scott kirkpatrick Posted March 2, 2013 Share #41 Â Posted March 2, 2013 Advertisement (gone after registration) I still don't understand how these vignetting corrections work as vignetting differ with the apperture set on the lens. Â It's true that vignetting is usually strongest at the two or three widest apertures, but when I have checked the behavior of the M9's and M8's later firmwares, I saw only a single, aperture-independent correction for each lens or lens type. The way you do this is set the lens aperture at some middle value, shoot a white panel, then cover the "blue dot" and shoot again. Covering the blue dot makes the camera think that the lens is Very Wide Open. Â If you look at the published vignetting curves, there is an aperture-independent correction, plus an extra drop at the edges for the widest apertures. Maybe the extra drop is considered to just add some emphasis to the framing of the shot. Â scott Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted March 2, 2013 Posted March 2, 2013 Hi scott kirkpatrick, Take a look here Was the M Ready?. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
scott kirkpatrick Posted March 2, 2013 Share #42 Â Posted March 2, 2013 Where is the firmware update for the Monochrom...? During Photokina, Leica told me that a new FW will be issued before the end of autumn... Â And by the way, when will Leica finish the M9 firmware? Remember that the 1.96 firmware release had so many new bugs accompanying its new features that many have rolled back to 1.76. But firmware skills are probably ultra-critical for Leica, so I don't hope for improvements affecting previous models until the M is shipping in volume. Â scott Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjh Posted March 2, 2013 Share #43  Posted March 2, 2013 Where is the firmware update for the Monochrom...? Leica (or Jenoptik) are still working on it. It will come, but I don’t know when. I am less sure about another firmware update for the M9, but we will see. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pedaes Posted March 2, 2013 Share #44  Posted March 2, 2013 Leica (or Jenoptik) are still working on it. It will come, but I don’t know when. I am less sure about another firmware update for the M9, but we will see.  Does this mean M-E cameras also? If what we are told is true, any M-E updates would surely also apply to M9. Not very good news for potential M-E buyer. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
rramesh Posted March 3, 2013 Share #45 Â Posted March 3, 2013 Reading this thread, I am surprised why so many of us are deeply concerned about having to apply a firmware (software) update. These days with electronics, almost any piece of hardware necessitates a patch being applied after purchase as the bug reporting/patch release process is a parallel activity to manufacturing. Â A production run takes time and as many have pointed out, it takes 3-4 weeks before a product is boxed till the time it arrives in the shop or your home. You therefore cannot easily apply a software patch after product is in the box. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
marknorton Posted March 3, 2013 Author Share #46 Â Posted March 3, 2013 We have no way of knowing when the few cameras which have been shipped were loaded with their final firmware but I expect it was much more recently than the 3-4 weeks ago you suggest. But in the same way the M8 was shipped earlier than expected in 2007 with a raft of unresolved problems, I do wonder whether the M has been shipped in miniscule numbers - supposedly about 3 days manufacturing - for reasons other than "it's ready, sort of". Â I'm hoping my camera which I collect tomorrow will be on the original firmware so that I can test the vignetting correction of the lenses listed - since I have them all, though did I see the 21mm Elmarit-M ASPH is not in the list? - and compare the results after the firmware upgrade. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Photogeek Posted March 3, 2013 Share #47 Â Posted March 3, 2013 Advertisement (gone after registration) Only the latest M9 firmware handles the new 50 AA. But i don't want to update because of the bugs ! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest tanks Posted March 4, 2013 Share #48 Â Posted March 4, 2013 And is there any reason to accept it now? Why would Leica rush out the camera on 28 February when they could just as well have taken their time to ship it with the latest firmware installed? 31 March is still four weeks away after all. Â Depends whether their accounting method is accrual or cash. If it is the cash method then with Net 15 or Net 30 billing the income will not be counted unless it is received. Accrual of course, is when it is invoiced. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
photomeme Posted March 4, 2013 Share #49 Â Posted March 4, 2013 Where is the firmware update for the Monochrom...? During Photokina, Leica told me that a new FW will be issued before the end of autumn... Â It's pretty bad. Â Much common code with the M9 firmware. Â Last M9 firmware introduced bugs that can cause the camera to jam up during both soft and discreet mode. MM has that firmware, or the broken common code. Â No fix since the release date! Over six months now, I think? Â This is about the worst thing I've seen from Leica since the M8 IR disaster. Not only the problem itself, but the failure to correct it. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
marknorton Posted March 4, 2013 Author Share #50 Â Posted March 4, 2013 I agree, as far as we know, Jenoptik developed the firmware for the M9 where the new camera is being done in-house. I would hate to think Jenoptik are dragging their feet as they are less involved. Feels like a re-run of the Imacon/DMR situation. Â The M9 fixes are well overdue. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Olsen Posted March 4, 2013 Share #51  Posted March 4, 2013 First of all: FW updates - even before a major volume of a camera is out on the market is quite common on most pro cameras. Both Canon 1Ds II and III had such updates at a very early stage after launch. While updates on cheaper consumer models are practically never.  That Leica decides to update M240 now is totally unproblematic, Rather it shows how keen Leica is to make M240 a success. So far, so good!  The area that this FW update targets - vignetting with wide angle lenses - is indeed an issue that should have had far more attention from the beta testers that have now presented their 'findings'. I find it 'a bit' worrisome that we have not seen thorough tests of the new M240 and how it performs with a, say, Voigtländer 15 Super Wide or a Leica WATE. In all from vignetting and corner sharpness to any Italian Flag tendencies. Wide angles and light fall off/corner sharpness is the technology edge of any digital camera. Not how it performs with a 50 mm aspherical.  M240 with super wides: When will we see that tested? Is it only me being interested...? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaapv Posted March 4, 2013 Share #52 Â Posted March 4, 2013 Leica will not test it with third-party lenses, nor the beta-testers, or if they do, no design or firmware changes will result. Why should they? So the WATE is, according to the beta testers, fine on the M, the SuperElmar 18 presumably as well, and all CV and Zeiss offerings will be a bit of a gamble. It is up to the users to develop solutions, if needed. Nowadays that is extremely simple, fortunately, many major raw developers offer flat field correction facilities. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jonoslack Posted March 4, 2013 Share #53  Posted March 4, 2013 The area that this FW update targets - vignetting with wide angle lenses - is indeed an issue that should have had far more attention from the beta testers that have now presented their 'findings'. I find it 'a bit' worrisome that we have not seen thorough tests of the new M240 and how it performs with a, say, Voigtländer 15 Super Wide or a Leica WATE. In all from vignetting and corner sharpness to any Italian Flag tendencies. Wide angles and light fall off/corner sharpness is the technology edge of any digital camera. Not how it performs with a 50 mm aspherical.  M240 with super wides: When will we see that tested? Is it only me being interested...?  Hi there Olsen As a tester, the thing that was immediately obvious was how much better the M was than the M9 with respect to colour shift and vignetting - and in the early days there was no vignetting correction applied (and it was still very good).  For example - I took a bunch of pictures with the WATE incorrectly coded as a 135 Apo Telyt (don't ask how:confused:). With the M9 that would have been a catastrophe - with the M I didn't even notice until I looked at the exif information. So - to answer your question - the WATE performs flawlessly with the M.  Lens corrections were addressed much later in the process because they are so much less critical - the result being a couple of oversights on release - but firmware upgrades over the next few weeks should sort these.  I did actually test it with the CV15 - and there is some red vignetting - but much less colour variation than there is with the M9 - and that's with no correction at all.  Personally, while testing, I was using: WATE 15 CV 21 Elmarit pre-asp 24 'lux 28 'cron R 21-35  I found all of these lenses performed admirably, with the exception of the CV15 - which was quite fixable in post processing. As Jaap points out - Leica are not going to spend expensive programming time making profiles for 3rd party lenses (nor should they).  Also worth mentioning that with the M9, firmware updates were done by Jenoptik, making it much more difficult for Leica to control. With the M they're being done in house - so things should happen more quickly. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
hoppyman Posted March 4, 2013 Share #54 Â Posted March 4, 2013 The camera guesstimates the aperture by comparing ambient light with the actual measurement. The corrections on the M should be less drastic than on the M9 due to the different design of the microlenses. However on the M9 at least the correction applied does not vary according to the aperture used. The effect of that correction will vary of course. The image is corrected for best case (lens stopped down has less or no vignetting) not worst case. Otherwise the image could be over-corrected (for example the corners actually too cyan or too light or whatever). I agree that the amount of correction should in any case be much less. At least that is what the early information suggests. Â I don't know how the correction works yet on my M, I don't think that it has left Germany yet ;-) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
guidomo Posted March 4, 2013 Share #55 Â Posted March 4, 2013 Would there be a chance the 21/2.8 Asph will not have the problems of the non-Asph? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
marknorton Posted March 5, 2013 Author Share #56 Â Posted March 5, 2013 The old 21 and 24mm Elmarits were similar, so I expect they just missed the 21 off the list. The vignetting correction does not seek to correct the natural vignetting of the lens which is down to the optical design. Rather, it's there to correct the vignetting added by the sensor which the sensor design seeks to minimise in the first place. From what Jono is saying, the vignetting correction which is applied will be a lighter touch than that in the M8 and M9. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
macjonny1 Posted March 5, 2013 Share #57 Â Posted March 5, 2013 My Monochrom still has beta firmware Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
John McMaster Posted March 5, 2013 Share #58 Â Posted March 5, 2013 Indeed, and still does not know about the 50AA that it was announced with... Â john Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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