dwbell Posted November 19, 2013 Share #61 Posted November 19, 2013 Advertisement (gone after registration) The M body is exactly the same thickness as the M9. It is Peter, and I argued this point fiercely prerelease...... .....yet it certainly feels 'bigger' in the hand. Combination of weight and no RH top step? Dunno, but I notice it. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted November 19, 2013 Posted November 19, 2013 Hi dwbell, Take a look here Impressions of New M240 by M9-P User. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
Rick Posted November 20, 2013 Share #62 Posted November 20, 2013 It is Peter, and I argued this point fiercely prerelease...... .....yet it certainly feels 'bigger' in the hand. Combination of weight and no RH top step? Dunno, but I notice it. Ok, princess. How do you feel about peas and mattresses? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gibbo Posted November 20, 2013 Share #63 Posted November 20, 2013 Don't pea on your mattress! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Surge Posted November 20, 2013 Share #64 Posted November 20, 2013 That is an interesting phenomena - a firmware update that adds a lever to the front of the camera that controls a wholly mechanical system. Would be, except for the fact that the M240 framelines are entirely electronic (and do reconfigure for different focal lengths), and last I checked, there were 2 buttons on the body that could easily be reconfigured. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
diogenis Posted November 20, 2013 Share #65 Posted November 20, 2013 Surge, you cannot reconfigure every button that you like: It has to first... be reconfigurable, in short it needs the engineer to have designed it reconfigurable and cost effective. And obviously, it cannot be mechanical, as they are harder to be reconfigurable. This is not a multibillion sattelite that launches for Mars. It's a consumer product with a lifespan cycle in the market... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leonil Posted November 20, 2013 Share #66 Posted November 20, 2013 Would be, except for the fact that the M240 framelines are entirely electronic (and do reconfigure for different focal lengths), and last I checked, there were 2 buttons on the body that could easily be reconfigured. Actually the Frame lines on the 240 is an LED light with mechanical gaps the light passes through... No its not electronic, the whole RF housing is 100% mechanical. Firmware will not change that., Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
dwbell Posted November 20, 2013 Share #67 Posted November 20, 2013 Advertisement (gone after registration) Ok, princess. How do you feel about peas and mattresses? Actually had me LOL there Rick! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaapv Posted November 20, 2013 Share #68 Posted November 20, 2013 Would be, except for the fact that the M240 framelines are entirely electronic (and do reconfigure for different focal lengths), and last I checked, there were 2 buttons on the body that could easily be reconfigured. Errr… no. They are not. The old mechanical masks illuminated by a LED Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leonil Posted November 20, 2013 Share #69 Posted November 20, 2013 there were 2 buttons on the body that could easily be reconfigured. From my reading and learning about Leica, it is not a brand that allows users to have a modular experience. You experience THEIR system. But in a more concrete sense, Leica has never made a digital RF that allowed any kind of mechanical customisation. The reason other companies can do that is because of their size and R&D budget. I have yet to see someone show me the ability to customise the mechanical buttons on a Leica M system camera. Id like to see if there really is a customisable button. The only buttons that come to mind is the focusing assist button but that's a context sensitive button that allows a choice of 2 options, there is the Info button that allows some options, is that what you mean? Because that's not the definition of customisable or reconfigure - I mean, if you can back button focus with the info button, Im sold, if I can make the movie button a metering or a peaking button, then cool, if I can press LV and go right into movie mode, cool, but I think Leica hasn't done that and it would be problematic for Leica to fit that in such a tiny RF body. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
algrove Posted November 20, 2013 Share #70 Posted November 20, 2013 Surge, you cannot reconfigure every button that you like: It has to first... be reconfigurable, in short it needs the engineer to have designed it reconfigurable and cost effective. And obviously, it cannot be mechanical, as they are harder to be reconfigurable. This is not a multibillion sattelite that launches for Mars. It's a consumer product with a lifespan cycle in the market... Oh, wait a minute! You are actually talking about configuring many buttons like one can do on the a7r. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bocaburger Posted November 21, 2013 Share #71 Posted November 21, 2013 "Disappointment and self reproach?" "Admit to yourself regret for buying the M240?" Come on. What kind of fantasy are you trying to sell with that? Most bought the M and kept the M9 for a while until they decided the M240 was a huge improvement in color at any ISO, build, battery life speed of electronics, RF, the LCD is killer, more MP, it has LV, battery life, weather sealing, one of the best sensors... do you want me to go on? The reason that everyone that owns the M240 likes it better than their M9 is... are you ready... here it comes... it is better. The only ones that seem to think the M9 is better... here it comes... own it. That seems to be the reality distortion in the forum. Most of the rest of us had both and sold the M9 because, it isn't as good as the M. If there is a "reality distortion" on the forum it is in the minds of a (thankfully) few people who own the M240 and believe it their right and obligation to discredit those who don't. Which is nothing new, it happens every time Leica comes out with a new camera. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
diogenis Posted November 21, 2013 Share #72 Posted November 21, 2013 Oh, wait a minute! You are actually talking about configuring many buttons like one can do on the a7r. Actually no. I am talking about Leica M. Sony's A7R is trying to replicate a Leica with this, and francly I disagree with being able to reprogramm all the buttons. Those that feel the need of being able to make their own camera, they can always buy A7R Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
drdannn Posted November 26, 2013 Share #73 Posted November 26, 2013 I too hesitated. Giving up the CCD sensor for a CMOS was a bit scary. I will never shoot a video either. I love shooting indoors/outdoors at night. The m9 did have lots of noise and the colors did, really did, break up. No such thing on the 240. Colors stay intact and at 2500, even 3200 iso it is quite acceptable to say the least. Live view I do not use much, but when I do it is great. Choices of metering is nice although I almost always use center weighted. I did use spot for a particular shot and it came out great. I really like that the shutter speed dial has a "notch" you can feel when it hits the "A" mark. On the m9 there was no such thing, and when I was manually shooting at night and wanted to go back to "A" mode, I had to look. On the 240 I can feel it click into the "A" mode, and for me that's great. I like that if you press the "info" button you can see your exposure, even when not in live view. There are so many other subtle differences that really do make a difference in a positive manner. In a different light, the m9 was, and is, one great camera. There was a certain difference, not so much in IQ, but rather the "look" of the image is a little different; not necessarily better or worse, but different in a pleasing way. So if I could make any monetary sense out of keeping both cameras, and if I could actually make use of both -- I would keep the two! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
flyalf Posted November 26, 2013 Share #74 Posted November 26, 2013 "Disappointment and self reproach?" "Admit to yourself regret for buying the M240?" Come on. What kind of fantasy are you trying to sell with that? Most bought the M and kept the M9 for a while until they decided the M240 was a huge improvement in color at any ISO, build, battery life speed of electronics, RF, the LCD is killer, more MP, it has LV, battery life, weather sealing, one of the best sensors... do you want me to go on? The reason that everyone that owns the M240 likes it better than their M9 is... are you ready... here it comes... it is better. The only ones that seem to think the M9 is better... here it comes... own it. That seems to be the reality distortion in the forum. Most of the rest of us had both and sold the M9 because, it isn't as good as the M. Yes, in total the M is a better camera. But as to the IQ; I don't find an improvement in color at base ISO, although it has a wee bit more dynamic. For high ISO the M is clearly better. But for low light and long exposures I not so sure. In fact Im starting to wonder if the M9 is slightly better for low light? I recently looked through some night photos taken with my M9, and recent photos from same scene with the M. I was positively surprised of the output after post from my M9, and equally dissatisfied with result by M. Perhaps other have experiences or have compared both in lowlight on base ISO? I hope to find time to compare myself, but different people have different workflows and abilities in post, so its hard to directly compare with others. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
algrove Posted November 26, 2013 Share #75 Posted November 26, 2013 Curious comment as I am at times getting the same feeling. I was prepared to sell my M9, but now wonder if I should keep it even though I have another CCD setup. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
schmolinski Posted November 26, 2013 Share #76 Posted November 26, 2013 Hi all, thanks to the TO! And of course to all the responses here. This thread exactly reflects my indecisive feeling about getting a new M. So here comes my opinion. It's a user report of a guy in the cue... I ordered mine March this year and still waiting. I am located in Germany near Hamburg, Meister Camera store. And always I call them the answer it's the same... Be patient and wait, you are on the List... Latest delivery should be March 2014 - I could cry at least. And I will let you know why... Though I am struggling with my order:"was I right to order?" Because reading all the posts here in this forum, the bad and good opinions about the new M makes we wonder, shall I stick to my M9 or shall I spend the money for the latest M? In the meantime I am having fun (do I? Or would the M be better?) with my M9 which recently, last week got a new sensor. But to be honest I was hoping to get my M9 replaced by an M due to spare part delivery issues. But no chance... Still waiting and thinking would this or that photo better taken with the new M??? While waiting I had the chance to grab a minty M3 with an even more minty 50cron rigid for a mere 799€ Still waiting and waiting and playing around with film. But the best is I have learned that it really doesn't matter what camera I use as long as having fun with it. Nonetheless I want to own the new M but one question remains. Does it make my photography better? The answer is NO! Today and tonight I used my M9 and my M3 and even my C5D3 to take images of my wife's 40 birthday. The new M was missing, somehow...! You may ask why, I will tell you. The M9 was perfect during the daytime. No regrets shooting with it. The M3 was just a fun factor. I had to get the film exposed since it lasts for almost a week in my M3. My Canon gear I used for the sake of high ISO quality with and without flash. The high ISO of the new M is convincing, and even movie making could be an issue for me. Yes! The high ISO quality of the new M makes it for me. Shooting in dark environment, where the light is flat and dim and exposure time less than 1/90sec or 1/60 doesn't make sense as long as people are moving and don't care or pose for the photographer. So wide open or even stopped down an M9 at ISO 640 and pushed won't achieve the same image quality as the new M will, at least for me. Except I like it grainy. That is my conclusion and that is the main reason for me waiting for the new M. Beside there are lots of goodies delivered by the latest M that I appreciate anyhow, like the LVF option etc. So my advice is: if you can afford keep your M9 since it is the first Leica RF with FF sensor which will be serviced as long as the M-E will be offered by Leica, and probably beyond. This will be a couple of years of fun. Beyond that it is probably for most of us the first M that delivered the desired FF feeling in the digital age. And thus our heart sticks to it. So if you can keep your M9, keep it! Beyond it's a worthy backup if your new M fails. And the latter, the heart issue, probably could be one of the reasons why people are still arguing as long as they can't effort a new M without selling their beloved M9 or M9-P. This is accompanied by a reasonable decrease of prices for used M9, which I have observed. I am really looking forward to get my new M and perhaps don't have to wait until March next year, hopefully... Just as a reminder if you want to compare your M9 images with the M in "real" just go here. You will find images from Jonathan Slack that are really convincing and worth to play with in LR. Although I am currently on the waiting list I am really convinced by the image quality and last but not least of the dynamic range. I really want one!!! Yes I do! The only thing is I have to wait, and that takes my patience to the limits Hope you don't mind my poor English. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
algrove Posted November 26, 2013 Share #77 Posted November 26, 2013 Dario Well put from the heart. While I about ran out of time waiting for my first M, Sony offered the RX-1. Lovely FF 24MP fixed Zeiss lens. You should just take a trip to the US and get one like right now! I have decided since selling every M except one, my backup will be another Sony the a7r. I would never find it good for street use, but for landscape (my other love) it will be perfect and I can adapt R lenses to it since after about 15 months Leica cannot put out a simple piece of machined metal. Novoflex has had theirs out for months! The M is worth the wait, but in Germany since March, sounds like the wrong dealer. I can get an M in less than a week over here. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
leica lux Posted November 27, 2013 Share #78 Posted November 27, 2013 You should really look around, the new M is not as heavy back-ordered as it was 2 months ago.. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeicaMSeattle Posted December 3, 2013 Share #79 Posted December 3, 2013 I've kept the M9-P, M8.2, and sold off the M. The proceeds will be more than enough to purchase the Fuji X1-Pro. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
schmolinski Posted December 3, 2013 Share #80 Posted December 3, 2013 I bought yesterday not at Meister but in the same town. They already had two in stock black and silver, I chose black. But the crazy thing is it is still in the box... Charged the battery nothing else hahaha Thinking about selling it - stupid guy me. I am really afraid using it since I fell in love with my new old M3 But hold on... First of all I will take a photograph just in case I am selling it lol And many other questions raised: 1. What Lux lens to start with? 35, 50, 75 or even my 21mm lens? 2. Do I need the EFV from Oly or Leica? And which version, 2 or 4? 3. Do I need a flash since high speed sync works on all apertures set manually? hahaha great! 4. Do I need a multi grip? 5. Since I tried out for some days the sony a7r which performed brilliant at the 50mm upwards; does my new M outperform it in the wide angles? Or should I have kept the A7r? ... 10. What happens to my beloved M9? ... 9999. OMG what is wrong with me? 10000. How could I use all my wonderful M cameras at the same time? lol to be continued Or not ;-) Don't beat me, I am now a happy owner of the new M with a really ugly serial number...! But I am happy hahaha so happy I forget to use it. Instead of I am writing this pulp here. Will post an image of my holy triple here soon - cheers Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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