J_TULLAR Posted March 24, 2014 Share #1 Posted March 24, 2014 Advertisement (gone after registration) Posted on another forum, I've been told unofficially that Leica is out of the M8 / 8.2 sensors and will not be getting more. Apparently what is being done instead is the Leica importer in that country offering the customer a credit upgrade towards a current production Monochrome or ME or M240 - or sometimes a refurbished M9 if they are available. The amount of the credit and towards what camera seems to be dependent upon what you can negotiate with your national importer. If anyone has additional details, please share. Stephen Its digital so I understand but it is disappointing nonetheless..... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted March 24, 2014 Posted March 24, 2014 Hi J_TULLAR, Take a look here Leica Out of M8 / 8.2 Sensors ??. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
Jeff S Posted March 24, 2014 Share #2 Posted March 24, 2014 The credit refers to the lack of supply for replacement LCD screens, as discussed here and elsewhere, not the sensor. Jeff Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
wattsy Posted March 24, 2014 Share #3 Posted March 24, 2014 The above quote comes from Stephen Gandy of Cameraquest. I imagine he knows the difference between a sensor and an LCD screen. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
diddus Posted March 24, 2014 Share #4 Posted March 24, 2014 I actually spoke to a Leica representative regarding the Sensor or it's replacement 3 days ago. He didn't quote an exact price, but told me it would be over 1000€... anyhow... there was no mention of any time constraint or shortage whatsoever. Despite everything ... I still can't figure out why they can't reproduce the technology or something that would work as a replacement screen, or indeed sensor. It might not be the "original" thing but something that works ... shouldn't be that hard. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
plasticman Posted March 24, 2014 Share #5 Posted March 24, 2014 Discussion is here. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
tobey bilek Posted March 24, 2014 Share #6 Posted March 24, 2014 If they can not repair, you get a discount on a current product. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
J_TULLAR Posted March 24, 2014 Author Share #7 Posted March 24, 2014 Advertisement (gone after registration) If they can not repair, you get a discount on a current product. Which if the sensor is indeed $1400 to replace, I would take the upgrade. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff S Posted March 24, 2014 Share #8 Posted March 24, 2014 Well if this is true, then we might as well not trust Stefan Daniel on any related matters. After the M8 display debacle, here's what he said at Photokina (excerpted)…. Question: What exactly is it with the displays for the M8? Stefan Daniel: ….. ….Because of this we offer replacement with a LEICA M9 if the LEICA M8 is still in warranty. After the warranty we offer the replacement with an additional payment. The amount of the payment depends on the camera‘s age. This is not a good solution. This sort of problem must not occur again. Question: Can we ask you for a statement on the “lifelong endurance” which is mentioned in some of the marketing materiel? Stefan Daniel: We can’t maintain this ambition. Providing a warranty or even repairs over the entire life time or even decades is a hopeless task. We aim to be able to repair our cameras at least 10 years after the last production run. That’s how we set up our stocks of replacement parts. So, they did the upgrade program for the displays, but admitted it wasn't a good way to go, and it wouldn't happen again. And then said replacement parts are meant for 10 years, which means another two and half years for the M8. Fooled once… Jeff Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
plasticman Posted March 24, 2014 Share #9 Posted March 24, 2014 And then said replacement parts are meant for 10 years, which means another two and half years for the M8. Jeff The M8 was discontinued in September 2009. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff S Posted March 24, 2014 Share #10 Posted March 24, 2014 The M8 was discontinued in September 2009. Yep, even worse then, as I mistakenly used the production start. Jeff Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loren Posted March 24, 2014 Share #11 Posted March 24, 2014 Well if this is true, then we might as well not trust Stefan Daniel on any related matters. After the M8 display debacle, here's what he said at Photokina (excerpted)…. Question: What exactly is it with the displays for the M8? Stefan Daniel: ….. ….Because of this we offer replacement with a LEICA M9 if the LEICA M8 is still in warranty. After the warranty we offer the replacement with an additional payment. The amount of the payment depends on the camera‘s age. This is not a good solution. This sort of problem must not occur again. Question: Can we ask you for a statement on the “lifelong endurance” which is mentioned in some of the marketing materiel? Stefan Daniel: We can’t maintain this ambition. Providing a warranty or even repairs over the entire life time or even decades is a hopeless task. We aim to be able to repair our cameras at least 10 years after the last production run. That’s how we set up our stocks of replacement parts. So, they did the upgrade program for the displays, but admitted it wasn't a good way to go, and it wouldn't happen again. And then said replacement parts are meant for 10 years, which means another two and half years for the M8. Fooled once… Jeff I understand the frustration, but what companies try to do is estimate the stock of parts to supply repairs. In some cases parts become obsolete, so a one-time buy is made that is a best estimate to fulfill repair needs. Remember, this is just a statistical estimate and if the calculation is wrong, then all hell can break loose when you either have too much stock or not enough. The good will effort by Leica to provide a prorated upgrade is above and beyond what most companies do. You won't find that with Nikon or Canon as a general policy. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
M9reno Posted March 24, 2014 Share #12 Posted March 24, 2014 The "lifetime" bull is above and beyond. The price based on the "lifetime" bull is also above and beyond. Which means the prorated cost for replacement is what it is... a decent gesture, but really not much more. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
tookaphotoof Posted March 24, 2014 Share #13 Posted March 24, 2014 My display of the M8.2 had the coffee stain. I bought it second hand and it was probably far out of warranty. The camera looked heavily used, yet after sending it to Solms they gave me a more than fair discount on a new M240. Whilst you could ask yourself why they don't have any spare parts to fix it, you could also ask yourself what other camera company would offer the service of upgrading to their latest at a good price. I can't imagine Canon would offer me a good price upgrading to a 5D3 if my 5D2 needed replacement today. They'd probably point at their warranty sheet and ask me to stop bothering them. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff S Posted March 24, 2014 Share #14 Posted March 24, 2014 I understand the frustration, but what companies try to do is estimate the stock of parts to supply repairs. In some cases parts become obsolete, so a one-time buy is made that is a best estimate to fulfill repair needs. Remember, this is just a statistical estimate and if the calculation is wrong, then all hell can break loose when you either have too much stock or not enough. The good will effort by Leica to provide a prorated upgrade is above and beyond what most companies do. You won't find that with Nikon or Canon as a general policy. I get all that. You're too new here to understand that the comments I excerpted from Stefan Daniel were made just a year and a half ago, AFTER we debated your view and others exhaustively on the forum. After much consideration, and PR mess, this was Leica's official response. My frustration isn't over the policy, only the very recent statement, which now proves to be wrong by over 5 years out of the 10. And only a year and half after he said a shortfall program shouldn't be necessary again. Jeff Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
J_TULLAR Posted March 24, 2014 Author Share #15 Posted March 24, 2014 I get all that. You're too new here to understand that the comments I excerpted from Stefan Daniel were made just a year and a half ago, AFTER we debated your view and others exhaustively on the forum. After much consideration, and PR mess, this was Leica's official response. My frustration isn't over the policy, only the very recent statement, which now proves to be wrong by over 5 years out of the 10. And only a year and half after he said a shortfall program shouldn't be necessary again. Jeff I thought the Ten years was for the M9? Not the M8... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff S Posted March 24, 2014 Share #16 Posted March 24, 2014 I thought the Ten years was for the M9? Not the M8... Leica had been using the "lifetime" language for all their digital M's, and Stefan Daniels' Photokina interview here made no distinction on model number when he commented that a 10 year supply was the goal. Jeff Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loren Posted March 25, 2014 Share #17 Posted March 25, 2014 Leica had been using the "lifetime" language for all their digital M's, and Stefan Daniels' Photokina interview here made no distinction on model number when he commented that a 10 year supply was the goal. Jeff And 10 years is typical for the electronics industry. Maybe 15 years for white goods and automotive. Another issue is RHoS will limit the lifetime of electronics to about 15 to 20 years, so the idea of a forever warranty is a thing of the distant past. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff S Posted March 25, 2014 Share #18 Posted March 25, 2014 And 10 years is typical for the electronics industry. Maybe 15 years for white goods and automotive. Another issue is RHoS will limit the lifetime of electronics to about 15 to 20 years, so the idea of a forever warranty is a thing of the distant past. You're not listening. I have zero issue with the intent. Jeff Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loren Posted March 25, 2014 Share #19 Posted March 25, 2014 You're not listening. I have zero issue with the intent. Jeff Sorry. My bad. I guess I am just not understanding. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaapv Posted March 25, 2014 Share #20 Posted March 25, 2014 Are we assuming this isolated report is not just a rumour based on what? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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