, third and fourth it starts to trail off into the rambles. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jto555 Posted April 6, 2016 Share #64 Posted April 6, 2016 If you need to sell gear, you can not afford Leica. Seriously. The cost of ownership is highest among all cameras in my opinion. Are the pics better? Marginally. The biggest advantage left is small size. Well I for one cannot afford Leica. It took a LOT of saving, but I am shooting with Leica. Does it make my pictures better? No. Is it the smallest and lightest camera? No. Do I care? No, but I prefer to use Leica over my Canon and Hasselblad. So if you can afford Leica, great, I'm delighted for you. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martin Fagerås Posted April 6, 2016 Author Share #65 Posted April 6, 2016 Haha, here we go again Fuji vs .... everything.. I had a X100T and a X-T1 with 56mm f/1.2 and 16mm f/1.4 WR. i shot them extensively both private and commercial at a few occasions. Fuji is fine for most things, the files usually print fine at moderate sizes, and with the right post processing the digital files on screen looks good too except at 1:1. After discussing this topic to death in different forums over the last few years i think i can conclude with that some people see the X-Trans deconvolution artefacts and problems, some do not. this is the famous detail smearing / watercolour effect that some despise, and some don't even notice apparently. i personally have had landscape shots that have to be trashed because they looked like a painting in the details. For me fuji and X-trans demanded so much love and TLC in post, with different converters, screwed up workflow and (in my eyes) not satisfactory results. Leica (and other bayer sensor FF cameras for that matter) renders things differently. Leica have had their own fair share of sensor quirks in terms of banding and such, but i still prefer a AA less bayer sensor in terms of detail rendering. but hey, let's not beat this dead horse any further, some are happy with Fuji, some are not. i was one of the "not's" Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill Livingston Posted April 7, 2016 Share #66 Posted April 7, 2016 Hahaha just buy what you think you need as you know all the answers so let's not beat this dead horse any further. What??? Why respond to Martins post in this way? Isnt that exactly how you came across on your post 68? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martin Fagerås Posted April 7, 2016 Author Share #67 Posted April 7, 2016 Advertisement (gone after registration) Bill you are not the forum police - you yourself are not immune from the odd curt reply. I answered a rude post from the OP and am perfectly within my rights to do so. I seem to recall recently some mea culpa from yourself when you went totally OTT in a reply. If you had taken the time to read my reply and in context with the OP posting you would see that much of what I posted was copied from the reply to me which was by any standards dismissive and rude when I was trying to be helpful. Don't have a go because I'm not one of your Leica fanboys who thinks that Leica is the best thing ever and can do no wrong. I was making a perfectly valid point that Fuji make excellent lenses and that the files from the XT1 are superb. I stand by this and am not going to be bullied by you or anyone else in your fanboy club! Stop always trying to police this forum to somehow gain brownie points for yourself - it's tiresome and embarrassing. I think you have to read through again paulmac, I'm the OP you say have been rude, I've deliberately avoided replying to your Fuji related posts through this entire thread until my previous post. I think you confuse me with someone else. There I only stated my personal experience with using Fujifilm as a semi reply to that off topic discussion going on here. To be honest, with what I feel like is a very hostile attitude, you are the one that sound like a Fuji "fanboy" here even though you use that card towards the rest of us. This is a Leica forum after all. For me, I personally don't care much about the brand of my camera as long as it's a useful and engaging tool to express my creative vision. Fuji was not that for me, I'm happy that they work for you though. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martin Fagerås Posted April 7, 2016 Author Share #68 Posted April 7, 2016 Well, I can't really see in what post i was dismissive or rude to anyone. If you feel offended, i'm sorry about that. I've replied to one person that in between the lines called me "too poor to own a leica" something i just found ridiculous since i'm definitely not poor, and i've made a statement regarding my personal experience regarding FujiFilm gear, a (off) topic you brought in to this discussion in the first place. I think it's safe to say that there is no correct answer to subjective opinions, meaning neither you nor me are in a position to tell anyone whats best. The difference here is that i write about my personal experiences and the opinions i've made myself after those (i really can't see how you can interpret that as rude), you on the other hand make statements like this: XT1 files are without doubt as good or not better than Leica M240 and Fuji lenses are every bit as good as Leica and in some cases a bit better. You present this as facts, not your personal opinions, and that is probably the best way to feed all the trolls, piss off all the brand loyalists or just people that in general disagree. Opinions are debatable, facts are not. Discussing different opinions make interesting forum threads where people share their experiences and everybody can draw benefit from that. Arguing over "facts" make flamewars and hostile talk that in most cases is not constructive in any way. Most of this thread is luckily constructive. I've gotten some very nice feedback from several forum members that helped me in making my decision. So for me this was to a great help. I was not really asking for a discussion about gear i've already sold for my own reasons (reasons i decided to share anyway), but that did not stop you. and i'm definitely not going to bother to follow this up any more with you after this post. Yes, i've joined the secret fanboy club here on the forum, you know, the one you referred to twice in one paragraph. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaapv Posted April 7, 2016 Share #69 Posted April 7, 2016 May I remind members that fighting is against forum rules? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martin Fagerås Posted April 7, 2016 Author Share #70 Posted April 7, 2016 May I remind members that fighting is against forum rules? Ack. As stated in my previous post i will not pursue this discussion any further. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter Kilmister Posted April 7, 2016 Share #71 Posted April 7, 2016 Dear Martin, Please don't get upset by the occasional squabble amongst contributors. IMO you have made a good choice based on logic rather than emotion. Enjoy the result and let the protagonists fight it out elsewhere. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jmahto Posted April 7, 2016 Share #72 Posted April 7, 2016 May I remind members that fighting is against forum rules? Maybe we can have a new forum called "MMA Cage" next to "Barnack's Bar" where rules for engagement are little more relaxed. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaapv Posted April 7, 2016 Share #73 Posted April 7, 2016 Like the "Armchair CEO" subforum? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
otto.f Posted April 8, 2016 Share #74 Posted April 8, 2016 You seem to invest a relative lot in the body M240 and to be on a budget for lenses like Summarit etc. The switch to Leica is not only wise for size and weight but most of all fast and superb lenses, not bodies. Canon and Nikon have made far better bodies in the last 50 years. So I advise you to consider real Leica lenses like Summicron 28, Summilux 35 FLE, Summilux 50 asph and Summicron 90 ApoAsph. Don't limit yourself to this dealer who has by chance this M240 occasion and cooks this deal around it. Good luck with broadening your view before taking the big step (you can also take several small steps by the way) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
colonel Posted April 8, 2016 Share #75 Posted April 8, 2016 I have a contrary view. I think the Leica bodies are great and don't think anything from Canon or Nikon is remotely close. The only camera makers I rate today are Sony, Fuji, Olympus and Panasonic, however the modus operandi of Leica is completely different. I actually believe it's possible to have a Leica system at a discount to a full system from Nikon or Canon for many reasons. A second hand M9/M-E with new type sensor (or a second hand M240 for an extra £1000), and 3-4 Leica, Zeiss or Voigtlander lenses. For example, a kit consisting of a Voigtlander 21mm f4, a Zeiss 35mm f1.4 ZM, a Leica 50mm f1.4 ASPH and a Leica 90mm f2.8 M is pretty much a dream team, especially second hand or discounted. That's £4-6k for the lenses and £2-3k for the body. Less then a full Canon and Nikon kit with the massive zooms, cheaper then golf and a drop in the ocean for those with a boat .... And I'm not even mentioning the fine watch lovers .... Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martin Fagerås Posted April 8, 2016 Author Share #76 Posted April 8, 2016 You seem to invest a relative lot in the body M240 and to be on a budget for lenses like Summarit etc. The switch to Leica is not only wise for size and weight but most of all fast and superb lenses, not bodies. Canon and Nikon have made far better bodies in the last 50 years. So I advise you to consider real Leica lenses like Summicron 28, Summilux 35 FLE, Summilux 50 asph and Summicron 90 ApoAsph. Don't limit yourself to this dealer who has by chance this M240 occasion and cooks this deal around it. Good luck with broadening your view before taking the big step (you can also take several small steps by the way) Thanks for the advice. I kind of realized this as well and ended up buying a 50 lux asph instead of the summarit. Got the CV 15mm heliar v3 as well. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
douglas fry Posted April 8, 2016 Share #77 Posted April 8, 2016 The 15mm v3 is a superb lens, I use it often as a 'scene setter' or establishing shot - sharp corner to corner. The lux is my favourite lens - period Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
otto.f Posted April 8, 2016 Share #78 Posted April 8, 2016 Thanks for the advice. I kind of realized this as well and ended up buying a 50 lux asph instead of the summarit. Got the CV 15mm heliar v3 as well. Good choice! I did not mean to say that Voigtlander is always a compromise, I just bought the 15mm v3 as well, it is astounding for that price and great in colors. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff S Posted April 8, 2016 Share #79 Posted April 8, 2016 For example, a kit consisting of a Voigtlander 21mm f4, a Zeiss 35mm f1.4 ZM, a Leica 50mm f1.4 ASPH and a Leica 90mm f2.8 M is pretty much a dream team, especially second hand or discounted. That's £4-6k for the lenses and £2-3k for the body. Less then a full Canon and Nikon kit with the massive zooms, cheaper then golf and a drop in the ocean for those with a boat .... And I'm not even mentioning the fine watch lovers .... Canon/Nikon are different animals, of course....but in the US, one can buy all new 5D Markiii, and 3 of their best L zooms, 16-35 f4, 24-70 f2.8, and 70-300 f 4-5.6 for $6600 US (compared to roughly $11,000 for the used gear you describe). One could even upgrade to the 50 MP 5DSR, and still not reach $8000. Apples and oranges in terms of size, and the lenses aren't as fast for some FL's (there is also a 16-35 f2.8, but it's not as good as the more recent f4), but one would be able to cover vastly more focal lengths with 3 lenses. If one chooses primes instead, I'm sure there are good deals on used Canon lenses as well. A similar setup using the SL....with 24-90, 90-280, and assuming a future wide angle zoom.....would be about $25,000, or about 3-4 times the cost of the Canon system. Horses for courses, as they say, but the cost comparisons you cite can be misleading, depending on one's needs and choices. Jeff Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pico Posted April 8, 2016 Share #80 Posted April 8, 2016 The bottom line is the bottom line. Use your own evaluation. Suffer it out like the rest of us have. Do not look for co-conspirators or enablers. Do it and if it does not work out, then move on. Change is not about consensus. . Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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