Wearing glasses and the M8

[mreddington]

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I have been working with the M8 for a few weeks now and am learning to appreciate how different RF photography is compared to my previous DSLR. One thing I am not quite comfortable with yet is using the viewfinder while wearing glasses. I have multifocal (progressive) lenses and, frankly, can't see a damn thing without them. But wearing them increases the distance between the viewfinder and my eye so much that I can only just see the full 35mm frame.

 

It seems to me I have three possibilities:

 

1. Get a suitable dioptre and keep my glasses on a chain around my neck when shooting. PRO: I can take advantage of the full viewfinder; CON: I will have to keep taking my glasses off and on when I want to shoot.

 

2. Get a 0.85 adapter for eye glass wearers from Hong Kong. PRO: I will be able to use more of the viewfinder without removing my glasses; CON: it will reduce the size of the focus patch.

 

3. Wear contact lenses and use a suitable dioptre. Just not on, I'm afraid. One of my neuroses is not to have anything touching my eyes. Probably a reaction to the opening scene of Bunuel/Dali's "Un Chien Andalou".

 

Maybe I have missed something, but I would be grateful for any advice from other wearers of specs.

 

Martin

[larry]

Martin,

 

We must be twins separated at birth -- your take on the situation is the same as mine. ;-)

 

I just scrunch up to the eyepiece as close as I can and try to see as much as possible. It's really only a bit of a problem with my 28 (I don't use anything wider). My M7 has the .58 viewfinder, which makes it easier to see. Maybe Leica will offer this for the M8 at some point.

 

Larry

[Shootist]

It seems to me I have three possibilities:

 

1. Get a suitable dioptre and keep my glasses on a chain around my neck when shooting. PRO: I can take advantage of the full viewfinder; CON: I will have to keep taking my glasses off and on when I want to shoot.

 

This is what I do. Although I only wear rerading glasses I can't see anything to clear closer then 3-4 feet without them. The only problem I have is the bridge/nose pads of the glasses fit perfectly over the strap. So some times when I bring the camera up to my eye the glasses come with it. I have even thrown the glasses around to my back side when I know I'l be shooting quickly.

 

 

2. Get a 0.85 adapter for eye glass wearers from Hong Kong. PRO: I will be able to use more of the viewfinder without removing my glasses; CON: it will reduce the size of the focus patch.

 

Never tried one of these myself but from what I've read they really don't work. YMMV.

 

3. Wear contact lenses and use a suitable dioptre. Just not on, I'm afraid. One of my neuroses is not to have anything touching my eyes. Probably a reaction to the opening scene of Bunuel/Dali's "Un Chien Andalou".

 

Maybe I have missed something, but I would be grateful for any advice from other wearers of specs.

 

Martin

 

I don't think you are missing anything. Rangefinder cameras are made for people with perfect vision. At some point in my life I will have to give up using a rangefinder just because I will not be able to focus it accurately enough to capture the images I want. Until that time comes I'll enjoy using one.

[gerasdoc]

I am in a similar situation. I have been using a screw in diopter and have found it quite effective. Of course it requires throwing my glasses up to my forehead every time I want to frame or focus.

 

The other complication is that I have been using the 1,25x magnifier for lenses of 50mm focal length and up. This helps focusing immeasurably (especially with the noctilux) but the only way to use a diopter with this setup is to screw the magnifier into the eyepiece and then the diopter into the magnifier. I keep the diopter on all the time so switching to the magnifier setup is a pain.

 

Others just keep the magnifier on all the time and deal with the loss of framing you get with 35, 28, and 24mm lenses.

[barjohn]

I too wear progressive lenses (I am far sighted and suffer from prebyopia, need reading glasses). The 1.25x helps without the glasses and is hit and miss with them. Basically it magnifies the patch making it a little easier tosee when it is perfectly aligned. In general it helps the most at night when contrast is naturally lower. In the daytime with bright light I can focus it equally well with or without the 1.25x and I prefer doing without it and my glasses. Remeber you are not seeing a blurred image getting sharper as the focus improves but rather two images you are trying to overlay. The real key is finding a high contrast edge in the same plane and using it as it is easier to see coincidence with a line than a 3D image like a face. In low light it is definetly much harder and when you are in a hurry because you are trying to catch the moment. At least that is my experie3nce so far. p.s. I am no expert so take with a grain of salt.

[gravastar]

I can tell you how I solved a similar problem, but since everyone's eyes are different it may not work for you. It may give you some ideas though.

 

I am unable to focus on close objects and have very limited accomodation. First I chose a correction lens for the camera viewfinder which would allow me to see clearly without glasses. That was easier said than done due to the limited accomodation. Because the camera has a direct vision viewfinder the distance of the image in the viewfinder changes with subject distance. I chose the correction lens to be optimum for subjects about 10 feet away, so that's a compromise.

 

Now there's the problem of how to see the camera controls and the screen/menu. I solved that by purchasing a pair of frameless glasses whose lenses were long and very narrow, about 5cm x 1cm. Since they are narrow and there's no frame it's easy to see over the top of the glasses when looking through the camera viewfinder and down through them to view the screen.

 

For critical work, including closeups I purchased a magnifier with adjustable diopter correction from Unicircuits (Megaperls) in Japan Megaperls Webshop - Films and more directly from Japan corespondence is in english and there are no language difficulties.

 

Regarding the use of a "reduction" magnifier to allow you to see more of the frame with glasses, I have read this doesn't work very well although I haven't tried it myself.

 

Bob.

[mreddington]

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Thanks for all your feedback. I think I'll try Bob's suggestion of the Japanese magnifier with dioptre adjustment for my 50 and 75 mm lenses. Like Larry, I'm just OK with the 35mm lens but I do plan to get a 28 and possible a 21 or 24. I already have the CV15, but there I use the accessory viewfinder.

 

Perhaps another solution would be to use the magnifier with dioptre adjustment for focussing and to get viewfinders for the hot shoe for framing.

 

On the Megapearls site they state that the 0.85x adapter is not recommended for eyeglass wearers, so that's the end of that idea.

 

All solutions are a compromise for us sight-impaired photogs with the rangefinder.

 

Martin

[woodda]

Get the 1.25 adapter from HK great only be careful as hard metal could scratch your lenses if you bump to hard. I use it and only loose the 24 frame and I were glasses. For the 21 I guess anyway and that is good enough to much hassle the view fnder etc. use screen to preview result

[mreddington]

For critical work, including closeups I purchased a magnifier with adjustable diopter correction from Unicircuits (Megaperls) in Japan Megaperls Webshop - Films and more directly from Japan corespondence is in english and there are no language difficulties.

 

Bob,

 

I see on the Megapearls web site that they have 1.15x and 1.35x versions. Which do you use? At the moment I only have 50 and 75 lenses that would benefit from a magnifier, so I suppose the 1.15x would be enough.

 

Martin

[norm_snyder]

Martin--

I think I know what you mean. Years ago I even did try contacts to see the wider frames on my [then] M4. Unfortunately, the soft contacts I was wearing dried out while I was framing, because I tended to stop blinking, and this blurred my vision, anyway! What works pretty well for me [i am left eyed, to boot, so my nose presses against the LCD], is using glasses with spring hinged temple pieces, and that allows more pressure, getting the lens pressed closer to my eye, without destroying the frames. It's still a bit rough on glasses, but I keep a spare pair in the bag with my camera gear that I use when I'm shooting,

 

John--

Is the 35mm frame [46mm equiv] visible with the 1.25X magnifier? I was thinking of using this myself, since I also use a 75mm Summilux in low light, and the extra magnification would be helpful, but I want to be able to frame with my 35mm C-V Nokton [due for delivery next week].

 

Regards,

 

Norm

[rwfreund]

I have been struggling a bit, but I think that I have found an accomodation that works for me.

I wear progressive glasses and without them can see nothing closer than six feet.

My left eye, however, besides being dominant, needs only a +1 diopter (plus that which is built-in) to work very well. The right eye is a lost cause.

In fact, with the leica 1.25 magnifier, I find that it is sharp enough that I don't need my glasses for focusing.

So, for the wider lenses, I use the diopter screwed in to the M8 and look over my glasses to see the 24mm framelines.

For 50+mm, I screw in the magnifier, but find somehow that the diopter is not necessary.

I look over my glasses, and carry a +2.5 set of readers in my bag.

I wish the eye relief were just a bit longer.

-bob

[scott kirkpatrick]

When I wore contact lenses and didn't need any help with close vision, the M2 was a natural. Now with progressive lenses and no longer wearing contact lenses (hmm, still have them, might try again), I find that I have two different strategies for 35 mm and longer and for 15-28mm work with the M8. With glasses and a longer lens, I can focus and frame with my right eye, keeping the lcd clean. With the glasses off, my left eye vision is pretty good, I can see the 28mm frame lines well, and the lcd gets cleaned more often. For the 24mm, my glasses stay on, and I focus with the rangefinder patch and frame with an external viewfinder, since so much of the frame is obscured anyway. I'm currently using the Voigtlaender 28/35 mini because it is incredibly small, and the 24's frame falls between the two sets of lines, but a 28 or 35 full viewer would be brighter and sit higher, leaving the entire frame unobscured, while the mini loses a little strip at the bottom which is blocked by the camera body. There is a viewfinder made for use with a 21mm lens on the RD-1 which gives exactly the 24 (x 1.33 = 32mm-eff) field of view, but it is out of production and out of stock. For the 15, an external viewfinder is required.

 

scott

[lars_bergquist]

I am seventy, heavily presbyopic and accommodation is nil. I am wearing progressive specs nowadays. I find that you learn fairly rapidly through which part of the lenses you should look in order to see the focusing patch clearly. The remaining problem is the longer viewing distance, which tends to decrease the field seen through the eyepiece.

 

With the M4-P with its .72 finder, I saw the 35 mm frame well but only parts of the 28 mm frame. With the M8, I see the 24 mm frame just barely – nearly as badly as the 28 mm in the M4. The question is of course how much farther from the eyepiece the specs force you to place your eye. That depends on the specs. Thick lenses, and large lenses, are a handicap. I use high quality organic glass in frames of modest size. – And I am not interested in 24 mm lenses ...

 

I have experimented with dioptric lenses but found them to be a non-solution. They mean that you see well only through the finder; outside it you are half-blind. You can learn to count clicks on the lens when changing the aperture (if you knew it from the beginning) but the speeds are a different matter when you are working manually. Formerly, the dial had a firm stop between B and 1000, and you worked in large increments, now it is much more difficult. All in all, not the best recipe for action photography.

 

The old man from the Age of the Brilliant Finder

[chris_tribble]

2 bodies -

Body one, magnifier + diopter and use with lens 50mm and above

Body two + diopter and use with 35mm and down.

And then ... reading glasses in your pocket in a tube case so they don't get crushed, lots of squinting, LOTS of swearing at getting over 50... and both with the M7 and M8, a sense of relief that at least we can use aperture priority a lot of the time...

 

It's a drag, isn't it...

[mreddington]

Well, it's good to know I'm not alone in adversity!

 

Thanks for all the responses - it seems I had the options pretty well figured out and now it's a matter of exploring them to find the best solution for me (and my glasses). One thing's for sure - working with this camera is a wonderful change from the DSLR and it will be worth the effort.

 

Chris - I'll hit 60 in August so the swearing will undoubtedly reach new heights!

 

Cheers

Martin

[gravastar]

Bob,

 

I see on the Megapearls web site that they have 1.15x and 1.35x versions. Which do you use? At the moment I only have 50 and 75 lenses that would benefit from a magnifier, so I suppose the 1.15x would be enough.

 

Martin

Mine's the x1.35 version. You can't quite see the edges of the 35mm frame unless you move your head slightly, the 50mm frame and up are very easy to see. That's without glasses of course. You would be better off with the higher mag one for the 50mm and 75mm since the magnification factor effectively increases the rangefinder base length and hence accuracy.

 

Now that you've mentioned it I may well get the x1.15 version as well. I should be able to see the full 35mm frame and have the adjustable diopter. The higher mag one was bought to use with the Noctilux and 75mm Summilux.

 

It's a shame Leica didn't make the M8 with an adjustable diopter. I often wonder if all that's needed is to make the camera eyepiece lens moveable.

 

Bob.

[wlaidlaw]

Another user with varifocal spectacles. I am also using the Leica 1.25x magnifier (made out of unobtanium by the price, I assume) for 50mm and above. I have found over the four months of using the M8, that I can usually find an area of my varifocals which gives me reasonable vision but still miss the built in variable dioptre correction from my Contax G2.

 

I have found that I seem to get very slightly different focus points using the magnifier than I do without. I cannot think of any logical reason for this but others have mentioned this same strange phenomenon.

 

Wilson

[Philinflash]

...

 

3. Wear contact lenses and use a suitable dioptre. Just not on, I'm afraid. One of my neuroses is not to have anything touching my eyes. ...

Martin

 

There is a "4." which is what I did.

 

You can get an interocular implant nowadays that is truly marvelous. It is like a contact lens that is inserted into your eye replacing your "natural" lens. I know it sounds drastic but eye surgeons are doing this with ease every day. I was legally blind without glasses since I was 5 years old, and my vision was not that great with thick heavy-weight lenses (or even contact lenses which I wore for years). With the implants, I am 20-20 although I do need reading glasses for fine or protracted or dark reading. It has changed my life in subtle ways. I just wish I could have had this done many years ago. And, of course, seeing through the RF of the M8 is perfect.

 

I highly recommend it. Painless, just local aneasthesia, you see right away. The cost may be largely convered by insurance if there is a hint of clouding on the native lens which many people have. Even if not, it is cheaper than glasses, diopters, etc, in the long run.

[mreddington]

I have found over the four months of using the M8, that I can usually find an area of my varifocals which gives me reasonable vision but still miss the built in variable dioptre correction from my Contax G2.

 

Wilson, I also have no problem focussing and easily found an area in my eyeglass lens where the focus patch is sharp. My only problem is being able to see the frame lines.

 

Bob, Wilson - I also wonder why Leica don't introduce a built in dioptre correction. I think I might go for both adjustable magnifiers.

 

Martin

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Hallo,

Look here: Leica M

[mreddington]

There is a "4." which is what I did.

 

You can get an interocular implant nowadays that is truly marvelous. It is like a contact lens that is inserted into your eye replacing your "natural" lens. I know it sounds drastic but eye surgeons are doing this with ease every day. I was legally blind without glasses since I was 5 years old, and my vision was not that great with thick heavy-weight lenses (or even contact lenses which I wore for years). With the implants, I am 20-20 although I do need reading glasses for fine or protracted or dark reading. It has changed my life in subtle ways. I just wish I could have had this done many years ago. And, of course, seeing through the RF of the M8 is perfect.

 

I highly recommend it. Painless, just local aneasthesia, you see right away. The cost may be largely convered by insurance if there is a hint of clouding on the native lens which many people have. Even if not, it is cheaper than glasses, diopters, etc, in the long run.

 

Now that's a radical solution that I didn't think of. I wonder if my French medical insurance would cover it. Maybe I'll talk to the opthalmologist next time I go for an examination.