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APO Summicron 50/2 ASPH: Central veiling flare / fogging

pajamies

By pajamies
in Leica M Lenses

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ferdinand

ferdinand

Posted
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Thank you ferdinand so what kind of repair does your paperwork refer to if i may ask?

 

Notwendige Arbeiten - required work

 

Eingangsprüfung - receiving inspection

Wird zur Prüfung in die QS gegeben - transfer to QC for inspection

Fokussierung instandsetzen - repair of focus

Optik Reflexe - reflexion of the optic

Gesamtabstimmung - overall tests

 

That's it :)

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Pobble

Pobble

Posted
Posted

I noticed similar flare problems several years ago with two "traditional" six-bit coded Summicron 50 mm lenses. Zeiss 50 mm Planars were somewhat more resistant - perhaps reflecting different coating.

 

the problem thus does not appear to be restricted to the 50 Apo Summicron. I personally have not had any flare problems with my Apo 50 over the past 8 months in locations varying from the high Alps to foggy islands, as well as in circumstances where intense direct light sources were in the image.

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dewilde

dewilde

Posted
Posted

I know 3 people not including me that have this lens.. They all have some degree of flare, none of them have set their lenses in for repair.

 

My lens had the worst flare I've ever seen.. Completely unusable with the sun backlighting my subject.. Either it would be completely washed out with rainbow shards, or it would just be a big mess of a glowing ball. Other times when the flare wasn't to awful it would create a line on the side of my image about 1/10 of the image that wasn't flared.. Very distracting.

 

I sent the lens in, it was gone for well over a month, and when it returned, it really wasn't much better. Still flares quite a bit, and tons of what you would call ghosting or veiling flare. Haven't seen the rainbow type shards yet, and haven't seen the non flared 1/10th of the image band anymore... But still really unusable in backlit situations..

 

LEICA confirms that they've fixed the lens, and that it is now up to specs.. If this is what they call up to specs, then I'm shocked that they claim they make the best lenses in the world.. Luxury maybe, but best performing, not at all..

 

Mind you, I do like the lens when it's not flaring.. It has what I'm looking for in a 50mm, I just wish the flare wasn't ruining images I'd otherwise be able to take with almost any other 50mm lens I own, or have owned (and that's pretty much all of them).

 

 

So anyone else get their lens back and are disappointed with the results?

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dewilde

dewilde

Posted
Posted
I noticed similar flare problems several years ago with two "traditional" six-bit coded Summicron 50 mm lenses. Zeiss 50 mm Planars were somewhat more resistant - perhaps reflecting different coating.

 

the problem thus does not appear to be restricted to the 50 Apo Summicron. I personally have not had any flare problems with my Apo 50 over the past 8 months in locations varying from the high Alps to foggy islands, as well as in circumstances where intense direct light sources were in the image.

 

I have some flare issues with my 75APO and 90APO, but nothing really worth mentioning.. It's rarely a problem on those two lenses. The 50 Summicron pre-APO did it once or twice as well, but again nothing to troublesome.. The 50Noctilux does it once and a while (more frequently then the 75/90APO), but stopping down fixes it really quick. I haven't had issues with the 50summilux-asph at all, nor have I had problems with the 35lux-asph non-fle or 35cron-asph (well if I REALLY TRY). I also don't have any problems whatsoever with the 21SEM, 28summicron (which a lot of people complain about), and the 75Summarit also no issues.

I won't get into the older lenses that are out of production, as they're not really worth mentioning.. But I will say that all the ZM lenses I've used have been almost all flare proof (used them all), and a lot of Canon / Nikon / Sony (I have professional gear in all three systems) don't give me as much problems as the 50APO (even canon's 1.2L lenses aren't as troublesome).

 

Really just the 50APO gives me problems, even when I try to avoid the flare.. I mean honestly I can put the camera into video mode and walk around the model and the lens will flare in varying degrees of bad to much worse.. The only time I'm fine is with the sun on my back.. And then the lens gets real nice (well most of the time).

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dewilde

dewilde

Posted
Posted
Welcome to the forum. I would demand a new lens if i were you. Your lens is under guarantee so you don't have to accept mediocre repairs in any way.

 

Thanks for the welcome, I have another ID from years ago, but I forget what it is :D

 

They're more then willing to do so.. But:

 

A) No new lenses right now!

B) I want to keep my serial number, as I have my whole box set.

C) They actually gave me a new lens, just retained my serial number, so that's pretty fair of them. Basically took a new lens apart and put my ring into it.

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dewilde

dewilde

Posted
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So it is not a mediocre repair but a mediocre new lens Leica's offering you? I don't regret postponing my order then. Thanks for sharing anyway.

 

Well, Leica was unwilling to send me a fresh new full box set..

My options were:

 

1) A new lens with new serial #, but no documentation box etc. to accompany it.

2) A new lens but retaining my old lenses ring which held the serial number on it.

 

So you're welcome to call it what you will.. I also agree though, that's not the way it should have been handled.

 

I think for the extra $$ the box costs, they should have sent me a brand new box set, but they didn't.. And I'd have been fine with it, if the lens were back and in PERFECT working order, but the lens hood doesn't feel the same, not as nice now, and the lens is still flaring like crazy.. A much NICER and more pleasing flare, but flare that does cause me to want to delete images, and that's just due to its unpredictable nature.

 

I was even willing to return my old box set (even though that shouldn't have been necessary).. But again, I'm not upset about that.. And I'm not upset at all anymore really, I just wish the lens performed better for the price I paid, and the subsequent month it spent in repair.

 

I'm not even going to get into the frame line alignment issue, or the fact that my M240 seems to have knocked itself out of focus for the second time when I haven't or dismounted the lens since it was repaired.

 

Mind you, Leica this time around, is trying to help me out. I'll update when I have a solid resolution to my problems.

 

As a side note, the funny thing is, I used their prototype lens ages ago (a week or so before Ming put up his first blog post about the lens), and that prototype lens had NO problems whatsoever.. I just looked back at the files, and I couldn't get it to flare period, and the day I used it, it was SUNNY.

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marknorton

marknorton

Posted
Posted

My lens is back from repair, difficult to detect what's been done to it. For those with an original lens, is the outside of the focussing helicoid at the back of the lens blackened? I hadn't noticed it before.

 

At one level, the lens is working well, super-sharp images when tripod mounted and focussed using LV. The weather is not going to cause any flare problems, however some rather crude test shots of a naked light bulb showed some mild ghosting which the Summilux does not.

 

I wrote here that I was disappointed with the lens when I first got it. I still am and wish I hadn't bought it.

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dewilde

dewilde

Posted
Posted
My lens is back from repair, difficult to detect what's been done to it. For those with an original lens, is the outside of the focussing helicoid at the back of the lens blackened? I hadn't noticed it before.

 

At one level, the lens is working well, super-sharp images when tripod mounted and focussed using LV. The weather is not going to cause any flare problems, however some rather crude test shots of a naked light bulb showed some mild ghosting which the Summilux does not.

 

I wrote here that I was disappointed with the lens when I first got it. I still am and wish I hadn't bought it.

 

 

I think a lot of people feel this way. I think when the lens is performing well (no flare is creeping into shots) it's an amazing lens, hands down, the best I've used for the look I like to achieve. However, with flare being such a dominant problem, it really makes the lens far less worth the money then a 50/2 ZM Planar... And honestly, I like a little bit of flare, but come on it cannot dominate and destroy your images.

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FPB

FPB

Posted
Posted
My lens is back from repair, difficult to detect what's been done to it. For those with an original lens, is the outside of the focussing helicoid at the back of the lens blackened? I hadn't noticed it before.....

 

Yes, it is.

For me it looks like only a very limited number of people at Leica are able to reliable put this lens together. As far as I have heard, only very very few new lenses leave the factory now.

But still no problems with mine.....:)

 

Bill

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dewilde

dewilde

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Posted
Yes, it is.

For me it looks like only a very limited number of people at Leica are able to reliable put this lens together. As far as I have heard, only very very few new lenses leave the factory now.

But still no problems with mine.....:)

 

Bill

 

 

Samples in direct sunlight would be most welcome!!

Basically try to make the lens flare.. I don't really have a basis as to HOW my lens should be performing..

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