hawk.kat Posted June 24, 2015 Share #1 Posted June 24, 2015 Advertisement (gone after registration) Hey everyone, This is a beginner's appeal for advice. I have in the last two years graduated from iPhone to real cameras. I use the OMD E-M5 (with assortment of lenses), a X100S and a G16 (for work and diving). I am considering getting a Leica because I enjoy using the X100s a great deal but want even better IQ and definitely better build quality. And along came the Q which at first glance send to be the perfect gateway. But thinking a bit more about it, I am wondering if I should in fact spend more and get a M. One concern is that the M may be a lot more demanding technically and be beyond my abilities. What would you advise? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted June 24, 2015 Posted June 24, 2015 Hi hawk.kat, Take a look here Q or M. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
jaapv Posted June 24, 2015 Share #2 Posted June 24, 2015 Well - it is a bit of a difficult question, as these cameras differ substantially. The first question being: Can you be happy with just one wide lens, or do you wish to use different focal lengths? If you decide for the M, it is not really hard to learn how to focus, plus you need a basic understanding of photographic theory, especially exposure. it comes down to practise, practise, practise, really. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Exodies Posted June 24, 2015 Share #3 Posted June 24, 2015 The M can be operated as simply as an iPhone camera - set the aperture to 8, auto shutter speed exposure and then just wave it around pressing the shutter. If it costs the same as your suit, just go for it. If it costs the same as your car, then you are probably driven by an inexplicable passion, just go for it. I see no benefit in moving towards the M through a series of inferior devices. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
prk60091 Posted June 24, 2015 Share #4 Posted June 24, 2015 The M can be operated as simply as an iPhone camera - set the aperture to 8, auto shutter speed exposure and then just wave it around pressing the shutter. If it costs the same as your suit, just go for it. If it costs the same as your car, then you are probably driven by an inexplicable passion, just go for it. I see no benefit in moving towards the M through a series of inferior devices. At the risk of starting a war (which i do not want to do!) I do not believe that the "Q" is by any way shape or form an "inferior device". I do believe there is a very good reason to start with less expensive alternatives. You don't start a hobby (eg astronomy) by buying the best most expensive telescope-- you start with something less and work your way up the "ladder" until you need the "best in class". Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bocaburger Posted June 24, 2015 Share #5 Posted June 24, 2015 Hey everyone, This is a beginner's appeal for advice. I have in the last two years graduated from iPhone to real cameras. I use the OMD E-M5 (with assortment of lenses), a X100S and a G16 (for work and diving). I am considering getting a Leica because I enjoy using the X100s a great deal but want even better IQ and definitely better build quality. And along came the Q which at first glance send to be the perfect gateway. But thinking a bit more about it, I am wondering if I should in fact spend more and get a M. One concern is that the M may be a lot more demanding technically and be beyond my abilities. What would you advise? I would advise a beginner not to buy into the false notion that the most expensive equipment will improve the appeal of his photographs to anyone other than brand snobs and pixelpeeping gearheads. The IQ of the cameras mentioned is good enough for many accomplished photographers, and their build quality is more than good enough for any camera in this day and age where the paradigm is to upgrade every few years. The Q is an immensely expensive version of somewhat similarly-specified cameras. The M's OTOH are very unique digital cameras for the sole reason that they have an optomechanical range/viewfinder, and for those who like that interface there isn't any other choice but to pay the cost. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter Kilmister Posted June 24, 2015 Share #6 Posted June 24, 2015 If you think you might like an M then you will never be satisfied until you have tried one. So if you buy a Q you will always wonder if you made the correct choice. Depending on where you live, you might have a dealer nearby who will lend you, or rent you, an M for a while. If you then decide you can't handle it you just take it back and your curiosity will have been satisfied. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlanJW Posted June 24, 2015 Share #7 Posted June 24, 2015 Advertisement (gone after registration) Since you are not used to focusing manually, before you take the plunge on an M, maybe rent one for a week to see how manual focus with a rangefinder works. Because the Q has autofocus it may suit your needs today better. Yes, the Q is limited to one focal length but also provides framelines for 35mm and 50mm. I am generally okay with the 35mm crop as it is 16mp. If you want more flexibility on lenses, then you will need to accomodate to the M manual focus. As noted you could set it so it works like a P&S, but an M and M lenses are too expensive IMHO to use like that. You might as well keep your Fuji for that. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff S Posted June 24, 2015 Share #8 Posted June 24, 2015 My first priority when choosing a camera relates to the viewing experience, i.e., how it allows me to see and focus on the subject. If that doesn't suit, the rest doesn't matter. Some folks bond with the RF experience, some don't; I did almost immediately. One way to find out is to rent or borrow an M (can be any version) and get a preliminary gauge for yourself. If you're in the US, you can rent here... http://www.lensrentals.com/rent/leica/cameras. Or find a friendly dealer. Jeff Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
CheshireCat Posted June 24, 2015 Share #9 Posted June 24, 2015 Go to a dealer and try both. And always remember that nothing is beyond your abilities... if you are passionate and willing to learn Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
hawk.kat Posted June 24, 2015 Author Share #10 Posted June 24, 2015 Thanks everyone for the thoughtful comments.... Sounds like I mustn't buy either blind and a proper test drive is a must[emoji1] Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
edwardkaraa Posted June 24, 2015 Share #11 Posted June 24, 2015 The problem with Leica is once you shoot with one nothing else will give you the same photographic satisfaction despite all the frustrating shortcomings. Be careful what you're getting into. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
CheshireCat Posted June 24, 2015 Share #12 Posted June 24, 2015 The problem with Leica is once you shoot with one nothing else will give you the same photographic satisfaction despite all the frustrating shortcomings. My 1Dx does... but it is not cheap either Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Manoleica Posted June 24, 2015 Share #13 Posted June 24, 2015 Thanks everyone for the thoughtful comments.... Sounds like I mustn't buy either blind and a proper test drive is a must[emoji1] See if you can rent - try them out - go from there.. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
hawk.kat Posted June 24, 2015 Author Share #14 Posted June 24, 2015 Not sure if rental is an option in the UK; nothing had jumped out on Googling. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
edwardkaraa Posted June 24, 2015 Share #15 Posted June 24, 2015 My 1Dx does... but it is not cheap either It's not about the price. I used to shoot 1Ds series cameras with Zeiss and Canon glass, and the combination gave me bodybuilder's forearms and backaches from carrying my gear bag Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter Kilmister Posted June 24, 2015 Share #16 Posted June 24, 2015 I was told that if you go to Leica in Manchester they will let you try out their cameras free of charge. No idea whether other dealers offer this. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
wda Posted June 24, 2015 Share #17 Posted June 24, 2015 Some dealers certainly allow such a trial but not at initial launch when stock is hard to find. Another thought is to visit your main Leica distributor (Leica Mayfair in UK) and attend a familiarisation half-day. You need to book but you will get a good briefing and the chance to try each model shown with your own memory cards for later evaluation. But in your case, it is the handling which is more important as a first time buyer. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
dugby Posted June 25, 2015 Share #18 Posted June 25, 2015 Hey everyone, This is a beginner's appeal for advice. I have in the last two years graduated from iPhone to real cameras. I use the OMD E-M5 (with assortment of lenses), a X100S and a G16 (for work and diving). I am considering getting a Leica because I enjoy using the X100s a great deal but want even better IQ and definitely better build quality. And along came the Q which at first glance send to be the perfect gateway. But thinking a bit more about it, I am wondering if I should in fact spend more and get a M. One concern is that the M may be a lot more demanding technically and be beyond my abilities. What would you advise? Don't forget there is a series of Zeiss ZM as well as Voigtlander lenses suitable for the M, which can soften your budget, to assist you into the M world with less wallet pain. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
A Almulla Posted June 25, 2015 Share #19 Posted June 25, 2015 Hi Hawk.kat. I had the same path with the X100s to M240 migration. Other than image quality, which can be argued between both the Fuji and the Leica crowd, I find the price to be an important factor. I enjoy the limitations of a single focal length so not a big in my view. Once the X100s becomes outdated it won't hurt as much letting it go or sit on a shelf, unlike the investment in a Q. With the M you have the pain of paying more for one and even more for the lens but once the M(240) becomes out dated in a few years you can still use those lenses. As others have stated, the M is a camera than you would either love with its limitations or hate. You can always look for a second hand M and lenses. All the best with whatever you decide. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Herr Barnack Posted June 26, 2015 Share #20 Posted June 26, 2015 If it is not out of reach in terms of cost, get the M rather than the Q - no question. My first digital camera was an M240. Having learned the M system on a film MP, I had no problems transitioning to the M240. There weer a couple of things I didn't quite understand in the beginning, but the tech guys at Leica NJ were able to help. I also got this book, which is a good book to have on hand when you first get your camera: http://www.amazon.com/Leica-TYP-240-Expanded-Guides/dp/1781450390 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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